posted
Do I have to buy this to gripe too? 'Cause I still don't want to. I never enjoyed the 3boot much, but even it deserved better than this. I mean, they could have put a little better effort forth, it's not like people expect comics to ship on time any more do they? DC's really pulling out the stops for the Legion these days.
From: Douglasville, GA | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
In a personal email, Shooter said that he had nothing to do with this issue. It's someone else's hack job.
Also, Francis told me via email that he doesn't know who wrote it either, and that he didn't do any pages for the issue before he left.
Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
rickshaw: it's cool. i'm not saying it was good, it's just that i want people to understand how hard it is! it's like herding cats that are hopped up on crystal meth! you see lots and lots of books on the stand but it's very rare that people think about how hard it is to make that book get there. i wish MORE fans actually tried to make comics and understood how hard it is to make one page!! just working on a very very casual side comic is soul destroying, last night i was especially sad at how a couple pages i did looked and then i was feeling guilty because i was so harsh on the art... like... i SUCK A LOT and here i am being super mean to some guy who got this stuff dumped on his lap. it's bad but you know, at least it's not traces of photographs crappily shoved together and passes as a comic *cough calero *cough*.
posted
So, what you say, veryvery, is that it is difficult to do such a crappy issue. I can sympatize with that.
I don't think anyone here is BLAMING the artist (but I do blame the writer, who was too coward to put his name on it, though I tend to think it was a "multiple writers" thing, because it is SOOOOO awfully patched together). Most of all, I guess it is a consensus that we must blame DC Editorial for letting such garbage be printed with their name on it. It offended fans of the 3boot, it offended the artists involved (and I bet fjm and Shooter are too polite to ever acknowledge that), it offended the Legiondom... In essence, it was VERY offensive! Better not to print it, or to call it a "imaginary story", it doesn't matter.
I am one of the harshest critics of the Reboot/Archie Legion, even though Legion on The Run was clearly good stimuli to that event. However, it was never offensive, in the sense that they simply revoked or ignored whatever came just one issue before. They really tried to tell a decent goodbye story (they failed, but they tried) and move forward.
Not this time: this time, the idea was to put out LSH #50, no matter what, just to give us a big middle-finger for sticking up to the Legion, even though DC itself created this huge mess of it. There was no intention of:
1) Selling a good/decent product; 2) Wrapping up a storyline; 3) Respecting its 30k customers (and more so on the net), who were falsely advertised of a completely different product.
From: Brasil | Registered: May 2008
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posted
I don't know what to say about this issue. I've mentioned here that I wasn't really getting Shooter's story, but this issue was insultingly bad. This wasn't even up to Silver Age standards of story.
When I went into the comic shop this week, I hadn't been since before Christmas. Between finding time to get there and certain financial issues, I just hadn't had a chance to get there. After four weeks of not buying comics, I was starting to think "well, what if I just stopped now. What would I miss?" I told myself that I'd miss the final issue of the Legion and the last two issues of Final Crisis. I spent about a hundred bucks on comics Wednesday. After reading those three issues, I may be done after all. I'll buy the occasional Usagi trade, but if this is the direction that comic writing is going, I'm out. All the way out.
I've kept reading the Legion over the years because I keep hoping that someone will recapture what made it such a magical read 20+ years ago. I think I'm too old for it to happen again. At this point, I'd rather just treasure the old stories and ignore the new. I really think I'll be happier that way.
From: Los Angeles, CA | Registered: Nov 2003
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posted
Don't blame Justin Thyme blame DC. JT had another writer's several plot lines to tie up as best as he could in one issue. I actually think they did an all right job. Story still sucked. It was a hurried hack job but with that in mind it wasn't that bad.
The art on the other hand killed me. Didn't like it at all. Combined with the bad story this made the issue pretty horrible.
My guess the writer was Bedard but I don't want to blame him. Blame DC. How the hell does Didio still have his job? Final Crisis was a flop IMO, DC overall is selling much less than Marvel, and some things like the Legion seem so much like an after thought.
From: Tampa | Registered: Mar 2004
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NOW! This is probably going to get me "Whatever Variant"-ed but I'm just curious as to why no one seems to be chasing after Francis and Jim with their burning pitchforks?
From what Francis has said in this thread, and I think what we can gather from Jim's old interview and his admission that he had nothing to do with this issue - it sounds like the two of them just up and quit this book very suddenly.
Who knows when exactly but obviously after #49 was written and the solicit for this issue was announced. So obviously, very last minute.
Now I know they had had their story majorly screwed with by losing some of the issues they had to tell it in (and that would sprock anyone off) - but isn't that part of the 'deal with the devil' you make when you work somewhere like DC Comics?
And if you've brought your readers this far along, isn't it your (professional? moral? creative?) responsibility to give them just that *one* final issue to send them off happy and complete with?
I don't know. I'm not blaming Jim or Francis since obviously I don't know the whole story but I think it's a bit tough to lay *all* the blame on 'Justin Thyme' and whoever the poor artist was for trying to condense four months worth of story into one issue and then draw the two dozen or so characters that that story revolves around all in the space of like, four weeks.
From: Australia | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
... I have to agree to a certain extent Blacula. Would a month really have made a huge difference to whatever schedule Francis was on to have finished the Legion run first? DC clearly don't have a problem delaying books or switching artists at short notice. Couldn't he have finished one project (especially considering that he only had one issue left to go) before starting another?
Hard for us to say, we weren't there and didn't have the decision to make.
From: Kent | Registered: Jan 2004
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I don't think the art was as bad as many here have stated. There has been worse art in Legion books. It is too bad we didn't get a true farewell issue from fjm. I bet it would have had that extra ....oomph!
And I'ts true remember Lee Moder o Jason Amstrong... It's a shame the Projectra's story is unfinished, Cosmic Boy returns, Trips & Karate Kid, Dream Boy? and so many subplots. And why Element Lad and Pahntom Girl are in te cover, Atom Girl and Ligthning Lad deserve more this honor. And where is Sun Boy in this poor finale? Farewell to another Legion Boot, I only wait with hope for a better time..coming soon!
-------------------- From Spain with glamour.
From: Valencia- Spain | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
After reflecting some more on what happened with Jim Shooter's story line, we can only hope, and it's probably a long shot, is this story could not be resolved due to what will happen in Legion of 3 Worlds.
Perhaps the Projectra, Timber Wolf, Phantom Girl, Lightning Lad and Saturn Girl issues for this version of the Legion will be revealed at the end of the mini series.
I have to agree with Director Lad, it's time to review my reading/buying habits. Final Crisis made my head hurt. Superman kicked out of Action Comics. Batman is no longer Bruce Wayne. OK, I'll sit those titles out for a while, no problem. No Legion of Super Heroes comic you say? Looks like I'll have more disposable income for the near future. Thanks Dan!
From: New Brunswick, Canada | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
I got out of a sick bed to buy this final issue. I've just read it... I may never recover.
The only good thing about how wretched this issue was... it was SO terrible that I don't feel as sad as I normally would that there won't be another issue coming next month.
I feel as if a rabid dog has been put to sleep.
R.I.P.
[ January 31, 2009, 03:15 PM: Message edited by: The Man From Cargg ]
-------------------- The poster formerly known as Carggaphile.
From: Hamilton | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
I understand what you are saying Blacula...and if this comic was produced in a vacuum, I'd agree with you about Jim and Francis.
But, ever since Infinite Crisis to Final Crisis (and unfortunately it doesn't appear to be ending soon), DC Editorial has done little to cultivate certain creative teams over another. In the Legion's case it's been "F" over the actual title because we want Johns to do whatever he wants.
Shooter (and Manapul) were hired on board with a 16 issue storyline approved by the editorial staff and went to work. Didio or whoever woke up some time after that and decided to screw them and change everything for something else. Instead of letting them finish what they started, they wanted them to wrap it up prematurely. SnM may have come up with a way to do it, but it might not still been enough for TPTB and their precious Ode to Superboy-Prime, Green Lantern and Flash in the 30th century called Legion of 3 Worlds or something. Who knows?
I feel once they let them create, they should have let the story conclude without interference. And if they did decide to cut things short early on, then its an editor's job to reign in the creators so that everyone is happy. Most of Shooter's plots should have been resolved before #50 hit the stands. Jim should have been better at finding stopping points and the editors should have said "no" to a plot or two long before now. "Finish this one first, then start with that one."
And Francis probably didn't want to draw the sh*tty script that someone pulled out of their @$$ to make #50 possible. He's just being a gentlemen not to say it here in public.
From: San Diego, CA | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Blacula: Can of worms being opened.....
... From what Francis has said in this thread, and I think what we can gather from Jim's old interview and his admission that he had nothing to do with this issue - it sounds like the two of them just up and quit this book very suddenly.
...
Well, now you've gone and posted something I have to agree with. So let me provide another target for the pitchforks by saying that everything I've read about Mr. Shooter and his time on the threeboot has left me feeling that he doesn't really care about the Legion. He does good shuffling of team-members to keep fans happy, he can see where plot points should be addressed, and he has other nice writing skills. But these are skills that can be applied to any team or book, and that sounds like what this assignment was to him. So, when/if DC asked him to put in more effort than he could agree to, he left. Folks would probably support such a decision, and I'm not about to argue over it. On pondering it, though, I couldn't help but envision Mr. Waid feeling disappointed with negative repercussions on the Legion from any perceived missteps by him. Whereas with Mr. Shooter, I can't see him caring about much other than his particular story.
From: Portland, Oregon | Registered: Jul 2003
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