Pick your favorite series entitled "Legion of Super Heroes"!

Thought this would be a fun topic!

As much as I love the post Superboy and Baxter runs, the one I always go back to is the 5 Year Later version. So much happening there to sift through...at least until the Legion on the run stuff.

To me, it's Baxter all the way! Fatal Five/Sensor Girl Saga, The Universo Project, the LSH/LSV War, Greg La Rocque, Steve Lightle, Tellus, Quislet...hoo boy, what fun!

Or at least the first 45 issues.

It started to go bad with Conspiracy, and then Giffen came back permanently. Yuck.

Totes Baxter. The Universo Project is hands-down my favorite story arc, although the LSV war, and Brin's visit to Lythyl and the introduction of the new 5 (including Sensor Girl and Tellus and Polar Boy!) made for some interesting characterization shake up and stand out as well.

Although, for 2 glorious issues, Superboy's Legion also made my day, as a sort of 'mini-continuity' all its own.

I went with Volume 2, a book that owed its very existence to the loyalty and persistence of the fans that refused to let the Legion die in the early 1970s.

Of course the highlight of the volume was the Great Darkness Saga (generally considered the high point of the Legion's entire 55-year history), but there were plenty of other memorable storylines as well, including Cham's suicide mission to Khundia (and its ramifications for so many characters), the confusing but nonetheless interesting Reflecto Saga, the classic Legion 300 and several spotlight issues on individual members.

Yeah, there were some dogs in there as well (Space Circus of Death and Omen come immediately to mind), but overall the volume was the Legion at its peak, both in quality and popularity.

Eh. I feel like my memory's too hazy to vote on this, especially since I don't have the books in front of me.

I haven't voted yet, but I'm currently leaning towards Vol. 2. Even thought it starts out with weaker stories, it is probably the only one that really got better as time went by.

Vol. 1 would totally win if the stories it reprinted were actually favorites from the Adventure Era! Of course, it's also got the Tommy Tomorrow backups, which I've never read...

Despite a few solid stories, Vol. 3 is just too depressing overall, with the whole team basically falling apart throughout it. Plus the annoying number of deaths in the series.

Vol. 4 is weighed down by some of the more negative aspects of 5YL, plus some of the crappier reboot era stories (Team 20... yuck!)

The rest... well they aren't really serious candidates, imo!

Here's an odd thought: after writing the post above it occurred to me that the entirety of volumes six and seven remind me of the Omen story. I wonder why that is?

It was somewhat close between V3 and V4, but I had to go with V4 because I just loved the hell out of the 5YG! I've never been as on the edge of my seat reading LSH each month as I was in that run. Lots of really good reboot stuff happened in V4 as well. (Psst! There were parts of "Team 20" I liked! )

Volume 4 was a real oddity in that it was, in many ways, three different books. There was the 5YG run, which pretty much ended when the Earth blew up, the end of an era period, including the much-hated Legion on the Run sequence, and finally the reboot, including the Blight stories that led into Legion Lost.

Each of those three were wildly different from each other, making it difficult to vote for that volume.

Although I thought the 5YG stuff was very well crafted, it was ultimately harmful to the franchise itself, as it replaced the idea of a universe where good was the norm and the bad guys were aberrations that the Legion was there to counteract with a universe that was actually quite depressing (and the legion itself quite ineffective). As I feel that operating in a positive future is an integral part of what the Legion is all about, I have to put the 5YG stuff in the minus column.

I actually consider the first couple years of the reboot to be among the best Legion books ever, but I preferred the Manga influenced Jeff Moy art in Legionnaires to Lee Moder's exaggerated stylings in the main book, and some of the other artists that worked on the book after Moder left were just awful, IMO. Plus, although there were a couple decent 20th century stories in the issues leading up to #100, I am, and have always been, against having Legionnaires interact with present-day characters. My main reason for this is that Legionnaires have always been allowed to grow as characters, while DC's present-day characters are, for marketing reasons, static entities who are forced to undergo periodic retcons to remain relevant. The two just don't mix well.

And then there was the post-5YG era in which the Legion was floundering around waiting for the reboot to happen. The less said about that period the better.

The fact that they didn't relaunch the book with the reboot has to be among the most absurd things in the history of franchise. That's one of the things I was curious about when I started the poll, whether it would get the combined votes from 5YL and Reboot era fans, or to what extent would fans dislike for those eras influence their vote. Meanwhile, Levitz has his work split over no less than four volumes now!

I may be the only one who votes for Volume 1. Those were the first few Legion stories I read, and so this series remains a sentimental favorite. How can you go wrong with "The Lad Who Wrecked the Legion" (# 1), "The War Between Krypton and Earth" (# 2), and "The Weirdo Legionnaire" (# 4) as your introduction to the Legion? (I missed "Computo the Conqueror" (# 3) when it came out.)

Plus, the reprint series contained text features summarizing the Legionnaires and some of their other adventures. These features are probably what made me truly fall in love with the Legion--hinting at characters I had yet to meet and stories I had not read. It was like discovering my family had a history before I came along.

Yay! I'm glad someone did vote for it!

I was surprised you didn't at least split V4 between the 5YL and Reboot stuff.

Curious to see if ANYone votes for 5, 6 or 7....

Well, Dev, DC didn't, so neither did Edie!

I understand that, but I think everyone would have accepted that there were two distinct things happening there. Kind of V4 and V4.5

Sure, there were! But don't hate--it is what it is!

And technically V2 doesn't cover the "Superboy starring..." and "Superboy and..." years!

And, oh yeah, there are some feebs on the LSH FB page that want to split the Threeboot issues before and after the "Supergirl and..." retitling into separate volumes!

There's actually people who care about the Threeboot that much?

Yeah, I KNOW, right?

What's even funnier is that Mark Waid still defends the Threeboot, saying it didn't succeed because DC went all-retro just as it was launching.

Uh...no, Mark, it was a bad idea from the get-go. Simple as that.

Disclaimer: I'm generally a Mark Waid fan, but I'm still bitter that he effed up so badly...and that he ended the reboot continuity.

I voted for Vol 2 mainly for Paul's 1st & 2nd runs. If there was an option to vote for a 2nd choice I would have picked the 5YG.

The Waid and Shooter 'halves' do have a pretty strong tonal shift, as different in their own way as DnA and Giffen.

And I'd pick either half of the Threeboot over that five years later run any day of the week.

I liked a lot about the Reboot, but 5YG was, IMO, just terrible, so those two eras being stuck in a single choice means that I won't be picking it.

Actually I like the way we're doing it. It hasn't been done before, as far as I know.

If you wanted to break it down more systematically you would have far more volumes. For instance, there was the pre-Adventure run, the Hamilton/Siegel Era, the Shooter/Bridwell Adventures, the Action backups, the Superboy half-issues (including Cockrum's run) and the return to full-length stories via the takeover of the original Superboy book...that's six volumes (or even seven if you count "Superboy starring the Legion of Super-Heroes" and "Superboy And The Legion Of Super-Heroes" as separate volumes) and we still haven't gotten to the official vol. 2 yet!

Yeah, we've done things by era before, and there's always a question of how finely you want to draw the lines where one era begins and another ends.

But with vol. 7 ending, I thought it would be fun to just take things straightforwardly on the basis of series that have been titled "The Legion of Super Heroes" and see how things play out without trying to impose order on the Legion's bizarre publishing history.

I like the way you did it too, Eryk--nicely different.

For me, it was really only two that could possibly compete: the first is V.2, which started as Superboy, and TMK. V.2 had the awesome second Levitz run (and I kind of include Superboy and the Legion as well). But ultimately, I voted for V.4 TMK, which not only had the best written Legion ever, it also included the early reboot issues, which I also hold in extremely high regard.

This post so perfectly echoes my view, it's like I wrote it myself.

Despite my Reboot love, I voted for vol. II because I think that the 5YL ultimately harmed this franchise in a way it's never been able to recover from.

As of now V4 is winning! But is it because of 5 Years Later fans, Reboot fans, or both?

It's probably benefitting from fans of one or the other. I voted for it primarily for 5YL, but I liked much of the reboot stuff therein as well.

And, also, V2 is technically considered from #259-on, right, when "Superboy" was dropped? At least one person who voted for it cited Levitz's first run factoring in.

Oh, what a long, strange trip it is to be a Legion fan!

The good of the 5YL/Reboot eras outweigh the bad and therefore it overtakes all other volumes in the poll for me.

Of course, the S/LSH era (esp Cockrum/Grell) trumps them all. *smile*

Okay, at the end of the day, my heart told me to go v4 as well!

Though either Adventure or S/LSH would have trumped it!

Another vote here for v.4

Absolutely a volume with a split-personality, but that first half (5YL) as - in my opinion - one of the most compelling and intelligent super-hero comics ever written, tips the scales and earns my vote.

V 2 here, though in my heart it also includes the excellent Tales run and first few years of reprints, because that's how I read it.

I went with V4, but only because it included the Reboot. I don't much care for 5YL.

So where does the "later" Reboot fall in? Does that not count as V4?

Almost all of DnA's run was published in titles called something other than "Legion of Super Heroes". So, Legion Lost vol. 1, Legion Worlds, and The Legion. So, like the Adventure Era, it's excluded for the purposes of this poll.

To clarify my position, I say S/LSH trumps Adventure because it includes some of the best Adventure era stories... I read classics like The Adult Legion, The Luck Lords, The Outlawed Legion, Super-Stalag of Space, and especially The Forgotten Legion (from ADV 350-351) right alongside the super-sexy current-day adventures via reprints published during the S/LSH era.

It was truly a time like no other to be an extremely young, impressionable fan.

Ooohhhhh, I hadn't really thought of that! I tend to just lump certain boots together and assume they're "volumes". XD

Yes, but it's so groovy. :needajerrygarciasmilie:

I can't pick one volume. It makes me frustrated and angry to have to try.

My brain froze yesterday when trying to decide between ... first Giffen run ... and 5YL ...

I have decided, after shutting down and restarting that 5YL is the best "book" of the LSH (critically .. I think it is one of the best comic books in history) but ... my heart belongs to the SECOND Giff run ... pre and during Magic Wars. THOSE COSTUMES were on FIRE.

yes I said it ... it dosn't get any better than a cute Pol Krinn, short haired Saturn Girl and Lightning Lass, and Mysa on an Arch Mage rampage!!!!!!!

I've amazed myself. Before just now, I would never believe I'd vote the way I did.

I did a quick browse of the covers to refresh my memory. I bought the books as they came out and, for the most part, haven't reread them since. Therefore Volumes 1 & 2 are at a disadvantage except for a few very memorable stories. Overall, the old-school style doesn't appeal to me that much now, although there's some nostalgia.

Volume 3...overall, not too memorable either. Seems rather dated in an unappealing way.

All that said, it was the first three volumes that made me love the Legion. And as I reread them, as I'm beginning to, I may change my "favorite."

Volumes 6 & 7 I remember too well and they're definitely not my favorites.

That leaves 4 & 5.

Volume 5 I endured as the series was published, but looking back I find I remember the stories and characters fondly, and actually enjoyed some parts of it. Or at least my memory filter now says I did. It's probably my second favorite.

Volume 4, very surprisingly, got my vote. I'm surprised because I despised the darkness and destruction of 5YL. I couldn't stand Legion on the Run. I despised(!) the Blight. I hated the art on all of them. And yet, these stories are by far the most memorable to me. Not in a nightmarish way, but because, I suppose, of the way they caused me to engage more deeply with both the story and the art.

Funny that Volume 4 hardly represents what I love about the Legion.

Suddenly I feel schizophrenic.

And so far, V4 has half the vote! So of 26 voters to this point, many must have felt most engaged with it for various reasons. It's also, by the way, the longest of the 7 volumes by a lot. (V2 would be longer if you count the pre-259 co-starring issues and its run as "Tales..."

Still, no love for Vols. 5, 6 & 7 in the poll!

For some reason, though, I feel the need to concur with LT that Vol. 5 wasn't ALL bad. I pretty much enjoyed all of Shooter's run, honestly. Too bad about Justin Thyme, though...

Vol. 6, I felt, was going pretty well until the extra pages were taken away. I think Paul was telling pretty entertaining stories with the extra space. I think cutting down to 20 pages made him equate with cutting out the "extraneous" things that we used to love about his writing. Loved the annual, too!

Vol. 7.....almost a total train wreck. That "day in the life" kind of issue with Walt Simonson was very good, though. Probably because it devoted a whole issue to the kind of stuff we wanted from Paul all along. Otherwise, almost completely forgettable.

that simonson issue is the only issue I have of that volume!

reminded me of volume 3.

No question, that gets my vote for least favorite Legion thing ever.

Well, logically, Vol 4. is the only representative of two separate runs, so It makes sense it's pulling ahead since both have their ardent fans, as daft as they may be (**ducks**). Whereas the Levitz era straddles Vol.2 & 3.

Someone dug those the reprints though.

Interesting that V2 is so far trouncing V3, despite both being part of Levitz's acclaimed run. Perhaps we should be giving more credit to some of the other creators who've worked on the Legion, and whose work appears in v2!

I agree. I will do so right now.



How so? Because I think v2 is far more dated. Giffen's pre-Omen art might have looked impressive thirty years ago, but now it looks underwhelming, and the drab coloring doesn't help either.

People complain about the garishness of the coloring in v3, and while I do think it wasn't suited for certain comics, it did fit the LSH like a hand in glove. And I also think Greg LaRocque and Steve Lightle both trounced any version of Giffen soundly.

As for Levitz's writing on v2 and v3, I find it pretty much the same throughout, except for the last year-and-a-half (Conspiracy through Magic Wars), where I think there's a steep decline in story quality.

Is that a case of the John Byrne Superman reboot sapping the energy out of the series? or a combination of that & Paul Levitz burning out. In hindsight would it have been better to reboot the Legion at the same time as the Superman reboot?

I would have been fine with that.

I thought Conspiracy was generally held in good regard? Been awhile since I read it.

Anything with Lightle and Larogue was high on my enjoyment list and the run of covers was astounding.

Running with LT's comments, I also can think of a few storylines that on my first read, not such a fan. One he mentions he still doesn't like but I now love would be the Blight storyline and Widening Rifts.

While 5YL was my vote, I believe another dark era as presaged by the destruction of the star gates would have killed the franchise AND cost us Lost, a terrific story.

I don't know if it was Paul Levitz burning out or Giffen coming on board with such horrible art and the complete redesign of all of the team's costumes that I hated most at the end of that run. Giffen's artwork really made it hard for me to look let alone read Levitz's storytelling. That's one thing I was thankful for in the Retroboot era, all of Giffen's costume designs had been replaced!

I'll second that. And I'll vote for the reboot when I see it on the list above.

I agree with you 100%.

I will third that. The Threeboot was completely unnecessary, and it turning into a wasted opportunity was just pouring salt on the wounds.



I agree that the art contributed, and I also felt less satisfied with those last few stories for some reason. There were also a lot of changes happening then, with what felt like the slow disintegration of the team (Shady and Mon, Quislet, Nura, Brainy, Mysa all departing in short order).

I enjoy the occasional costume change. I don't recall the specific changes in this case but I also don't recall particularly not liking the costumes in that era.

So, thus far, 41% of those polled prefer the 5YL/Reboot Legion?

Apparently, there's nothing like a threeboot and a failed reworking of the original to make people appreciate the reboot series.

Gotta love the irony!

The early reboot was fantastic, and the middle era wasn't bad either. It didn't start going south until after LSH # 100.

For all of it's critics, that "era" did last a decade; far longer that the Threeboot or the current Levitz run.

I think the Reboot had more extreme highs and lows than any other period in Legion history. The first two years of the Reboot are almost flawlessly fantastic and I will fight to the death anyone who dares to tell me different. The first two years or so of the DnA era (particularly Lost) are also some of the best Legion stories ever IMO.

But then you have the absolutely abysmal dreck that was a lot if the rest of it, in particular the Team 20 arc in LSH, both books after the Team 20 arc ended (especially the Dark Crap Rising period), and everything DnA wrote after Worlds.

I LOVE the Reboot, but there is a LOT I would have liked to see done differently too.

(Hey all you Postboot fans - check out the Re-Reading the Postboot Legion in my signature please! Would love to get a discussion going!)

I prefer the Reboot to any other volume, but that's partly because it's the Legion I grew up with. I also have to acknowledge that it wasn't perfect. Still, I'd argue it was a lot better than the Threeboot or the latter part of the Retroboot.

The portion after the Team20/30 arc was lackluster, but not flat out terrible. At least you didn't have Legionnaires getting maimed or killed, and there was still some character development.

The portion DNA wrote after Worlds could have been better. There were a lot of dangling threads, poor pacing, and a lot of irreversible transformations (Ferro can't iron down, Naga Sensor, Terrorform Zoe and the monstrosity that was Jarth) but nothing irreversible.

I will never understand how two grown adults who actually make a living out of thinking up interesting ideas and turning them into compelling stories could *ever* have come up with a plot point like... <shudder> ... Jarth.

In a way, though it also had to be radically retooled halfway through because sales were in the crapper. If you split it into the DnA era and the pre DnA era, then they have about the same five year lifespan of every other post Crisis incarnation of the Legion.

The pre-DNA era may seem longer to some, because there were two monthly books being published then.



Upon receiving every issue after Jarth and Terrorform Zoe showed up, I would turn the pages quickly in the vain hope that their transformations would be reversed

My pick is easily Vol 2, then Baxter, the first stories, then vol 6.

Five Year Leap was and still is too destructive and too negative in its stories and depictions of an optimistic future of heroic teens for me to care for. While it did have some points of interest (I enjoyed Mordru's zombies and the Khund Legionnaires) the fact is this series was totally built on the foundation of previous told stories but burned those bridges down as it 'progressed'. This storytelling style can only be short term at best and obligated the reboot that eventually came which is now an addiction the Legion has since been consumed by.

Gah! Can't choose, because I am...Indecisive Kid!

The Adventure Run gave us the core characters and concepts
The Superboy stores kept it all alive in the 70s.

The Levitz run (both 2 & baxter)brought depth, characterisation and subplots to everything.

The 5YG used the concepts of Adventure and built on the shoulders of the Levitz characterisation. But was derailed by fill ins and editorial.

Post Zero-Hour made it all fresh again.

Abnett & Lanning gave the book some edge back.

Waid took it out in a very new direction.

Johns brought the Legion back.

choices, choices...

Ah, but vol 1 is just some of the Adventure run, so that gets me off the hook there.

My favourite moments were in the 5YG. But the best run for me was the Levitz one. Since vol 2 will have some icky pre Levitz things in it, I'll have to plump for vol 3.

that...was...tough...

Voting ends tomorrow, for anyone who was intentionally waiting for the last minute or something.

A solid % of 5YG love, which is nice to see... even if that's not the one I went with.

I actually thought there might be one or two for the threeboot.