quote:Originally posted by matlock: I don't know, are casual fans going to want to get involved in a series which is tied to continuity that's been inactive for many years (and only sporadically in print in trades?) In a title which has always had a knock against it as being difficult to catch on to? I'm not totally sure. It's one thing to catch readers eyes in a more well established series (Action) with a creative team that's well established and reasonably popular and another to start yet another new Legion title from scratch.
I really do think it could be done, considering JSA with its even more challeged continuity which hadn't had an own series for many many years got a lot of readers hooked and is still running rather successfully. They did some very helpful Secret Files issues in 1999 and 2001 - the Legion would have to do this as well - and I still believe that a small inexpensive Reprint of the "Secrets of the Legion" Threeparter would help many people jump on the bandwagon quite easily. Back when I was a kid, that Threeparter told me everything I had to know, and I went from there, though I guess I had read some Legion stories before but not many... memory is hazy...
So yes, done with the right fervor, you could drag people into the Legion.
As for Francis, I really appreciate your work on the Legion, I was astonished how much I grew to love it so quickly. Hopefully you guys will be able to pull of the current storyline in some satisfactory way. I'll be looking out for your next work!
From: Bamberg, Germany | Registered: Feb 2007
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quote:Originally posted by matlock: I don't know, are casual fans going to want to get involved in a series which is tied to continuity that's been inactive for many years (and only sporadically in print in trades?) In a title which has always had a knock against it as being difficult to catch on to? I'm not totally sure. It's one thing to catch readers eyes in a more well established series (Action) with a creative team that's well established and reasonably popular and another to start yet another new Legion title from scratch.
This is exactly how I feel. Reviving the 80s Legion isn't going to attract any new readers.
-------------------- Tom Strong, on nostalgia: "I suppose it's a ready substitute for genuine feeling." - Tom Strong #6, Alan Moore
From: Calgary, Alberta | Registered: May 2008
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Arm Fall Off Boy
Now starring in his own DC Comic, September 2011!
posted
Thanks, Francis, for some great work. Maybe one day we'll see YOU back on the Legion.
Question: Did you find it as daunting a job as many others with so many characters, or did you enjoy the challenge?
-------------------- Long Live all them Legions!
From: North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2008
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quote:Originally posted by fjm: hey folks I just wanted to chime in and say thanks for your support of the book. It's really sad to see it go but I'm sure DC has some plans for it's future.
Given time, the Shooter-Manapul teamwork on the Legion will be reappraised for what it was: a genuine highlight of the Legion myth. I can assure it is already among my top 10 LSH runs.
thanks!
From: Brasil | Registered: May 2008
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quote:Originally posted by fjm: hey folks I just wanted to chime in and say thanks for your support of the book. It's really sad to see it go but I'm sure DC has some plans for it's future.
Given time, the Shooter-Manapul teamwork on the Legion will be reappraised for what it was: a genuine highlight of the Legion myth. I can assure it is already among my top 10 LSH runs.
thanks!
I need to second Ricardo's comments. Frances, your run on Legion was a true highlight for the series.
Registered: Oct 2003
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quote:Originally posted by CJ Taylor: So we've got long time fans emailing DC telling them how much they love the Legion. People expressing a desire to see them in a series, and John's recent arc in Action selling more than the current series does.
DC would have to be crazy not to consider the current series a pale comparison. It may not be a total failure, but it's not the revenue generater that they want. Between the fans and the sales, they have to consider a more classic Legion a viable success.
The problem is there there is no real evidence to suggest that readers will want to purchase a book with the Lightning Saga Legion. Look at the Action sales figures from CBGxtra.com:
So that shows there was a slight bump in sales during the Action Legion issues. But it wasn't that big, and probably was attributable to Legion fans picking up the books (or the hype for those issues, which were heavily promoted by DC).
I will admit that I cannot explain why Action sales dropped off so precipitously from the pre-Legion issues once the Legion issues ended, but it could have to do with Superman fans (as opposed to Legion fans) being turned away from their own book by such a long Legion story. Or there might be other factors -- Countdown turned off a lot of DC readers, Trinity (another book with Superman) was on the horizon, etc. However, in terms of proving a large number of readers would pay for a Superman/Legion book -- over a pure Superman book -- the evidence of a large sales bump just isn't there. At most, you're talking a few thousand more people reading the Action Legion issues than the non-Legion Action issues.
So you have the Superman/LSH selling about 55,000 in Action compared to about 25,000 buying the threeboot books. But what does that mean for an ongoing series? I see three options.
First, the Legion could become a supporting player to Superman in Action on a regular basis. It is possible that the numbers will remain at the Action levels, but nobody is really sure that will happen once the novelty of the Superman LSH wears off. Moreover, if numbers drop from the Superman-only levels, DC will probably have to dump Legion.
Second, DC could launch a new book with Superman and the Legion (again with the Legion being a supporting player). But can the market bear another Superman book? Tangent has been selling just over 20,000, actually less than the threeboot Legion book.
Third, DC could launch a book with the Action Legion, with only occasional appearances by Superman. However, no Legion standalone book has been successful on an ongoing basis.
Obviously, any new book is likely to get some boost over the current book's numbers based on some crossover from Lo3W. But there is no guarantee that people who are picking up Lo3W are going to keep buying a Legion book that is unconnected with the giant crossover event. After six months, the "new" Legion book could very well be at the same sales level as the threeboot.
DC is making a huge leap of faith here, and I don't fully understand it. Unless the threeboot book is actually losing money, which I find unlikely given that lower-selling books are still on the market, there really is no reason to cancel the threeboot yet. The one thing we know is that Legion fans are loyal. It could very well be that DC could launch a new Legion book alongside the threeboot and have both perform okay. It just seems premature to eliminate the threeboot and put all the eggs in the Action Legion basket when the Action Legion's success is not remotely assured.
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
While I do agree with your assessment, I think DC's been realising in the past few years that they have a success on their hand each time they "rebooted" a classic version of the character or team... Teen Titans, Hawkman, Green Lantern, JSA, and soon Barry Flash... All with Geoff Johns. It's no coincidence that DC could think the same thing is possible with the Legion after the Lightning Saga and the Supermand and the LSH réintroduced the 'Original' Legion.
It's risky, yes, but a relaunch may be more lucrative for DC at this point, even if it fails down the line.
-------------------- Ze Frainch Legion fan
From: Edinburgh, Scotland | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Thanks again for the kind words guys. The Legion was probably one of the most challenging books I've drawn to date. I found it both fun and frustrating at the same time, but I wouldn't have traded the experience for anything else. I'm just glad to have contributed to the legacy of the Legion. But there's still a few more issues left so lets just sit back and enjoy the ride!
quote:Originally posted by reckless: The problem is there there is no real evidence to suggest that readers will want to purchase a book with the Lightning Saga Legion. Look at the Action sales figures from CBGxtra.com:
So that shows there was a slight bump in sales during the Action Legion issues. But it wasn't that big, and probably was attributable to Legion fans picking up the books (or the hype for those issues, which were heavily promoted by DC).
Or, what I think, this bump was caused by every edition having an alternate cover (1 to 10).
From: Brasil | Registered: May 2008
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quote:Originally posted by reckless: The problem is there is no real evidence to suggest that readers will want to purchase a book with the Lightning Saga Legion.
You've summed up very capably why the Legion is probably taking its longest vacation ever in the history of the franchise. If LO3W didn't include the ultimate fate of Superboy Prime, the resurrection of Bart Allen, the future legacy of Green Lantern, and the words "Final Crisis" splashed across it covers, its sales would be even more tepid than Action's. (Alternate covers, indeed. Action should be DC's flagship title but even Johns' popularity can't lift it out of the middle range). The fact DC is declining to exploit the momentum of LO3W, but instead letting the LSH lie fallow for an indefinite time, means they know LO3W is not an accurate barometer of the future success of the Johnsboot.
Goeff Johns will have to jump through hoops over the next few years to convince TPTB he can transform it into a self-sustaining franchise once again (2011 or later). In the meantime, the Legion is radioactive to every other creator except Levitz -- and he's good only for a nostalgia arc.
"That's another fine mess you got me in, Stanley."
quote:Originally posted by fjm: Thanks again for the kind words guys. The Legion was probably one of the most challenging books I've drawn to date. I found it both fun and frustrating at the same time, but I wouldn't have traded the experience for anything else. I'm just glad to have contributed to the legacy of the Legion. But there's still a few more issues left so lets just sit back and enjoy the ride!
Francis, you've won my admiration. I hope DC keeps you around for a very long time. Imo, you have what it takes to be a real star.
From: Reimagined Trom | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by fjm: Thanks again for the kind words guys. The Legion was probably one of the most challenging books I've drawn to date. I found it both fun and frustrating at the same time, but I wouldn't have traded the experience for anything else. I'm just glad to have contributed to the legacy of the Legion. But there's still a few more issues left so lets just sit back and enjoy the ride!
Francis, you've won my admiration. I hope DC keeps you around for a very long time. Imo, you have what it takes to be a real star.
Here, here! I think you should have lots of opportunities, and join the ranks of ex-Legion artists that went on to a great career.
From: Douglasville, GA | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
Definitely let us know where you end up next Francis! You've got a whole slew of fans now that will follow you from book to book!
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
Ditto! Your artwork is wonderful...rich and captivating. I look forward to seeing your work in your next assignments.
-------------------- "Hey Jim! Get Mon out of the Zone!! And...when do we get Condo back?"
From: Paragon City on patrol | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
So do we know what the actual plan once the current series is cancelled and L3W is over? Is there anything on the schedule for 2009? I will be very disappointed if there isn't--it seems like there has been some Legion momentum in the last year or so, if they let it die with a whimper I worry that that might be it for a while...
-------------------- The only consistent feature of all of your dissatisfying relationships is you.
Don't judge me!
Registered: Aug 2003
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