posted
Well, smart money would have been on the aforementioned Joyce Delaney, the long-surviving Gwen Clone. It's been a shock some writer didn't bring her back as a villain over the years, unable to resist the image of Spidey battling Gwen Stacy. But Slott took her off the table with her recent death (surely by design). There's the chance it was a bait and switch but I doubt it.
That leaves two prime candidates in my mind:
(1) Marla Jameson - recently deceased but perhaps not quite. She has the motive in that NYC got more love from her husband than she did (both when JJJ ran the Bugle and now as Mayor); thus, she wants NYC to suffer plus using all those Spider-Men will infuriate Jonah. She also has the means--she is a brilliant scientist after all. She was originally introduced creating Spider-Slayers so this isn't too far out of her characterization.
(2) Martha Conners - the wife of the Lizard, and with her son Billy recently dead, her losing it isn't out bounds. Utilizing a scientist like the Jackal would make sense. This one is a little tougher because she doesn't have the know-how or financial means but these plot points can be explained. More glaring is the lack of the Lizard in the story which would seemingly have to happen for dramatic effect.
One possibility I really hope isn't even in contention is Liz Allen. I think Slott is nice and smart enough to leave her alone.
Am I missing anyone you think? I've been thinking along the lines of 'someone we already know' rather than surprise super-villainess, since there aren't many that have meaning for Spider-Man.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
I don't really have any guesses, Cobester. I've assumed the answer is somewhere in the post Brand New Day era, but Slott has a fondeness for more old school characters--so it's possible!
If it's Marla, it would diminish the awesome issue that followed her death which many think is an instant classic. But it would make a lot of sense how this is all playing out, I must admit.
Martha Conners, eh? That would support my inkling that the answer is within the BND era. Kind of an odd "revenge" for her to take.
My only guesses would be:
1) The original Madame Web, Cassandra Webb. A Wikipedia search shows that she's dead, but I think she was an awesome under-utilized character. This Spider Island scenario reminds me a lot of the kinds of things she would do in the '90s Spider-man animated series, where she frequently tested Peter in enigmatic ways. The way they hid the mystery lady's eyes and how you couldn't tell where she was in relation to the Jackal and his clones (in the Prelude, which is as far as I've gotten, so far), made me wonder if she was sitting down in some version of her old life support chair.
2) Mattie Franklin. I see she died around the same time as Madame Web. She was a Spider-Woman. You could see where that got her and why she'd want revenge.
3) Julia Carpenter, the new Madame Web. She's already appeared in the story and seems pretty flaky. Who knows, she may be playing both ends for some unknown purpose?
4) Jackpot. Missed her storyline in the BND era, but I read of her storyline shows that she might blame Spidey for the death of her husband and of the girl who also used the Jackpot identity.
I hope its not Liz, either. We've had enough Spidey supporting characters turned into heroes or villains. On the other hand...you could almost justify it after all she's been through. Hope not, though.
Anyhow, that's all I've got! I WILL say that Spidey could certainly use a good female villain, so I hope she's a major player going forward. (Must say, though, that my Cassandra Webb theory is my favorite! )
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
...of course, it could STILL be a Gwen Stacy clone. Gwen's Wikipedia entry (if accurate) mentions three clones, giving special attention to one called "Abby-L" who is not said to have died. It says Abby-L is the first Gwen clone (as Kaine was the actual first Spidey clone), which would fit in with the Kaine scenes in the Prelude.
However, you mention "Joyce Delaney" as having been killed in that Spider-Island spin-off when the article says "Abby-L" killed her. So this could be one of those famed Wikipedia inaccuracies. Can't say as I haven't read the stories in question it references.
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
I thought about Madame Web too, and thats a good guess! I never realizes she played a big role in the cartoon.
Like you, I'm just sitting back and enjoying the ride. I also hope whoever she is, she becomes a major villain going forward. Like you said, Peter really needs a strong female nemesis.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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Thought I'd pass this on from CAPTAIN COMICS. It started out as a discussion about WHO The Green Goblin was originally intended to be, but then someone suggested that Stan over-ruling Steve was the reason Steve quit Marvel. I DON'T THINK SO...
"It should be pointed out that for at least the last year before Ditko left, he and Stan weren't on speaking terms. At all. Now, some people say this was Steve being difficult, BUT IT WASN'T. It was STAN. Why? "Simple". Steve had INSISTED on CREDIT AND PAYMENT for plotting the stories. AND HE GOT IT. Now, since Stan was regularly in the habit by then of getting CREDIT AND PAY for plots other people were doing, this meant, that money was coming out of Stan's pocket. So he took it as a personal affront that Steve was getting paid for work Steve was actually doing, INSTEAD OF STAN. So Stan refused to talk to Steve from that point on. Steve described once going into the office, and having to turn his pages over to Sol Brodsky (production manager), without seeing Stan, because Stan refused to talk to Steve.
Meanwhile, Martin Goodman had made a verbal promise that if the new characters Kirby & Ditko were coming up with took off, they would share in licensing royalties. Then, HE BALKED on his promise. Goodman LIED, and as a matter of principle, Steve began planning to leave Marvel right then and there. His leaving, apparently, had very little to do with who the hell The Green Goblin would turn out to be, or not. Saying that was the reason was Stan's way of making Steve seem small and petty, instead of highly principled.
Gee, what a nice place to work..."
Registered: Aug 2003
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The documentary "Searching for Steve Ditko" by Jonathan Ross covers this topic brillaintly. The best part is when Ross gets Stan to drop his "good 'ol Stan" routine for the briefest of moments to reveal the ego-maniac underneath.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Cobalt Kid: Like you, I'm just sitting back and enjoying the ride. I also hope whoever she is, she becomes a major villain going forward. Like you said, Peter really needs a strong female nemesis.
Well, apparently, it's none of the above!
When I read a review of last week's issue and it said she was revealed and is obscure, I couldn't resist and looked at the last page. Never heard of her--and she doesn't even have a proper Wikipedia entry! Seems like an interesting lady, though, and one who maybe didn't deserve to fall into obscurity?
Des, once you find out who it is, let me know your thoughts. I'm sure you read her original appearances with your inclusive Spidey-buying background. (Meantime, until I know you've read the issues or the spoilers, I won't even mention what run she first appeared in!)
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
Now I'm really curious! I've thus far avoided spoilers and will continue to do so! If she appeared in a Spidey story before I'm sure to know her.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Cobalt Kid: Now I'm really curious! I've thus far avoided spoilers and will continue to do so! If she appeared in a Spidey story before I'm sure to know her.
I'm sure you will!
Anyway, I finally read the first part od "Spider Island" proper, Amazing # 667. It was a good, fun read that established pretty effectively the scenario of the storyline. Loved especially Pete's reactions to Carlie's powers and how he at first pondered whether he'd transmitted them sexually! I love Slott's humorous touches, and once again, Humberto ramos seems perfectly suited for a Spidey book of this scope.
Looking forward to the rest of the storyline and seeing how it plays out!
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
Spider-Island continues to move along with #669 and just gets more and more fun. We get spider-enhanced versions of Chance, Scorcher and White Rabbit (all of whom haven’t been seen in years), and then the crème de la crème of awesome spider-enhanced Spidey Villains is the 6-armed Shocker; that last bit started out as very comical and then ended up being pretty horrific.
Slott makes a smart plot decision in taking the ‘awesome’ tone of thousands (millions?) of people having spider-powers and now transitioning it to the horrific plot of these infected people becoming horrific spider-like monsters. Carlie’s apparent transformation was absolutely terrifying and that is really going to amp things up.
Meanwhile, he just nails so many other great story elements. First, the Carlie / Peter interaction is so incredibly likable and well done. She’s obviously figuring out Pete is Spider-Man and you can see Pete will have to make a decision on whether he should tell her. Slott has done a wonderful job making Carlie an important and empathic girlfriend for Pete.
He also uses the Horizon Labs crew to great effect, and having them interact with both Mr. Fantastic, as well as Mayor Jameson works really well. Jameson himself is just completely awesome here. Slott probably has the best handle on him since probably…Stan Lee? He gets all the good and bad parts of JJJ. Not only does he have him doing things, advancing the story, but he’s having him react perfectly to things such as “Spider-Island” and “Spider-Earth”, as well as being infected. Plus, love seeing my girl Gloria doing stuff too.
This issue had the big reveal about who the mysterious woman is:
Click Here For A SpoilerI’ll admit, I didn’t see this coming at all! The Spider-Queen, if its whom I’m thinking it is, is one of the major characters that tie into JMS’s “The Other” mythology for Spider-Man. I think she appeared once by JMS and then had a subsequent appearance in PAD’s FNSM series. To be perfectly honest, I haven’t ever thought much of her as a character—but that might change now.
The fact that Slott is fully embracing the JMS ‘The Other’ storylines is a bold move and shows the man has balls. It’s really about time that was smoothed into spider-history and doing that by combining that continuity with the clone stuff is just crazy-ambitious!
It also makes me wonder if the “Spider King” is Ezekiel? I know some people are guessing Ben Reilly, but that seems almost too easy.
For quite awhile, I was willing to never see the Other-related stuff again, Spider-Queen included. But I’m curious what Slott will do.
I wonder if he’ll tie in how the original Tarantula turned into a monster very similar to what Kaine and the Spider-King are?
Spidey is one of the best superhero comics on the market right now—consistently—and it feels so good to type that.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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Actually, my research into the mystery woman shows she originated during Click Here For A SpoilerPaul Jenkins' stint as a Spider-writer (parallel to JMS), with Spectacular Spider-man #15 being her first appearance. Her appearance precedes "The Other" storyline. Dunno if she appeared in that storyline or not. Never read all of it.
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
Ah, you are correct. Actually, I think Humberto Ramos was her co-creator, so maybe he asked Slott to bring her back.
I recall her tying into JMS' 'the Other' mythology; I think she was like the 2nd of 3 great token-related enemies Peter had to fight (the first being Morlun and the second being the Other).
I recall the arc wasn't that good. It was a 6 parter that should have been 3 parts.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:I wonder if he’ll tie in how the original Tarantula turned into a monster very similar to what Kaine and the Spider-King are?
Those creatures made me think of what happened to the original Tarantula (Anton Miguel Rodriguez) as well, particularly as Jackal called one of them "Tarantula". Tarantula died after having been mutated into a giant spider. Interestingly, Rodriguez first appeared working with the Jackal...
If nothing else, Slott definitely is doing a lot of shout-outs to Spidey history in this arc and in his run as a whole! *LIKE*
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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Cobalt, you're getting mixed up with Ero, the woman made from the spiders that ate Peter's discarded skin, who debuted near the end of The Other (in the *non*-JMS issues, he never used her) and was used muchly in PAD's FNSM.
-------------------- My views are my own and do not reflect those of everyone else... and I wouldn't have it any other way.
quote:Originally posted by Cobalt Kid: I recall the arc wasn't that good. It was a 6 parter that should have been 3 parts.
If you refer to "The Other", it was actually a whopping TWELVE parts!
If you meant the arc that introed the lady in question, it pretty much was 6 parts as it bled into the "Avengers Disassembled" story. I seems this story was also the one that temporarily gave Spidey his Click Here For A Spoilerimmensely unpopular organic web-shooters!
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
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