posted
Don WAS very sensitive and caring. He died trying to save a small child during the Crisis. Never mind that he had already saved many others.
-------------------- "Hey Jim! Get Mon out of the Zone!! And...when do we get Condo back?"
From: Paragon City on patrol | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
I won't spoil the constant party any more in these Titans threads, then.
And you apparently won't admit that flinging about words like "sucked" and "hate" can get pretty intense. As well as offensive.
These threads always spill over, Lash LaRue. Nonetheless, if I was reacting here to your tone in other places -- as I suspect I may have -- I tender regrets.
[ September 07, 2004, 07:33 PM: Message edited by: GoldenGreyEagle ]
From: Starhaven Consulate, City of Angels | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
I'll tell you what, Grey... since *I'M* not allowed to be vocal about something *I* don't like... apparently that's a right reserved for others... then I'll only post about the Titans stuff I *do* like.
Just remember I never ONCE tried to deny you YOUR right to dislike Keith Giffen and Tom and Mary Bierbaum and etc etc etc etc.
posted
It's been a few days, and I was dealing with other matters (car-crash related) at the time, but I wanted to reply:
I never wanted to shut Lash or anybody off, or "deny their right" to express views as they wish ... as if that were even possible. I don't know where you're picking that up.
I took issue with how some views were expressed. I don't like anybody flinging about "sucked," etc. That, to me, is for those who don't know or can't express why they have certain opinions. Lash isn't one of them!
It may be a release, a letting off of steam, to put matters that way, but how many are going to follow your arguments? (If any. Not everything has to come to a point, true enough.)
I know that behind a thread entitled "Azrael SUCKED!" by MLLASH lies, most likely, some interesting reading, to say the least. Would a newcomer know that? That Titans or new Legion fan might want to resist getting to know you.
I haven't led with my angry verbal fist about TMK. Not in thread titles, anyway. I've given reasons. So have you, about other things. Maybe that's all more boring than "this sucks!", but it's more congenial in the long run.
Frederick Pohl's famous "law" was that "Nothing is so good that somebody, somewhere, will not hate it, and vice versa." We'd all do well, especially among friends, to remember that before the epithets fly.
From: Starhaven Consulate, City of Angels | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Hmmm, trying to avoid the budding flame war...
I really felt Lilith got the shaft. Gnarrk was an interesting character, the teenage caveman who becomes a pacifist, until later finding balance between necessary action and violence. They made an interesting couple, both sort of strangers in a strange land (he because he was a caveman, her because she had no real past and strange powers for no reason)
The problem was, whoever wrote the 70s Teen Titans revival seemed to have no clue as to who Gnarrk was. He was made into a jealous, overprotective, overviolent nasty guy. This wasn't the same character Lilith had fallen for in the 60s issues.
Then Wolfman retcons Gnarrk out of existence (he only lived a day and yet Lilith inexplicably falls for him!) and shuffles Lilith off to live with the gods. And then when Crisis hits and that story can't have happened, he brings her back, has her inexplicably fall for another guy (the mysterious and never explained Azrael).
Now Azrael was not the best character ever invented, partially because after he came on scene Wolfman never did anything with him. He seemed to exist - much like the Greek Titans had - as a way to explain why Lilith wasn't around.
I never felt Wolfman understood Lilith. I generally thought he wrote her poorly, and the stuff he did with her was - in combination with the 70s revival which also saw her out of character - the reason why she became such a marginal character in Titan's lore.
Wolfman ultimately retconned Lilith into a relationship with Don Hall, but it always seemed like an ill-fit to me. I never bought that Lilith would have had much interest in Don based on their interactions int he 60s issues. It was just one more way to take Gnarrk out of the Titans, but it also took away a lot of Lilith's associated stories, making her a weaker character for it.
quote:Originally posted by GoldenGreyEagle: I never wanted to shut Lash or anybody off, or "deny their right" to express views as they wish ... as if that were even possible. I don't know where you're picking that up.
Grey, you quite clearly stated that you would no longer post to the TITANS threads because of what I was saying about Azrael. "I won't spoil the constant party any more in these Titans threads, then." To me, that says: "If you continue posting your negative opinion of Azrael, I am going to leave this forum."
Therefore, I stopped posting about things I didn't like in Titans lore so as not to chase you off. But I wasn't at all pleased about it.
Amentep, no flame war here. Grey & I've known each other for years. Sometimes we torque each other off. No biggie.
posted
{ Grey, you quite clearly stated that you would no longer post to the TITANS threads because of what I was saying about Azrael. "I won't spoil the constant party any more in these Titans threads, then." }
I'm sorry that I was a bit opaque, and that this encouraged you to make a connection that wasn't there. What came immediately before this was that you'd wanted me to lighten up, after I suggested -- knowing its irony myself, by the way -- that you try doing so yourself, pulling back from the use of "sucked," etc.
I've been often said around here to not "get" the spirit of things, back to LardLad (who does exist) famously describing me on the old DCMBs as a pompous ass. Well, yeah, sometimes I don't get the whimsy, and sometimes I am one.
Sometimes, as well, though, what comes across as a comment of mine about method -- or about my not being able to "get down" enough -- is taken as a personal criticism. It's not meant that way.
I wish I could plunge in more. I would like to take part in tag-team threads with abandon, or have quick-witted one-line banter, or follow more of the alternate-take histories of characters, like your epic depiction of Tenzil Kem and friends. I find it hard to do so. Maybe I analyze too much to ever thus let loose.
I'd like to be as free and easy about it as you are, Mike. I've envied you and others for years about how easily it comes to you. If some of that comes off, mistakenly, as my disliking anyone expressing his or her opinion (as I fear has also happened with Miss Terious), it's my failing, to be added to an extremely long list.
Torquing each other off comes most often from our dropping stitches in Net talk, where we don't have any way to show glosses of attitude, except (partially, and not enough) with smilies.
I suppose, though, I felt you'd think better of me than that I was blaming you for driving me off. And would realize that I was giving up on the Titans banter not so much from anything you were doing, but from what I seem to be forever unable -- or too comics-lore-challenged -- to do.
I shouldn't have assumed that. So you deserve an apology and get my being wordy about it, yet again {rueful smile}
From: Starhaven Consulate, City of Angels | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
The thing about some people... is they ALWAYS pick the wrong guy, no matter HOW psychic they claim to be.
Lillith can be counted on to pick the guy most likely to die. The poor girl didn't even realize the Superman android was NOT A HUMAN BEING (why is that completely ridiculous on its face? imagine Saturn Girl in a similar position). Her taste in men (Gnaark, Dove, Azrael) is understandable. She probably had sex with Joto off-panel during Jurgen's "teen titans".
Now if I were to create a go-go dancing psychic, she would have had MUCH more interesting sexploits: Speedy (just to say: 'Yawn, is this it?'), Cyborg ('oh, Victor, you're still a man where it counts'), Tempest ('oh, were you in here? i just couldn't resist jumping in naked, i love the way the water feels on my...'), Dove II ('Don never made me feel like this, Dawn'), and a Hawk/Dove threesome (either Dove).
From: Lauderhill, FL | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged |
Hyperpath: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic | Subscribe To Topic
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
