I am pleased with the high demand in the Tournament. I have taken a request to create a second thread, which is warranted given the high number of points and discussions Tournaments create. Feel free to talk about the battles in-depth. You may ask for canon checks in the form of references or panels from other players. All I ask is that things remain civil and for everyone to follow the rules of the forum.
Posted by Power Boy on :
Thanks Emily!!!
I've just completed my picks and wanted to chat about everyone's picks.
Here's my message moved over from the Tournament thread, which I think it will look nice if it's just everyone's picks that we can read through without the commentary and opinions messing up the flow and simple organization.
I forgot this was Duplicate Damsel and not Triplicate Girl ... oh well.
Also, Terraform Zoe may be impervious to telepathy and is strong enough to at least check Karate Kid for a moment. I assumed it was transmutation Kinetix though.
Is this Terraform Zoe or Kinetix ?
I also didn't count on post boot Vi's shrinking power since all I remember about post boot Vi is her growing with Leviathan's power
oh well!!!! Everybody's picks are so interesting! And I can see almost all of them as true in reality. It often depends on the strongest or fastest character acting with their wits at the beginning of the battle to take out the other teams strongest or fastest. And if that character WOULD act as I am thinking or if they'd act as they've been shown to act in the comics.
I'm looking at you Ultra Boy, I know they made an effort to smarten him up in the 5YL but, I still don't see him as clever IN battle, maybe leading a team on the run, or manipulating Glorith but ... never in the use of his powers ... which he would have to be even more clever than Supes or Mon-El to take full advantage of them.
I'm kind of ignoring the leader picks a bit, I think if things got tough the natural leader would grab the reigns. Also, I find I'm giving credence to a lot of the experienced Legionnaires who have been shown time and time again to overcome sticky situations and much stronger opponents. (Dream Girl, Cham, Lightning Lass, Element Lad etc. )
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I have yet to find an online source that defines Terraform Kinetix's powers. I need to know what power level she is at because in standard Tournaments characters like Mordru and Superman (Pre-Crisis) are not allowed.
Posted by Blacula on :
Just read everyone's votes up to and including PB. It's fun seeing the different ways people envision the fights going.
Some points -
* Kinetix - can we please just think of her as normal Kinetix and not that Terraform abomination? There can't be a person on this site that prefers that monstrosity to the normal Kinetix we all know and love and that thing never had it's powers properly explained anywhere anyway.
* I hope people remember to take into account the locations/stages of the battles when deciding outcomes - a) because the environments make the battles more interesting and can affect the results (I would never have picked Polar Boy over Neon on any other stage for example but all that water gave him an interesting edge); and b) because some Legionnaire's powers would be limited by their environments and that should be taken into account in the battles (for example, I think a couple of people factored Storm Boy and Nightwind into the Laboratory fight but I'm at a loss as to what they could have offered in that closed environment).
* I hope people vote for who would actually win each battle rather than just their favourites. I wouldn't want to see this turn into just another popularity contest when we've already got Legion Idol/Survivor type games going on.
* There are some Legionnaires who are clearly more powerful than a lot of the others. I almost feel like I could predict the last 5-8 Legionnaires standing right now. The interesting thing about the team system though is that while Element Lad, Saturn Girl and Mon-El may be unbeatable together; Element Lad, Turtle and Color Kid together definitely could be. So it will be interesting to see if those more powerful members get lucky with effective teammates on their road to the end, or if they luck out with the more niche-powered characters, enabling them to be taken out and leaving us with a less predictable final 5.
[ November 21, 2011, 11:54 PM: Message edited by: Blacula ]
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
*Kinetix - I prefer transmutation Zoe as well. Terrorform Kinetix pretty much had powers as the plot demands, ugh. They were never limited or defined.
*Nightwind's wind powers I think should still work well within the closed confines of a lab. Storm Boy's I believe wouldn't. Wind is much more precise.
*A lot of this will be luck-based, which is why I suggested jumbling teams every round. I mean, one team has Andromeda AND White Witch together, giving them an automatic advantage through most of the tournament!
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Oh, I have a suggestion for the Wild Cards. Maybe we can bring individual Legionnaires back, instead of whole teams. I remember there were quite a few comments that some Legionnaires (especially Kinetix!) merely got saddled with poor teammates.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
Once I calculate the votes and establish the basis for the next rounds, I will indicate that Kinetix is Non-Terraform on the first page. I plan to hold the Wild Card Rounds after the second round.
I need to have a Wild Card Round for teams for mathematical reasons. I chose seventy-two characters and divided them up in teams of three. This means there are twenty-four teams in round one, twelve teams in round two, and six teams in round three. If we add two teams back then the total goes up to eight teams, so in the next round there is four teams, then ultimately two teams.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Originally posted by Invisible Brainiac: Oh, I have a suggestion for the Wild Cards. Maybe we can bring individual Legionnaires back, instead of whole teams. I remember there were quite a few comments that some Legionnaires (especially Kinetix!) merely got saddled with poor teammates.
I agree re: bringing individual Legionnaires back, and then mixing them up into new teams.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
We could have three Wild Card Rounds then. The first Wild Card would be a vote bring back two previously defeated teams. The second Wild Card would be a draft for characters not in the Tournament, for example Rainbow Girl and Reflecto. The third Wild Card would be a draft for characters who have previously been in the Tournament.
I will eliminate the Team Wild Card if the demand is low and if there is alternate option regarding mathematical distribution. I want to note that I am thinking of following this up with a LSV Tournament.
Posted by Power Boy on :
LSV Tournament hahaha! Great Idea.
I prefer an individual character wild card round to bringing back a team wild card round, if it matters.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
The results of the First Round are posted. Thank you for your participation so far. It takes a long time to assemble teams using Random Generators at this stage of the Tournament because there are so many individuals. Thank you for your patience and continue to vote.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I think most prefer bringing back individual characters, so my suggestion is, we bring back a total of 6 individuals. That'll give us enough players to form two new teams, so we can still have 8 teams total.
Thanks for all the effort you're putting in here, Emily! I'd love an LSV tournament as well.
Posted by Blacula on :
This is kind of minor but I'd like the Volcano Stage renamed the Fire Stage or something since 3 players (including me) incorrectly assumed that "Volcano" meant "lava" when there's actually none on that field. Just fire.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I want to let everyone know in advance that tomorrow is a holiday in the United States so there may be a delay betweeen the time votes are due and the time votes are counted.
quote:I think most prefer bringing back individual characters, so my suggestion is, we bring back a total of 6 individuals. That'll give us enough players to form two new teams, so we can still have 8 teams total.
That sounds like a good idea. I might try to divide the eliminated characters into categories based on the type of fighter they are, but if yhat proves to be too complicated we will just use the top six voted in.
I will rename the Volcano Stage to the Furnance Stage.
I have tried dividing the characters that have already eliminated into categories based on the type of power. However, I am experiancing difficulty because of the vast number of members whose powers involve either energy or the elements. This is my first attempt at organizing them into categories:
Leaders *Wildfire *Mon-El *Cosmic Boy *Night Girl *Invisible Kid II *Kid Quantum I *Tyroc *Computo *Nightwind *Bouncing Boy *Kid Quantum II *Kinetix Extrasensory Powers Insect Queen Dawnstar Tellus Kinetic Powers Polar Boy Super-Strong (Bricks) Catspaw Monstress Turtle Stone Boy Kon-El Ferro Energy-Related Sun Boy Shadow Lass Comet Queen Sizzle Devlin O'Ryan Other Chemical King Duplicate Damsel Elastic Lad XS Gates Dragonmage Matter-Eater Lad Infectious Lass Color Kid
As you may notice, there is a lot of characters in the Other column. Any suggestions as to how to organize them better?
[ November 23, 2011, 05:10 PM: Message edited by: Emily Sivana ]
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Good try, Emily, but I think their powers are just too diverse to really organize. Maybe we can simply have all characters in the same pool?
That's my personal preference, anyway If it comes down to it, I'll just vote for either my favorites, or the ones whom I think have the best chances in this tournament.
Posted by Power Boy on :
We should've organized our picks together survivor style ... Otherwise we may have to vote again !
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
Yes, this is a bit of a work in progress. Normally in Tournaments there is a Street-leveler Wild Card, maybe a Trade Round between players, and simply bringing back another team. The problem is (as you can see from the previous page) the Legion of Super-Heroes aren't structured the way some other super-hero teams are. If I had to assign statistical points most of them would be 3 or 4 on a scale of 1-4.
What is survivor style?
Posted by Power Boy on :
Like the tv show ... People meet/discussion in secret 'alliances' to 'pool' their votes ...
Let's all vote for dream girl for example ... Hint hint ...
Nothing special
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Wow, 4 voters in and nobody besides Duplicate Damsel has more than one vote!
What happens if ties can't be broken? Another round of voting, or perhaps everyone makes it back in? Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I'd suggest giving us about twelve votes instead of six. That way, if five people vote you're guaranteed that at least six characters will get at least two votes.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I will change it to twelve votes then. How does everyone like the Tournament so far? What changes do you want to see in the LSV Tournament?
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I'm enjoying it immensely so far! I've mentioned all my suggestions for now, but I will let you know if I think of any more.
Thanks for the hard work, Emily.
Posted by Power Boy on :
The 12 pick version is actually looking to have some similar choices :
Shadow lass Duplicate girl And compute might make it in !
Posted by Power Boy on :
Maybe some new venues or even tasks fir the lsv one. I think a lot of the dumb crooks might havea hard time with the simplest tasks lol. Or lighting lord would keep hearing the storm talk to him ....
Maybe some legion or comics related venues Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
Looks to me like we've got 5 people with either 3 or 4 votes at the moment.
If no one breaks the tie for the sixth position, I'd suggest randomly picking from among those with 2 votes.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I agree that is the best way to break the ties. Computo will return to the Tournament unless the count changes between now and 9:00 P.M Central Time tomorrow.
My main problem for Legion super-villains is the opposite of the problem I have encountered with the LSH. There are alot of Legion villains that are simply too powerful to be allowed in Standard Tournaments; Mordru being the most obvious example. I have wrote down all the villains I can think of and have only found 40 able to compete.
Posted by Power Boy on :
Maybe we should have an uber-tournament with all kryptonians and above ! Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Maybe the uber-powerful Legion villains can be put in a league of their own.
And knowing the encyclopedic knowledge of Legion Worlders, maybe we can help you populate the list for the LSV tourney, Emily.
Btw, as of now I count Duplicate Damsel with 4 votes; Nightwind, Tyroc, Computo and Bouncing Boy with 3; and 9 other Legionnaires with 2 each (Brainiac 5, Dragonmage, Infectious Lass, Karate Kid, Kinetix, Matter-Eater Lad, Polar Boy, Sensor Girl, Shadow Lass).
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I'd be happy to help work up a list of villains.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I'd be happy to help as well, if needed.
Btw - I think Kinetix's powers can also affect animate creatures. In Legionnaires 39 she was able to telekinetically lift Karate Kid; in Legionnaires 50 she shoved Mordru with her powers; and in Legionnaires 65 she lifted several Dark Circle soldiers at once.
Posted by Power Boy on :
The various wiki's also say she can create light and forcefields and stuff ...
actually one wiki defined her terraform powers, mostly as being to develop whatever power she needed.
my favorite Zoe is actually Sci Police Zoe.
It's getting close, we may need a tie breaker for some of these,
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Sci Cop Zoe would be cool! Imagine a telekinetic with kickass police training. Before she was terrorformed, Zoe was able to make shields and create glows. Too bad none of those really help against her current opponents :/
Btw, Peebz, after reading your vote in the tournament I got to thinking - I'd totally forgotten about Tyroc's other powers way way back. Now I think of him as a sound manipulator, period. Whoops.
Good point on Andromeda vs. Supergirl, too. I was thinking the same thing - in Adventure, they made a big deal of calling Mon-El the mightiest Legionnaire, so I always thought of him as just a little bit more powerful than Superboy...
Posted by Power Boy on :
yeah, sci cop zoe was nice in Legion Worlds I think, they had her grow up. It seems like she's basically a powerful telekinetic.
I still go back and forth on that Tyroc battle ... I think Tyroc would beat Lightning Lad still but ... I wonder how much smarter Supergirl is than Andromeda since Supergirl has been shown to do all sorts of cool stunts with her powers.
Andy fought BION though.
If it wasn't the furnace stage, Duplicate Damsel could run rampant!
It would be interesting to do a last individual standing tournament, i think it would be roughly the same ...
Imra Zoe Tyroc Duplicate Damsel Kono
would all get far, it seems they're wining these group battles rather than the Daxxamites or Kryptonians. (from my experience)
It's hard to beat an opponent who could turn you intangible.
[ November 30, 2011, 01:43 AM: Message edited by: Power Boy ]
Posted by Power Boy on :
we might need a tie breaker if no one else votes.
for the Andromeda verus Supergirl match.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
For future tournaments, I think a little more of a refresher/specification on what various characters can do might be a good idea.
Posted by Power Boy on :
should we do that before the finale round just to refresh?
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
That might be a good idea. I want to say that I want to stay away from NuDCU versions of characters until we have enough issues to establish feats. I also need to know how much Pre-Crisis continuity is in the Retroboot, and how much is not canon. I need to know this because it is standard to disallow certain characters/feats because they are Pre-Crisis.
Posted by Power Boy on :
1.Team One: Kono, Chlorophyll Kid, and *Saturn Girl
... This one is gonna be good.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Maybe for the last round, we can just agree among ourselves which powers/abilities are in play based on the versions of the characters.
PS, who would have thought Chlorophyll Kid would make it to the end? Whoo! Take that, snotty Adventure Era Legionnaires!
Garth vs. Imra would have been cool too, though.
Here are my thoughts...
Final Round
Team One
1) Kono - can shift mass around. Think Star Boy, Light Lass powers + Phantom Girl, except she can also phase others as well. On the other hand, she doesn't seem to be able objects as large as what Thom/Ayla could? Let's say her limit is about the mass of one person.
2) Supergirl - standard Kryptonian powers. Also adept at science.
3) Tyroc - sound manipulation, flight. Current version hasn't demonstrated the reality-warping versions of the old Tyroc.
Team Two
1) Saturn Girl - standard Imra. Extremely skilled telepath. Affect senses, shut down minds, limited control over another's actions.
2) Chlorophyll Kid - can grow plants. Glorithverse version could also control them I believe, but not sure if this one can. I'm leaning towards can't, or at least he only has limited control over their natural abilities (i.e. he can make plants release spores or swing vines around, but can't suddenly make roses shoot their thorns or make coconuts explode)
3) Duplicate Damsel - can make an infinite number of duplicates. I think all her duplicates are identical? Does each duplicate have greater strength or speed than a normal woman would? I think not right?
Posted by Power Boy on :
Thanks IB, I was thinking along the same lines ...
I think I read before that Kono was limited to a large humanoid, IIRC, and if she has a weakness it's overconfidence, she once shifted Bion into the floor and thought she dealt with him and he nearly got the drop on her because surprise! he can phase like Tinya.
I kinda think that Postboot Imra is way more hardcore than even the badnass Retroboot Imra. She created a long term illusion of Tinya, and was shown to be blasting groups of people.
A couple points, I was confused about what a Retroboot Supergirl was .. but decided it didn't matter in the battle, Kara is still super fast. and I would prefer if Tyroc had at least some of his reality warping tricks, explained somehow, but ... he's still incredibly formidable with just his sound manipulation.
In my opinion, I wish they had said Lu could only create 60 or 100 duplicate ... infinite duplicates is crazy. She could take any team down almost but .. I just figure she needs some time to create duplicates ... it's not like *BAM instant infinite duplicates*
[ December 01, 2011, 10:43 PM: Message edited by: Power Boy ]
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I agree, Peebz! I've seen Postboot Imra take out way more combatants at a time than Retroboot Imra ever did.
As for Supergirl, I'm not sure if there are any differences. I do know that current Supergirl is said to less likely to hold back, because she's not as used to her powers.
Posted by Blacula on :
In terms of versions of characters, I tend to just go with the most consistent/popular iteration of each character, rather than when they were at their most powerful.
This will usually mean their preboot/retroboot version, rather than their postboot or threeboot versions.
So, for example, the Shrinking Violet in my battles will never have her growing power since - a) I hated her with that power; and b) she only had that power for a very short period of her character's history anyway.
For all the characters with inconsistent, deus ex-machina type powers I tend to just use those powers that they are most identified with (i.e. telekenetic manipulation for Kinetix, time-stasis for Kid Quantum II, sound shock-waves for Tyroc, etc).
The other reason I tend to stick with the preboot/retroboot versions of characters is that the postboot (as much as I loved it) unfortunately occurred during a time in history when lots of creators (and fans) seemed to think that characters weren't good enough unless they had their powers amplified.
So suddenly - Invisible Kid can make other people invisible too; Saturn Girl can control whole crowds of people at once; Shadow Lass can use her dark field like a Green Lantern ring; ditto Brainiac 5 with his force-field; Triplicate Girl is strong enough to take down a Daxamite; Kinetix and Kid Quantum II keep having random and unrelated powers added to their arsenals; and so on.
I am definitely not one of those people who think a character needs to be overly-powered to be interesting so I'm not keen on using short-lived, disproportionately powered (in relation to their teammates/opponents) versions of these characters in these games.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I consider Retroboot Supergirl to be the Supergirl who debuted in Superman/Batman. She is not the same as the Pre-Crisis Supergirl in terms of feats and statistics; in general Pre-Crisis characters are ranked higher than Post-Crisis characters. Characters such as Pre-Crisis Superman are banned from standard Tournaments for that reason.
Should I continue using this thread for LSV Tournament planning or should I make a new one?
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
We might as well continue using this thread.
Here's a bunch of villains (which others can probably add to):
Tharok Emerald Empress Mano Persuader Validus Caress Flare Mordecai Neutrax Silver Slasher Titania Lazon Mist Master Magno Lad Esper Lass Micro Lad Chameleon Kid Phantom Lad Calorie Queen Lightning Lord Cosmic King Saturn Queen Chameleon Chief Sun Emperor Beauty Blaze Echo Radiation Roy Spider Girl Nemesis Kid Ron-Karr Zymyr Hunter Tyr Ol-Vir Monster Master Nardo Universo Dr. Regulus Computo Size Lad Blackout Boy Magnetic Kid Alaktor Evillo Apollo Wild Huntsman Sugyn Hag Black Mace Mystelor Quanto Rogarth Shagrek Command Kid Dynamo Boy Mantis Morlo Meglaro Roxxas Satan Girl Starfinger Sun Woman Sunburst Uli Algor Grimbor Charma Dr. Mayavale Lady Memory Vyrkos Grinn Composite Man Tangleweb Repulse Abyss Brainstorm Twine Nadir Cortex Emerita Razorsoul Gangster Pollen Bronto Singularity Devil Canary Lantern Arrow Praetor Lemnos Elysion Gron Kynda Phren Zepha Stasi Earth-Man Eyeful Ethel Tusker Golden Boy Storm Boy
Posted by Power Boy on :
I can't wait to play Emerald Empress ... AND mean guys like Tyr, Tharok.
Since this is a villain tournament, is lethal force imaginable?
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Adding a few villains from the Postboot era. The rejected Legionnaires are arguable, of course:
Ze Tongue Cherry Bomb Density Phantom Lad Phy'r Ebb A'rie Rrok Composite Durlan Titanor Bandarkat Scavenger Evisceratronic (ugh) Chronos Quicksand Holdur Xotar Domain Dr. Savant Howl Gronk Murdermaton Xoth Swool Kuga
Posted by Blacula on :
quote:Originally posted by Invisible Brainiac: Adding a few villains from the Postboot era. The rejected Legionnaires are arguable, of course:
... Evisceratronic (ugh) ...
I noticed he was missing from EDE's list and thought of adding him but then wondered - does anyone want to be reminded of this character?
But I actually don't mind him. I loved that the writers *finally* tied up that loose end with the sci-cop from the very beginning of the Reboot. And at least he didn't last more than a couple of panels. And he has a hilariously campy name.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
Thank you for your lists. I had to cut the number at 72 so it is the same number of characters that participated in the heroes tournament. I have edited the list a little and will list my reasons why: 5. Validus power cannot be calculated and since he has been shown beating Pre-Crisis Superboy he is usually banned from Tournaments. The name Validus still strikes fear on other gaming sections of other forums. I replaced him with Earth-Man because he has appeared recently and he has one of the most valuable Tournament powers. 6. Mordecai cannot compete for the same reasons Validus cannot compete. I replaced him with Eviceratronic because there appears to be interest for him to compete in the Tournament. 37. Universo's telepathy appears to be beyond Professor Xavier's level and perhaps is Sky-Father level. I don't think he should compete in Standard Tournaments. I have replaced him from Elysion because we need a villain from the Threeboot and Elysion is a personal favorite of mine.
1 Tharok 2. Emerald Empress 3.Mano 4.Persuader 5. Earth-Man 6. Caress 7. Flare 8. Evisceratronic 9. Neutrax 10. Silver Slasher 11. Titania 12. Lazon 13. Mist Master 14. Magno Lad 15. Esper Lass 16. Micro Lad 17. Chameleon Kid 18. Phantom Lad 19. Calorie Queen 20. Lightning Lord 21. Cosmic King 22. Saturn Queen 23. Chameleon Chief 24. Sun Emperor 25. Beauty Blaze 26. Echo 27. Radiation Roy 28. Spider Girl 29. Nemesis Kid 30. Ron-Karr 31. Zymyr 32. Hunter 33. Tyr 34. Ol-Vir 35. Monster Master 36. Nardo 37. Elysion 38. Dr. Regulus 39. Computo 40. Size Lad 41. Blackout Boy 42. Magnetic Kid 43. Alaktor 45. Evillo 46. Apollo 47. Wild Huntsman 48. Sugyn 49. Hag 50. Black Mace 51. Mystelor 52. Quanto 53. Rogarth 54. Shagrek 55. Command Kid 56. Dynamo Boy 57. Mantis Morlo 58. Meglaro 59. Roxxas 60. Satan Girl 70. Starfinger 71. Sun Woman 72. Sunburst
Posted by Blacula on :
Evisceratronic made it through! Here's hoping he somehow fumbles his way through to the end. haha
I am going to need to be reminded of what exactly his power was though. Actually, I'm going to need reminding of what a whole bunch of these characters' powers were - Neutrax, Monster Master, Nardo (other than being awesome and under-utilised), Elysion, Alaktor, Apollo... and more.
It might be worth having someone do a quick synopsis of each character for players who don't have time to search Wikipedia each round.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I don't think Evisceratronic powers were really specified, were they? Someone will have to look it up.
It Universo is out, Meglaro should be as well, as he's arguably the most powerful telepath in the Legionverse.
I'll start writing up some quick summaries later on. I suspect we'll be wanting to make some more changes to the list as well.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
So, I assume the first few are really familiar, but here goes:
1. Tharok-- Cyborg, combines the super-intellect of his robot half with the ruthlessness of his human half. Robot side has numerous gadgets/weapons available to it.
2. Emerald Empress-- Controls the Emerald Eye of Ekron, a powerful artifact somewhat akin to a Green Lantern ring that allows her to fly and emit blasts of energy strong enough to take down a Kryptonian/Daxamite
3. Mano, power to disintegrate objects centered in his hand, at maximum power can destroy an entire world, also possesses super-speed & reflexes, relies on atmosphere helmet to survive in Earth environment
4. Persuader, wields atomic axe, which can slice through virtually anything, even forces such as gravity or barriers between dimensions if wielded with skill, which the Persuader seems to have.
5. Earth-Man, absorbs the powers of others via touch for limited periods (twelve hours?).
6. Caress, "acid touch" allows her to dissolve objects via her hands.
7. Flare, projects fire/flies
8. Evisceratronic, ???
9. Neutrax, can neutralize the powers of others for short periods of time (not clear on the extent of this, could he neutralize weapons like the atomic axe or Emerald Eye?)
10. Silver Slasher, metallic body and claws on fingertips, can also spin body at extreme speed
11. Titania, Super-strong (apparently Kryptonian class?) strength and some degree of invulnerability
12. Lazon, Can change body into any form of light
13. Mist Master, can change body into any form of gas
14. Magno Lad, Braalian magnetic abilities at advanced magno-ball champ level
15. Esper Lass, Titanian mental abilities, focused both on reading and controlling minds
18. Phantom Lad, Bgztlr ability to become intangible
19. Calorie Queen, Bismollian ability to consume any form of matter, plus super-strength equal to about three times normal human level
More to come later...
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
8. Evisceratronic (ugh) - what a mess. anyway, he possessed a mystical gemstone that allowed him to fire blasts. Similar to the Emerald Eye, except just blasts.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
20. Lightning Lord -- Electrical generation
21. Cosmic King-- Transmutation rays from eyes
22. Saturn Queen-- Titanian telepathic abilities, usually focused on mind control and creating illusions
23. Chameleon Chief-- shape-changing ability; unlike Durlans, can also change shape of other objects
24. Sun Emperor-- Generates heat/light/fire
25. Beauty Blaze-- Generates fire
26. Echo-- Sound manipulation
27. Radiation Roy-- Generates radiation which can paralyze opponents
28. Spider Girl-- Super-Strong prehensile hair which can be expanded into "web" at will
29. Nemesis Kid-- ability to adapt whatever ability is needed to defeat any single opponent; power either shuts down or teleports him to safety if confronted with more than one opponent
30. Ron-Karr-- ability to become extremely flat
31. Zymyr-- Gil'Dishpan, scientific genius and teleporter
32. Hunter-- Master of traps and weaponry (or at least his father was)
33. Tyr-- Extremely strong and durable; bionic gun hand capable of flight/functioning independently of him
34. Ol-Vir-- Kryptonian class abilities
35. Monster Master-- Ability to control animals of all sorts
36. Nardo-- Can project nuclear bolts that can knock out or kill non-invulnerable opponents; various vision powers, including heat vision and radar vision (which allows him to detect invisible opponents); way too much knowledge of baseball for a being from another galaxy
37. Elysion-- Earth manipulator
38. Dr. Regulus-- technological based heat, light, and fire generation
39. Computo-- Highly advanced intelligence, able to invent more advance tech to improve itself; standard tech includes force shield and "z-rays" which can slice through matter
[ December 05, 2011, 06:11 PM: Message edited by: Eryk Davis Ester ]
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
40. Size Lad -- can shrink or enlarge inanimate objects
41. Blackout Boy -- projects darkness
42. Magnetic Kid -- can attract/repel organic material
43. Alaktor-- Super-scientist, whose "marvel belt" has the powers of "super-radiance, super-loud sound, mechanical hypnotizing, and others". Also invented "psycho-changer" which allows him to transfer minds from body to another.
45. Evillo-- Can temporarily grow horns on head that project blasts that allow him to paralyze opponents or project them into "the realm of darkness"; other tech includes concentrated bottles of pure evil that can be used to turn others evil
46. Apollo-- Uses magic harp to charm animals and people or cause tempers to flare up among them
47. Wild Huntsman-- Centaur who can create storms with his magic horn and expertly wields an electric lasso
48. Sugyn-- Can consume large quantities of liquid and then spit it out like a geyser. Carries horn which can be used to contain water.
49. Hag-- Black magic, rocket-powered broomstick
50. Black Mace-- "fast, agile, and deadly" with his mace
51. Mystelor-- Various mental abilities, including telepathy and (particularly) telekinesis
52. Quanto-- Ability to change into energy beam
53. Rogarth-- Daxamite-level super-strength and invulnerability
54. Shagrek-- Antennae project "disintegration beams" which have a limited range
55. Command Kid-- possessed by demon that allows him to create illusions
56. Dynamo Boy-- Super-belt gives him the ability to energize other people and things (e.g. he can recharge a battery or increase the energy/power levels of another person)
57. Mantis Morlo-- Evil super-scientist, specializing in chemistry; typically aided by "chemoid" assistants who can shift their elemental structure
58. Meglaro-- Extremely powerful telekinetic/telepath who can control the mind of anyone in his vicinity not protected by a lurium helmet
59. Roxxas-- Preboot version is space-pirate with ray gun; Postboot version is Daxamite
60. Satan Girl-- evil clone of Supergirl with Kryptonian-class powers
70. Starfinger-- Adventure Era version: Each finger on his hand creates a different effect (index finger-- lightning; middle finger-- force thrust ray; ring finger-- radiation; pinky-- freezing ray; thumb-- power-neutralizing ray), can scramble the powers of opponents by combing all of the rays; also wears armor that contains various defenses, such as missiles, mirrors that can reflect energy attacks, and super-hearing earphones)
71. Sun Woman-- Super-strength derived from solar energy
72. Sunburst-- Sun-powered device allows him to admit heat/light and protects him from energy attacks with a force shield.
Posted by Set on :
quote:4. Persuader, wields atomic axe, which can slice through virtually anything, even forces such as gravity or barriers between dimensions if wielded with skill, which the Persuader seems to have.
Nyeun Chun Ti also came from a high gravity world and has enhanced strength and endurance (although not Superman-class or anything, just better-than-human).
quote:5. Earth-Man, absorbs the powers of others via touch for limited periods (twelve hours?).
24 hours, IIRC, not that it matters for the purposes of a tournament (unless he's facing a time manipulator, like Kid Quantum 2, who could make his powers wear off early...).
quote:9. Neutrax, can neutralize the powers of others for short periods of time (not clear on the extent of this, could he neutralize weapons like the atomic axe or Emerald Eye?)
Can also use his neutralizing gaze to kill people (or drop them into comas) by 'neutralizing' their brainwaves or some such thing.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Originally posted by Set:
quote:5. Earth-Man, absorbs the powers of others via touch for limited periods (twelve hours?).
24 hours, IIRC, not that it matters for the purposes of a tournament (unless he's facing a time manipulator, like Kid Quantum 2, who could make his powers wear off early...).
I suppose the important thing for tournament purposes is whether he starts each round "clean", or can carry over powers from previous rounds.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
quote:Originally posted by Set: Can also use his neutralizing gaze to kill people (or drop them into comas) by 'neutralizing' their brainwaves or some such thing.
I need to know if he has displayed the neutralizing ability to kill or drop people into coma in the Reboot. We need to be careful in regards to feats attributed to Pre-Crisis characters.
I think Earth-Man should start each round "clean" in order to avoid giving him an advantage. His base power is the power to absorb other powers, which is already highly valuable in tournaments.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Originally posted by Emily Sivana:
quote:Originally posted by Set: Can also use his neutralizing gaze to kill people (or drop them into comas) by 'neutralizing' their brainwaves or some such thing.
I need to know if he has displayed the neutralizing ability to kill or drop people into coma in the Reboot. We need to be careful in regards to feats attributed to Pre-Crisis characters.
I doubt he's displayed it since his first appearance. The LSA in general suffered serious villain decay after their initial run in with the Legion.
Posted by Set on :
quote:Originally posted by Emily Sivana:
quote:Originally posted by Set: [qb]Can also use his neutralizing gaze to kill people (or drop them into comas) by 'neutralizing' their brainwaves or some such thing.
I need to know if he has displayed the neutralizing ability to kill or drop people into coma in the Reboot. We need to be careful in regards to feats attributed to Pre-Crisis characters.
I don't think any of the League of Super-Assassins even existed in the reboot...
Posted by Blacula on :
^ Thanks for the above descriptions EDE. They'll be super-helpful.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
As far as the line-up goes, as I said before Meglaro might be too powerful for this game, since most battles with him are pretty much going to go "Meglaro takes over everyone's mind on the field" until he runs into someone like Computo (who I have no idea if he could control).
We also have a whole bunch of fire/heat themed characters, who we could probably replace to get some variety.
Posted by Power Boy on :
What about Mano being able to destroy the world with his hand ?
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I have been looking at the list, and perhaps we can replace Meglaro with Charma. Would everyone else be willing to support this?
Has Mano actually been shown on-panel destroying a world with his hand?
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
^^It's part of his origin, both in the original recipe and in the reboot. It's not something he can do regularly, however. He has to rest for quite awhile to let his power build up.
Posted by Set on :
Yeah, he did only do it the one time, and it's entirely possible that it took him weeks, months or even years to build up to that level.
Posted by Blacula on :
I'm all for taking out the more powerful members (Meglaro, Ol-Vir, Emerald Empress, etc) and replacing them with the more interestingly powered "weaker" members (Charma, Grimbor, Ron-Karr, etc).
It's much more interesting writing/reading a battle between characters who have to creatively fight their way to a win, rather than just blast away all of their opponents with their superior powers.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I think we have enough characters who could take out the Empress (Cosmic King and Starfinger can both exploit the Eye's vulnerability to kryptonite; Blackout Boy might be able to temporarily blind it; Nemesis Kid could adapt something like Ferro Lad's power, ala Superboy's Legion) that I'm okay with leaving her in, but I'd be happy to get rid of some of the duplicate power-classes in favor of a more interesting variety of powers.
I'd definitely like to see some folks like Ze Tongue or Canary in the game.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I agree re: duplicates. Besides the fire/heat, let's take out some of the super-strength characters too? I'm thinking the likes of Sun Woman and Rogarth.
Re Empress, if Polar Boy was able to put the Eye out of commission for a while by freezing it, then I think EE is not too powerful for this game.
Agree re quirky/unique villains like Ze Tongue, Charma, Quicksand. They'll add a lot of flavor, like Evisceratronic does
Maybe we can take out some of the ones with less personality, like the Murran spies (Size Lad, Blackout Boy, Magnetic Kid).
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
The Murrans have interesting powers, so I vote to keep them. But definitely agreed about the super-strong characters.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I have decided that we should start the LSV Tournament next Friday. This gives us plenty of time to prepare for it, but also not enough time that we will forget about it.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I want to start the Tournament this Friday; if you have any suggestions for replacement characters, rules, or anything else please post soon.
This is the current list:
1 Tharok 2. Emerald Empress 3.Mano 4.Persuader 5. Earth-Man 6. Caress 7. Flare 8. Evisceratronic 9. Neutrax 10. Silver Slasher 11. Titania 12. Lazon 13. Mist Master 14. Magno Lad 15. Esper Lass 16. Micro Lad 17. Chameleon Kid 18. Phantom Lad 19. Calorie Queen 20. Lightning Lord 21. Cosmic King 22. Saturn Queen 23. Chameleon Chief 24. Sun Emperor 25. Beauty Blaze 26. Echo 27. Radiation Roy 28. Spider Girl 29. Nemesis Kid 30. Ron-Karr 31. Zymyr 32. Hunter 33. Tyr 34. Ol-Vir 35. Monster Master 36. Nardo 37. Elysion 38. Dr. Regulus 39. Computo 40. Size Lad 41. Blackout Boy 42. Magnetic Kid 43. Alaktor 45. Evillo 46. Apollo 47. Wild Huntsman 48. Sugyn 49. Hag 50. Black Mace 51. Mystelor 52. Quanto 53. Rogarth 54. Shagrek 55. Command Kid 56. Dynamo Boy 57. Mantis Morlo 58. Charma 59. Roxxas 60. Satan Girl 70. Starfinger 71. Sun Woman 72. Sunburst
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I suggest we replace the ff. villains because of their duplicate powers and lack of interesting personalities:
1) Chameleon Kid 2) Sun Woman 3) Rogarth 4) Sunburst 5) at least two of the ff: Beauty Blaze/ Sun Emperor / Flare/ Dr. Regulus (personally I prefer keeping Flare and the Doc) 6) Quanto (arguable since we already have Lazon, but Quanto is more powerful) 7) Echo (only bec. we also included him in the heroes tourney) 8) one of Tyr/Black Mace/Hunter 9) POSSIBLY one of Mystelor/Esper Lass/Saturn Queen (Mystelor has more powers, but I found Esp and SQ more interesting. Two telepaths isn't too many.)
Suggested replacements:
1) Ze Tongue (long, shapeshifting tongue) 2) Cherry Bomb (can explode but needs to recharge) 3) Quicksand (can turn liquids into solids and vice versa) 4) Holdur (powerful grip) 5) Twine (has a whip that drains energy) 6) Brainstorm (telekinetic who animates plastic puppets and has an enormous mean streak) 7) Abyss (can send people into a cold "void") 8) A'rie (wind elemental)/ Zepha (wind powers) 9) Ebb (water elemental) 10) Pollen (plant powers) 11) Gangster (can duplicate at least six bodies) 12) Stheno (turns people into stone - like a Medusa)
I also suggest we specify which versions of the ff. we'll use, since their Preboot and Postboot versions are vastly different:
1) Computo 2) Roxxas 3) Emerald Empress (who has multiple Preboot versions too! - I vote we pick the classic one) 4) Mantis Morlo 3) Charma (Preboot could make women hate her and men love her. Postboot had mind-control powers over men only)
Would love to see Charma vs. Apollo!
[ December 15, 2011, 09:51 AM: Message edited by: Invisible Brainiac ]
Posted by Blacula on :
Of the members IB is suggesting for removal I'd like to keep any two of the fire-based villains, any one of the telepaths, Echo (because he has a unique power not duplicated by any of the others) and at least two of Tyr, Black Mace and Hunter (just because I like them).
For his suggested replacements I'd like to support Ze Tongue, Cherry Bomb, Quicksand, Holdur, Twine and Stheno.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I'm happy with taking out any of those Ibby suggests, though I'd also happy leaving all three telepaths in.
I'm strongly in favor of including:
Ze Tongue, Quicksand, Holdur, and Twine.
I vote original recipe Computo, original recipe Emerald Empress, original recipe Charma, and, I suppose, original recipe Mantis Morlo as well.
The problem with Roxxas is that he'll be pretty useless if you make it the original, but arguably too powerful if you make it the postboot. I'd be happy just to take him out.
Posted by Power Boy on :
I'm fine with whatever.
BRING ON THE CARNAGE !!!!
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester: The problem with Roxxas is that he'll be pretty useless if you make it the original, but arguably too powerful if you make it the postboot. I'd be happy just to take him out.
We could also have him be the somewhat crazy 5YL Roxxas, but I also don't mind taking him out. We already have Ol-Vir anyway.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I have taken some suggestions into consideration and have edited the lost. I think it might be a good idea to finalize the list before we decide which versions of the characters will participate.
1 Tharok 2. Emerald Empress 3.Mano 4.Persuader 5. Earth-Man 6. Caress 7. Twine 8. Evisceratronic 9. Neutrax 10. Silver Slasher 11. Titania 12. Lazon 13. Mist Master 14. Magno Lad 15. Esper Lass 16. Micro Lad 17. Ze Tongue 18. Phantom Lad 19. Calorie Queen 20. Lightning Lord 21. Cosmic King 22. Saturn Queen 23. Chameleon Chief 24. Sun Emperor 25. Beauty Blaze 26. Echo 27. Radiation Roy 28. Spider Girl 29. Nemesis Kid 30. Ron-Karr 31. Zymyr 32. Hunter 33. Tyr 34. Ol-Vir 35. Monster Master 36. Nardo 37. Elysion 38. Dr. Regulus 39. Computo 40. Size Lad 41. Blackout Boy 42. Magnetic Kid 43. Alaktor 45. Evillo 46. Apollo 47. Wild Huntsman 48. Sugyn 49. Hag 50. Black Mace 51. Mystelor 52. Holdur 53. Rogarth 54. Shagrek 55. Command Kid 56. Dynamo Boy 57. Mantis Morlo 58. Charma 59. Roxxas 60. Satan Girl 70. Starfinger 71. Quicksand 72. Sunburst
Posted by Blacula on :
Some quick points -
* The list jumps from 60-70 with nothing in between. * I'm not in favour of any "to the death" rounds. * I prefer the most popular/consistent/utilised version of each character.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Some notes on new additions to the list:
7. Twine - DNA era: wields an energy whip that can sap the strength of anyone it touches
17. Ze Tongue - Postboot; shapeshifting tongue
52. Holdur - Preboot and Postboot; super-strong grip
58. Charma (Postboot)- can mind-control men ONLY. no effect on women.
59. Stheno - Postboot; can turn people who look at her into stone
61.Pollen - Postboot; only demonstrated power is unleashing poisonous spores
62. Arrow - Postboot; weapons expert
63. Praetor Lemnos - Threeboot; instantly makes people forget anything
64. Zepha - Threeboot; wind powers
65. Stasi - Threeboot; stasis fields
66. Eyeful Ethel - Preboot; can grow extra eyes anywhere
67. Tusker - Preboot; super long teeth
68. Golden Boy - Preboot; turns anything into gold
69. Storm Boy - Preboot; artificial storm creation
71. Quicksand - Preboot and Postboot; can turn liquids into solids and vice versa. Postboot version could also affect organic beings.
Posted by Power Boy on :
This website is really helpful for those of us more rusty on our villains than our heroes:
.... I am now imagining a giant sized Emerald Eyeful Ethel smashing Arkham Asylum.
Posted by Blacula on :
So Apollo's powers only work on females? Whoops. I hadn't realised that.
The idea of Emerald Eyeful Ethel is inspired too! Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Originally posted by Blacula: So Apollo's powers only work on females? Whoops. I hadn't realised that.
Females and animals!
I'm amazed someone else picked Ron/Ethel/Pollen to go through!
Posted by Power Boy on :
quote:Originally posted by Blacula: [QB]So Apollo's powers only work on females? Whoops. I hadn't realised that.
Maybe it's time for his powers to be *modernized*
... Apollo's HOT!!
Posted by Power Boy on :
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester:
quote:Originally posted by Blacula: So Apollo's powers only work on females? Whoops. I hadn't realised that.
Females and animals!
I'm amazed someone else picked Ron/Ethel/Pollen to go through!
I was with you Blacula when you said Pollen could stun the Empress and Earth Man ....
... but I still don't think that Ron-Karr and Eyeful Ethel can take down Twine. Posted by Emily Sivana on :
Thank you for your votes so far. I have already begun brainstorming ideas for stages in the next round. I have decided to use Superman's enemies for the next round and would like a little input as to what you want to see. I want to use Project Cadmus or its counterpoint the Evil Factory, but realize Kirby's designs were massive. Which do you think I should use and which specific parts would you like to see?
Posted by Blacula on :
quote:Originally posted by Power Boy:
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester:
quote:Originally posted by Blacula: So Apollo's powers only work on females? Whoops. I hadn't realised that.
Females and animals!
I'm amazed someone else picked Ron/Ethel/Pollen to go through!
I was with you Blacula when you said Pollen could stun the Empress and Earth Man ....
... but I still don't think that Ron-Karr and Eyeful Ethel can take down Twine.
Well, I was thinking that if Twine has her whip wrapped around Pollen, and she pretty much has to hold onto that whip at the same time, then what has she got left to fight off Ron-Karr and Ethel with?
Admittedly, Ron-Karr and Ethel are probably two of the weakest fighters in this game, but I think even the two of them could find a way to defeat a distracted, one-handed opponent who is without her primary weapon.
That is such a weird match-up because, like I said, Pollen's group is so much less powerful than Empress' - but IMO it's still a match-up where the underdogs could conceivably win the day.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I pretty much started with the thought that "Wow, that's an incredibly lopsided battle!" then started thinking "Well, Earth Man's actually pretty useless here..." and then it started to seem plausible that Ron-Karr could possibly avoid Twine's whip as well, and then I was like "Aw, crap! There's nothing they could do against the Emerald Empress, though..." and then I remembered the old theory that Ethel was the perfect host for the Eye and it just seemed too cool not to go with!
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
It IS plausible, and I can see it happening. I'm almost tempted to change my vote, especially since I suggested Pollen for the game!
quote:Originally posted by Power Boy:
quote:Originally posted by Blacula: [QB]So Apollo's powers only work on females? Whoops. I hadn't realised that.
Maybe it's time for his powers to be *modernized*
... Apollo's HOT!!
With all the male villains in this game, that could be veeeeeery interesting Posted by Power Boy on :
My count for the wild cards is :
3 Ze Tongue 3 Spider Girl 3 Twine 3 Sugyn
2 Chameleon Chief 2 Hag 2 Stheno 2 Apollo 2 Computo 2 Radiation Roy
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
Hmm...I could accept the top four as winners, but I would still have to choose three of the group of six to join them. Do you as players think that would be fair?
If not we can have another election to narrow it down further.
Posted by Power Boy on :
I'd be up for voting because it's fun but I'm fine with you choosing too.
Isn't it a total of six though ? just checking ...
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
It is a total of six, so I would have to pick two out of group of six.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I vote for voting!
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I'm good with voting again!
If we do vote again, I'd pick Stheno (I can't believe I'm already so protective of a one-shot villain, but she has an interesting power) and... it'll be tough picking one more.
Posted by Blacula on :
Assuming we are voting again I'm gettin my votes in early before the Christmas rush -
1. Stheno (I'm also a big fan of this character after just their one appearance. That was a rare late postboot/pre-DnA Legion story I enjoyed. The beautiful Alan Davis artwork certainly helped.) 2. Computo (The incongruity between that goofy yellow computer's design and his over-the-top dictatorial personality is one of my favourite things about the Adventure era.)
Posted by Power Boy on :
I'd pick
Computo and Hag (for some reason idk )
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I'd go Computo and Apollo!
Posted by Blacula on :
^ I almost went for both Hag and Apollo! I'd actually be happy with any of the characters on that list getting through. I like them all.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I'd be happy wth anyone, as well.
I'll go Computo because it's getting through anyway, and Stheno like I said in my last post.
Posted by Emily Sivana on :
I have decided to delay the vote count by 24 hours because Power Boy has not voted yet, and it is unlike him to be late so I will give him some extra time.
Posted by Power Boy on :
thanks! I just signed in ... I was offline for the holiday !
I'll need some time to really think about these battles though. I want to do the locations and combatants justice!
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
It's kind of neat that three of us were in complete agreement on outcomes, though not always on specifics of battle mechanics.
Posted by Power Boy on :
... Just posted mine. Thanks for waiting.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
I was the only one who disagreed with the three of you, and even then it was only in 2 of the 4 battles. Cool.
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
on a wonderful game, Emily!
Suggestions for next tourney - how about a heroes vs. villains game? Or mix heroes and villains together?
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
on a wonderful game, Emily!
Suggestions for next tourney - how about a heroes vs. villains game? Or mix heroes and villains together?
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Everybody's picks are so interesting! And I can see almost all of them as true in reality. It often depends on the strongest or fastest character acting with their wits at the beginning of the battle to take out the other teams strongest or fastest. And if that character WOULD act as I am thinking or if they'd act as they've been shown to act in the comics. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
If it comes down to it, I'll just vote for either my favorites, or the ones whom I think have the best chances in this tournament.
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[shrug]](graemlins/shrug.gif)
![[LOL]](graemlins/lol.gif)
I noticed he was missing from EDE's list and thought of adding him but then wondered - does anyone want to be reminded of this character?![[Bouncing Boy]](graemlins/BouncingBoy.gif)
![[Cheers]](graemlins/cheers.gif)
on a wonderful game, Emily!