quote:Originally posted by stephbarton: As for Terror Firma, I'm thinking that that is something the new Legion creative team wants to touch on, and that's why they just haven't been jettisoned, so the new team can deal with Projectra's feelings towards them. But I do hope that was sarcasm at the end and not the Legion being complete idiots.
I don't think it was sarcasm; I think what's going on is that Waid decided to simplify matters and assign all the evil stuff Terror Firma did to Elysion, whether that made sense or not, and Bedard is just building on that. We may actually have already heard all we're going to hear about that.
The new writer, though... whoever it is is no doubt going to bring his own ideas to the table. Let's say just for the sake of argument that it's Jim Shooter. Is Shooter really going to want to deal with Terror Firma at all? Is he going to want to write the Legionnaires in any way other than how he's always written them? I wonder.
posted
Well, no one from Terra Firma is in the promo images, and those seem to have been directed by the new writer. So, there may not be much to worry about.
As an aside, I find Terra firma much less culpable than the legion itself. Mr. Waid did actually reveal that the group was under Lemnos' influence during their time together. I don't doubt that someone with the power to make everyone on Colu forget their higher brain functions could also make his thugs forget that what they're doing is wrong. The legion, on the other hand, let one of their own destroy a planet. Who was manipulating them? Did someone "plant an idea in their head?" Is that passive influence more of an excuse than what Lemnos could do? If anything, this legion might object to Terra Firma membership because they have not been shown to be so consciously callous.
From: Portland, Oregon | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
Projectra isn't alone. I doubt Saturn Girl, Lightning Lad and Timber Wolf would vote the ex-Terror Firmas in after seeing them stand by and watch as an innocent kid was killed on Rimworld 19. Lemnos influence, or not.
Brainy had no problem getting the much more formidable Wanderers to leave town. The ex-Terror Firmas are a piece of cake, and Sun Boy need never know the truth.
From: Reimagined Trom | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Awkward Pause Boy: The legion, on the other hand, let one of their own destroy a planet. Who was manipulating them? Did someone "plant an idea in their head?" Is that passive influence more of an excuse than what Lemnos could do? If anything, this legion might object to Terra Firma membership because they have not been shown to be so consciously callous.
I'd do the same in a hummingbird's heartbeat given the stakes. The U.P. doesn't give a damn, anyway, now that Brainy handed them a scapegoat (Mekt). The Legion is a product of its morally relativistic society, for better or worse -- not black & white heroes who were born and bred in a vacuum or had older super-heroes to teach them the rules. Their de-idealization and moral imperfection is part of modern super-hero storytelling, which I mostly accept. It makes for interesting debates, at least.
Lest we forget, the original Legion began killing villains 1962ish, and the 'toon Legion is guilty of slaughtering the (sentient, though not sapient) furries that turned into monsters in the Subs episode. Tenzil actually ate one of them alive. If he did that in the regular comic book, there'd be a furor here over the fate of the poor critters!
From: Reimagined Trom | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
so...Brainy found evidence that Mekt had the idea of destroying the Dominator homeworld, and had Jeyra project that idea into Cos' head... i'm confused. the Dominator homeworld wasn't destroyed. that's just what it looked like. Cos really just transported it to the Phantom Zone right? so... is Brainy lying about the evidence to convince Tenzil to drop the charges of Cos? or did all of that happen but Cos somehow in his wisdom took that thought and found another solution...? someone help me here.
-------------------- Gorilla Nebula
From: san francisco | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Gorilla Nebula: so...Brainy found evidence that Mekt had the idea of destroying the Dominator homeworld, and had Jeyra project that idea into Cos' head... i'm confused. the Dominator homeworld wasn't destroyed. that's just what it looked like. Cos really just transported it to the Phantom Zone right? so... is Brainy lying about the evidence to convince Tenzil to drop the charges of Cos? or did all of that happen but Cos somehow in his wisdom took that thought and found another solution...? someone help me here.
It's hard to say. I'm comfortable saying that Brainy is feeding a story to Tenzil to get Cos off the hook; that stuff about Jeyra and Mekt being behind the destruction of the Dominion homeworld is all just wind from a monkey's backside. After all, we know what happened to the Dominion homeworld and it has more to do with a conspiracy of Dream Girl, Dream Boy, Cos, Brainy, Phantom Girl and, I believe, Mon-El than it does with anything the Wanderers were up to.
But that still doesn't explain what was going on on Winath. Brainwashing Lightning Lad's parents is pretty ruthless even for Brainy, but what would be the Wanderers' motive for doing it? I do think Brainy, or at least Dream Girl, had some idea what was going on on Winath, or they never would have sent a Legion team there. After all, Cos was never going to be there.
posted
I'm wondering if maybe Brainy's not all Brainy. We know that he's harboring some remnant of Dream Girl as an accidental result of his failed resurrection. What if some, or maybe a lot, of Lemnos is in there, too. That could be used to explain Brainy's actions if it's shown he is responsible for framing Mekt on Winath. Remember, both bodies disappeared.
quote:Originally posted by Tromium: ... The Legion is a product of its morally relativistic society, for better or worse -- not black & white heroes who were born and bred in a vacuum or had older super-heroes to teach them the rules. Their de-idealization and moral imperfection is part of modern super-hero storytelling, which I mostly accept. It makes for interesting debates, at least.
Lest we forget, the original Legion began killing villains 1962ish, and the 'toon Legion is guilty of slaughtering the (sentient, though not sapient) furries that turned into monsters in the Subs episode. Tenzil actually ate one of them alive. If he did that in the regular comic book, there'd be a furor here over the fate of the poor critters!
That there can be debate on the acceptability of genocide is beyond me. And as far as Legion tradition, I prefer LSH #300, where it was an alternate, undesirable universe if the Legionnaires would take the offensive in an interstellar war and kill under the Legion banner. Some writers get it right, some writers get it wrong. In any case, it doesn't sound like we are gong to convince one another. I expect you'll have no problems with the Legion maintaining close ties to Terra Firma. Surely a writer can come up with stakes for them that are similar to a defeated planet and speculation about the planet's future. It's all the same to me.
From: Portland, Oregon | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by kenaustin: I'm wondering if maybe Brainy's not all Brainy. We know that he's harboring some remnant of Dream Girl as an accidental result of his failed resurrection. What if some, or maybe a lot, of Lemnos is in there, too. That could be used to explain Brainy's actions if it's shown he is responsible for framing Mekt on Winath. Remember, both bodies disappeared.
Now there's a good idea. I could totally see that happening.
posted
That is an interesting idea except that I don't think that Lemno's body actually disappeared. I think that Waid just never made it clear what happened to Lemnos' body nor did he care to explain why the UP never made a big stink about Lemnos (not) being brought to justice.
-------------------- So what.
From: Harrisburg, PA | Registered: Apr 2006
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posted
Read this issue while I was on vacation (ahhh, vacation...). I too am left confused and a little underwhelmed by where all this is going. Why would the Wanderer's hoodoo the Winathians to attack their own leader? Why would Brainy frame the Wanderers for setting up a plot against their own leader and expect anyone to believe it? I DO think I get the idea of framing Mekt and the Wanderers for the "genocide" of the Dominion. Brainy wants to get rid of them AND deter anyone from knowing the truth about the Dominion's location AND clear the Legion of genocide. So, that part makes sense. But the whole affair on Winath seems pointless and inexplicable. Oh, but it sure was fun, though! Great dialogue and great character moments there. It would be nice to have a Legion comic where the overall plot AND the character moments made sense and fired at the same time, though. I am hoping Messrs. Bedard and Calero can clear things up a little before they are done.
-------------------- ...but you don't have a moment where you're sitting there staring at a table full of twenty-five characters with little name signs that say, "Hi, my superpower is confusing you!"
From: Chicago, IL | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by duck458: That is an interesting idea except that I don't think that Lemno's body actually disappeared...
I re-read the issue and I stand corrected. Lemnos' body didn't disappear during the experiment, it was still on the ship after Dream Girl's body was gone. Brainy did use his mind as a filter for the info/energy that was being drawn from Lemnos, so some transference could have occurred.
I got the impression that the Wanderers Coluan and that dodgy telepath were behind the badness - maybe they've been plotting for a long time as we know she was an agent of the robot revolution from issue 19 - is she and l'il brainy using Mekt as their fall guy?
Wheels within wheels
-------------------- "Tempus Fugitive" the final part of the Adventures of Dream Boy series, set in the Three-Boot Universe. Read it only in the Bits o' Legionnaire Business Forum.
From: here, more often than not | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
There are a few of dangling plot threads here the size of modest cosmic strings:
1) What the nass happened to Lemnos?
2) What was Jeyra doing with the robot revolution and murdering people if she was a Wanderer?
3) What was the sprocking point of the events on Winath in the last 2 issues?
Arrrrghh!!!
-------------------- ...but you don't have a moment where you're sitting there staring at a table full of twenty-five characters with little name signs that say, "Hi, my superpower is confusing you!"
From: Chicago, IL | Registered: Jul 2004
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