R.E.B.E.L.S. no. 2 came out yesterday, and much to my suprise, nobody else on Legion World seems to have posted a review yet.

This isn't a complaint, though, but rather, an expression of concern. My worry is that this apparent lack of enthusiasm for the new R.E.B.E.L.S. book may be a sign that people are begining to give up on all things Legion. The other possibility that comes to mind is that the Recession is causing people to hold off on buying comics. I hope that I'm wrong, but in either case, I can't blame anybody--especially in light of the fact that DC Comics seems to be hell-bent on disappointing its Legion fans these days, Legion of Three Worlds notwithstanding.

Anybody else have any thoughts on the apparent lack of enthusiasm for issue no.2 of R.E.B.E.L.S.?

For what its worth, I thought that it was a pretty good issue, from both from the story and art perspectives.


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I was really happy to see Vril Dox make a visit to StarHaven. I only hope, though, that the writers don't take the LSH roster duplication premise too far (the display of a Wildfire type of suit in the last panel worries me a bit), as originality is a key to success, IMO. Toward that end, I like the fact that Wildstar's personality does not initially appear to mirror Dawnstar's.

Anyway, I think that I've said enough for now. Cheers!

It was a nice way of them to combine the personas of Wildfire and Dawnstar, if not completely.

Yeah, surprised no one did a review, too. Anyway, loved the moment where Brainiacs 2 and 5 argue about the formation of the new R.E.B.E.L.S. team. Also was fascinated of the names and homeworlds of the bounty hunters and the their apparent 31st century analogues:

Getorix of Zaron = Tharok of Zadron
Amon Hakk of Khundia = Tyr of Tyrraz
Skwaul of Hepvestus = Tellus of Hykraius
Tribulus = Validus
Wildstar of Starhaven = Wildfire of Earth / Dawnstar of Starhaven

Can't wait until the whoel team is assembled.

A review from IGN . I haven't read the issue yet, but it sounds pretty good. Maybe the #2 issues never get as widely reviewed as the #1s?

It's been OK so far. However, linking it that much to the moribund threeboot may not be the best idea.

And of course, the files don't seem to represent what we know of the threeboot... Fatal Five, Dawnstar...

It's possible that his files cover all THREE Legions.

At this point, I'm reading it for Dox. Most of the other characters are a bit one-note.

I also came up with my own explanation for the acronym:

Really
Egotistical
Bastard
Enlisting
Legionnaire
Surrogates

What do you think?

Ha ha! I love it, Mario.

I liked it-- but I would've loved it if this were set 1000 years in the LSH's future.

I liked the first series, at least at first, for the most part, too. But I can't help wondering if these books very existence dilute the LSH's impact.

Hmmm. If you were Vril, which bits from Querl's files would you be aiming to incorporate into your organization?

I'd say visits to Trom, Imsk and Naltor would be *my* priorities- but that might be a bit straightforward, considering how Vril seems to be approaching the building of his organization.

Nice enough setup issues; the art reminds me quite a bit of Frank Quitely.

Wanting to see more of the original cast besides Dox and Hakk though. Omega Men = bonus! Even though I couldn't finish their last miniseries.

I'm looking at the page where Waidboot Brainy bestows his 'template'... the one where there's a crowd of spacey silhouettes behind him. Cham's plainly the Waidboot version (no antennae), but there's a girl at the forefront of the crowd who's wearing a cape and a skirt. That has to be preboot Duo Damsel/Triplicate Girl, doesn't it?

There's also a male figure with curly hair. It would have to be preboot Element Lad or Tyroc.

The other girl in the forefront has a bouffant piled up on her head, and has a cape.

Vril's scheming is on plain display, but Waidboot Querl's as much up to something as his ancestor.

It was a treat seeing the Encyclopedia Galactica entries again.

Not to mention Starhaven- which gets an origin and a somewhat troubling couple of pages.

love it!

i don't know how much i'd read into the legionnaire shadows... who knows how familiar the artist is with the other legion.

bedard get's all sorts of hearts for making a better explanation for dawnstar. my NA cohort and I felt a wave of relief when we saw the containment suit.

Does anyone else think, judging by how young the Princess looked, the Emerald Princess is gonna be a spoiled brat? That should be fun.

Actually, Hakk's appearances are breaking my heart, so far. He was a very noble character in the original book--especially for a Khund. Clearly, though, something that Vril has done in the past has caused Hakk to sink to the depths that he has.

As for the Omega Men, for me the only real Omega Men is the group that was intact before the Invasion. But having said that...I'll try to give 'em a chance.

I took her to be Supergirl.

Or threeboot Starboy

Threeboot Night Girl?

I'll pick it up today!
I can hardly wait ~ Starhaven!

ML ~ I can't imagine Vril being 'straightforward' on ANYTHING.

He 'fired' Lar because he was too independent and powerful!!
He ALWAYS trys to stack the deck, the stinker.

I feel the same way about # 2 that I felt about # 1 -- Bedard seems to be taking us somewhere interesting, it's just taking too long to get there.

I'm liking this series a lot so far. Perhaps the Legionnaire avatars will be kept in shadow until the whole fate of the Legion in L3W is finally resolved. Although it was 3boot B-5 who implanted them... it's strange that Vril's first recruit is not an ancestor of any of the current 3boot.

It fits with Vril's character to pick his first recruit based on the Fatal Five lineup.

I'm not happy about any kind of Wildfire-lite. My only hope is that Wildstar's containment suit somehow prompts a return to WILDFIRE in his orginal outfit. (or something that at least resembles the classic Cockrum design)

Oops... I guess I meant his 2nd recruit... Dawnstar's ancestor is not related to the 3boot Legion.

i thought it was ok, im worried its going to have "edgy" "realistic" characters like all the other books nowadays.

Vril is such a nasty character, really.
He's totally self-involved and self-serving, for all of his IQ, he's still very much stuck in his ID stage.
The Nazi hair and pants just add to the distaste I feel for him.

Originally, I could take him because he had such strong characters around him, some that aided him and some that opposed him.

So far, all I've seen are victims and future victims.
Wildstar is going to break my heart ~ I can tell already.
sigh

I'm loving this book!

Totally loving it as well. There isn't much in the comic world these days that gets me very excited and this is definitely one. Great pacing, dialog and excellent artwork -although Clark could use some work on his rendering of wings, judging from the suit Dox is going to toss Wildstar into, that shouldn't be something he has to deal with much in the future-wings ARE hard to draw. I really wish we'd be seeing more of Skual he/it intrigues me more than a Validus like character.

Really enjoyed the explanation of Starhaven. Something else else that I don't think was ever handled well before.

I have to say I'm WAY more into this than I have been anything else Legion-related in the last several years. Long Live R.E.B.E.L.S!

Yeah, the way the wings were drawn was a noticable weak point. And the disproportionate size of Dox's feet sometimes, too. But those are minor points.

I'm kinda worried that a # 1 only came in at # 75 on the top 100 though!

72
22.51
NOVA #22
$2.99
MAR
25,065

73
22.23
SECRET SIX #6 (ORIGINS)
$2.99
DC
24,758

74
22.21
BOOSTER GOLD #17 (ORIGINS)
$2.99
DC
24,732

75
21.32
REBELS #1
$2.99
DC
23,739

76
21.23
GI JOE #2
$3.99
IDW
23,641

77
21.11
BRAVE AND THE BOLD #22
$2.99
DC
23,507

78
21.01
GREEN ARROW BLACK CANARY #17 (ORIGINS)
$2.99
DC
23,392

79
20.89
IMMORTAL IRON FIST #22
$2.99
MAR
23,259

80
20.66
X-MEN ORIGINS SABRETOOTH
$3.99
MAR
23,002



(damn... SECRET SIX is a helluvalot lower than it should be too!)

Are Legion and Legion-related books cursed or something? This is exactly the sort of thing that initially made me start this thread. Oh well, hopefully good word-of-mouth such as ours will heighten interest in the book.

not liking it one bit

i thought issue one was good

but wild star????

come on...really?

Finally got around to reading this issue!

I found it enjoyable, a little boring but they are still setting things up. I'm hoping once he gets his team together things will start picking up pace.

Looking forward to #3!

I sort of assumed that the wings were drawn like that on purpose - that they weren't fully developed yet, and it'd take another 1k years to result in people like Dawnstar.

Maybe vril does has access to ALL LSH files and can't be bothered finding a Dawnstar AND a Wildfire, so he's altering one person to do both roles...?

I think it was a big mistake to name the book after a less successful previous series than the more appreciated original L.E.G.I.O.N. Or maybe I just want a monthly with Legion somewhere in the title.

Yeah, dot-LEGION lasted 70 issues plus annuals, and dot-REBELS lasted, what, 15-16 issues? (if that)

i thought rebels was a planned arc of 16/whatever issues? i didn't read it going "this obviously got canceled", i thought "complete arc!"

Wildfire is a fluke of nature, an accident.

Dawnstar is part of a traceable race on a specific planet in a specific place.
Vril could go looking for someone like her with some hope of success.

Making a Wildfire will require work on his part and may not work even with all his brilliance.

And I don't think that Wildstar has to be/look anything like Wildfire, since she's not the same character, at all.


I agree veve, I thought R.E.B.E.L.S was a story arc that ended, too.

IIRC, dot-REBs was never listed as a mini or maxiseries.

bedard said on his forum that he needs a tracker to find the other people for his team. i am very pro her-not-looking-really-offensive and futuristic instead.

That's true.
But it couldn't go on forever, could it?

Even the 'Fugitive' had to come to an end, by it's very nature.

Either way was okay with me, since I wanted the baby/monster thing to end sooner rather than later.

I have to say I've decided not to get REBELS. I did enjoy issue 1 and was very intrigued, but my LCS didn't have any copies of #2 (when I finally got around to going, I think it had been like 6 weeks) and I wasn't too bummed.

Honestly I grabbed some issues of LEGION from back issue bins ages ago and enjoyed them, but not to the extent where I am really sold on this book for nostalgic reasons.

So if I see this around I might dip back into it, but right now I don't care enough to add it to the pull or work too hard to find the issue I've missed.

Again, nothing wrong with the book, issue one was really interesting, but budget is budget and with some other big things coming down the pipe REBELS just isn't on my priority list.

Well, I finally read #2 last night and once again really liked it. Dox was being awesome as usual, and I actually quite liked the pace. I think Bedard is much more comfortable here than in the last few titles I've seen him on.

Hopefully the sales remain steady though. By going with the REBELS name, DC does risk tanking the series.

When the original L.E.G.I.O.N. title switched to R.E.B.E.L.S. following Zero Hour, the title actually tanked pretty quickly. Sales plumetted and the IMO the quality began to slip and the title quickly was cancelled. In those days I was just starting to read every title DC produced...

i like the dialogue and art. the criticism "too long to get there" is very true.
i also need some reason to think of Dox as a hero on some level.
so far i only see villain. maybe we need to see more of his planet clients wanting him back as protector...?
-Skual hasn't made a cover. is he doomed?
- the cyborg controlling Tribulus was WAY too much of a rip-off of Tharok controlling Validus. too much of a coincidence.

a couple plot gaps:
-how did Dox learn about Dawnstar from threeboot Brainy?
-why did he make his containment suit in a female form. he didn't know he was going to find a female with tracking powers on Starhaven.

My opinions are similar to many here. Good, exciting story!

and while I love the Legion stuff I always worry it will be taken too far.

Wildstar? Getting put in a Wildfire type of armor? I am trusting it so far because Bedard definately made Wildstar different. She is no Dawnstar clone. She appears to be the town's old crazy lady with a bad wings and a bad leg. I hope she keeps that in the armor.

Highlights of issue #3...

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
.
.
.
.

The debut of Wildstar -



With wings -



Strata and Bounder join -



Omega Men strike -

FYI, as you may have noticed, I've renamed this thread so that we can continue to dicuss R.E.B.E.L.S. without starting a new one (in the interest of bandwidth/server memory space, etc.).

Anyway--as Nightcrawler's post above clearly shows--R.E.B.E.L.S. no. 3 came out today. The art was fine this week, but the story was only okay, I.M.O. Please read below for specific comments/spoilers.


***SPOILERS!***

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I'm suprised how well WildStar took the destruction of her physical body. Personally, I'm not crazy about the attempt to merge the attributes of DawnStar and Wildfire into one superhero, though.

On the other hand, it was nice to see Strata again, although I hope that she gets a nicer outfit in the days to come.

As for the new character, Bounder, he's just plain weird, and a bit hard to describe. Suffice it to say that his natural physical state seems to be a rough sphere composed of a variety of oddly shaped pieces, and that his power seems to be the ability to mimic the shapes of other around him ala Chameleon Boy--albeit while maintaining his own colouring and texture.

Anyway, I'm still looking forward to reading this book; I just hope that future team members aren't too bizzare or won't hew too closely the future Legionairres.

I really enjoy the facial expressions Clarke gives Vril. Almost makes me like the character.

I like the look of Wildstar, if not her name or the union of Drake and Dawnstar that she is conceptually. If she'd been a farther future Starhavenite, I'd think she was inspired. But in the LSH's distant past? Not so much.

The depiction of Starhaven kind of bothers me. Everything takes place inside-- fine, that's different from the Starhave we've been shown before. Here, the 1000 years before the Starhaven we 'know' works for the creators. Starhaven is, perhaps, not fully terraformed yet?More is undeveloped than the 'Havenites tiny wings. The general attitudes we see (all male?) towards a problematic member of their community are as stunted as the extra limbs sprouting from their shoulder blades.

It was good to see Strata again, and nice to know that her husband's alive. Bounder looks interesting, if somewhat too similar to Wildstar (when not bounding).

Who'll be next?

And what'd you think of the reveal at the end? I was surprised, but things seemed to fit.

I have to confess, I'm losing interest in this book, for a few reasons.

First, the slow burn of putting the team together. It's a valid storytelling technique, but it's also one I've come to dislike.

Secondly, Dox's characterization. He's a Magnificent Bastard (ref. tvtropes.org) but he's not showing it. Instead, it's all "travel to location A, recruit team member B, make snarky concept C."

If Bedard cranked up the action a notch or two, and made Dox more arrogant than passive, I'd keep reading. But for now, it's WFTT.

I can't really add much to what's already been said about the new issue, except that, like Mystery Lad, I'm glad that Strata's husband Garv is alive. Back in the day, I had a crush on Garv -- he's tough but sweet -- and I hope we see him in this book eventually.

***SPOILERS!***

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Sorry, it was late when I wrote this, so fatigue and an overly hasty reading made me misreport Bounder's power (I was fooled by the fact that his humanoid form bears a passing resemblance to WildStar's). Anyway, his power more accurately is to form a bouncy sphere, much like Bouncing Boy can. Unfortunately, this does nothing to endear him to me because he's still bizzare and grotesque, in my opinion.

Having said this, I'm still willing to give Mister Bedard a chance because a) this is only the third issue of R.E.B.E.L.S., and b) he's produced some good work in the past on the LSH book.

Strata's coloring and texture are sort of wrong.
(I got the comic yesterday and she doesn't appear quite so gray and pebbley in the paper pages, but she's still not 'herself'.)

She lost the grayrock look when she matured into an adult Dryad female.

She should be 'cut' like a gem and glitter whites, pinks and purples, if I remember right.
She said that that's how she knew she was a female.


I love Strata and Garv, so I'm glad to find out that they married and have a baby together.


Will Wildstar were the suit all of the time or is it mostly for spaceflight?
I like her.

Vril is too much of an unconcerned user of others to ever be a hero, imo.
I dislike him intensely, which was why I was so unhappy with the 3boot version of Brainy 5.

Querl might have been distant and sometimes clueless socially, even crazy sometimes, but he never disregarded the lives and futures of his teammates.

well, for all that people are saying that vril is JUST horrible, etc, i think he's actually being pretty honorable in the sense that he keeps saying "i have contracts with all these worlds to protect them and i'm going to do that". i know he's definitely a jerk, but everything he's saying and doing, to me, feels like he's very much in a hurry. don't get me wrong, he's a jerk, but he's not a coward that runs away and hides!

bedard said strata's look is an intentional redesign. i don't mind how she looks either way. maybe she just went through yet another phase? anyone catch the mention of a baby? <3 <3

i don't see the "slowness" everyone's talking about... i have to say i'm used to reading manga where things happen much more slowly, but you're either reading it in a weekly tiny format or reading it in a 180 page trade so you don't notice. to me, this is still not slow, something happens in each issue, there's a fight in every issue. this time there was a raid on maltus, we learned who the bad guy is, we recruit two more members.

to me, this is a very nice pace. it's frustrating because it's monthly, but i think the quality of story is better. i hate stories that are so compacted that you don't feel like you're in the moment at all.

i was VERY VERY happy with wildstar's reaction to her new body. one of my biggest pet peeves is someone being saved from something debilitating or damaging and then whining about. that horrible bionic woman show really angered me for that reason: "you were in a car crash but i saved your life with science, and you look exactly the same AND you're really strong and powerful." "YOU MADE ME INTO A MONSTER" "....what?". her being grateful and happy that she doesn't have to put up with crappy body and crappy jerkface people anymore is SO refreshing!!

i loved how she immediately told vril to get behind her when they were threatened! she didn't ask "what should I do", she immediately tried to protect him! how great is it that we can already see her inherent heroism!

i also liked that bounder and strata both behaved appropriate and not like crazy people just for the sake of a fight. bounder immediately said he didn't want to hurt her because he wasn't sure of the circumstances and was very friendly. Strata too, she obviously wanted to smash vril's face but has the sense to start talking about things.

Nobody has mentioned how female-centric the book is so far... plenty of female heroes and female villains.

Pardon my ignorance but what is S.T.A.R.R.O?

i think it's totally new!

Overall I'm enjoying the book but one thing I don't really like is that all the characters are based on pre-existing Legionnaires. Not only does this mute any excitement and sense of wonder I might have towards their introduction, it pretty much hurts the Legionaires these characters are based on.

Overall the book has been an enjoyable read but the entire concept of Wildstar was pretty much a dud to me....wasn't exciting at all.


I really don't want to see the entire Legion cannon ripped off and placed in the 21st century...they've already hurt the Legion substantially by retconning all of Shooter's alien races into 21st century.

The Legion needs to have it's own unique villains and characters as it's extremely difficult for them to stand alone as it is much less when there is a 21st century version of them that has the advantage of being totally integrated with the main DCU.

I hope they don't intoduce one more character based on a Legionnaire...the Legionnaires are the originals, they should not be retconned into the imitations.

The medium was built and will only survive on imagination and creativity...why not just create new characters instead of making imitations of the old ones? This is the same problem that has plagued the reboot Legions IMO as well. Let the originals be the originals and when new characters are created make them new and unique, not imitations of the original Legion...

Totally agree with this. I don't mind the idea that *some* of the worlds have been established as existing in the 20th century, such as Durla (which is post-apocalyptic in the 30th), but having every Legion concept, including Starhaven, an *obvious* Earth colony, exist in the 20th century (when Earth doesn't yet have colonies!), is just a bit ludicrous.

I know it isn't hard coming up with new characters that might foreshadow stuff in the 30th, such as a person who was modified / possessed by Brainiac and ends up with a super-intelligence, *who isn't Coluan,* or a Thanagarian mutant or super-person with spacefaring abilities who kinda, sorta looks like Dawnstar if you squint just right.

I think that Vril wants his .LEGION back because of the power it brings him.
He's found his niche and he wants to keep it.

He's not evil like his father, but he could care less about anyone but himself, imo.
I know he's that way because of his egomania and control freak issues, but that doesn't make him any more palatable to me.
Or heroic.

I like that Wildstar is a hero at heart.
I like the character, that she was plain and hanicapped and outcast.

What I don't like about what Vril did is that he DIDN'T discuss what he wanted to do with her, first.
He didn't explain that she would be in a containment suit for the rest of her life, for one thing.

That she'd never touch anyone again.

She's not super smart, but he took all of her choices away from her.
Later, he said that she could save billions.
But he'd already taken away her chance for self- sacrifice.

For all he knew, her reaction might have been like some of the early RoboCop transplants shown in the movie.
I remember especially the one who pulled the top of his metal skull off because he couldn't bear to be a machine.

Addressing the LSH worlds and LSH characters, I've read a number of SciFi books about the Anasazi, where the author had them taken away from Earth by various aliens or gods.
I worked for me.

SG-1 is ALL about humans taken from earth as slaves to alien masters and surviving on the various planets
.
Enterprise found a colony of western cultured humans on a far away planet, too.

In fact, the concept of other worlds that are either human or are humanoid, is the theory behind the creation story in Next Generation/Star Trek.

I have absolutely no problem with DC employing it's own take on these ideas.

And I don't see how any of it detracts from LSH.

I read a lot of generational type series (and WATCH generational series) and I enjoy all of the human connections throughout history, whether fictional or historical.

I love that Rahab and Ruth have stories that connect them to David and that David is connected to Jesus.
I think it's called geneology.


I just don't get the view that the Legion has to be isolated from DC history.

It's certainly not natural for cultures, or people, to be totally disconnected from their roots!

Best thing about issue 3: Strata's back and Garv is alive! Yay!

WildStar's energy-wings looked pretty cool.

I'm not leaping with excitement about the book but it is maintaining my interest thus far.

Me, too!

Yah, I LOVE the femaleness of REBELS.
.LEGION was like that, too.

I'm not sure, but isn't STARRO a very old, Silver Age, villian?
It used to be in the Justice League stories, for one, I think.

At least, there was a giant seastar-from-outter-space kind of villian before, that had a lot of little ones that would attach to 'peoples' backs/necks and control them.

I'm still loving this book.

yes yes we've had "starro" but i don't think we've ever had "S.T.A.R.R.O.". .starro, if you will. but maybe that was just to play on the title of the book and it's really just a plain old starro hooked up to a cool looking lady??

you know, even though these characters are supposed to be inspired by LOSH people... i don't really see it that much. i mean, strata's an older character, bounder has similarities to bouncing boy but i'd never confuse the two. i mean, if he hadn't said "inspired by LOSH" i wouldn't have put much together. i mean, how many stupid powers are there? "strong-rock-thing" is block, is strata, is Marvel's Thing, is frigging Rock Bite from neverending story, is stone boy.

like as of this issue i was like "oh ,well that's the end of that inspiration bit". except for when that tiny emerald empress kid we saw shows up (maybe?). all of these characters seem like a bit of a stretch to get to their equivalents, i think they all have original aspects going for them. i don't see this as "retconning" or "ripping off" if the plot is "here are the legionnaires, use this!". it's not like bedard is pretending he invented the legionnaires, THAT would be ripping it off.

think of it as trying to give you some hook to grab onto with all the new characters. "well i know who dawnstar is, this will give me some help understanding who this new person is". and i appreciate that he's rooting them in the cosmic DCverse, i like it when one characters knows of planet A and in another book someone else knows about Planet A and when they GO to Planet A, they have consistent experiences.

I am enjoying the series so far - I knew Tony Bedard would do a great job on this title. The art work is right up my alley as well; clean, with neat tech images and complete backgrounds. I look forward to the next issues.

My only gripe mirrors Superboy and Set. The new REBELS introduced so far seem to be composite Legionnaires: Tribulus = Validus or Lightning Lad/Colossal Boy, Wildstar = Dawnstar/Wildfire, Bounder = Bouncing Boy/Chameleon Boy, Strata = Blok/Ferro Lad. This template is called X-Men, where the membership is compressed to a handful of members with multiple powers, and is contrary to the Legion, which is numbers, numbers, numbers!

I hope the Omega Men stick around and serve as some other recruits: Tiggorr = Timber Wolf, the Tammeran = Sun Boy, the Biotech Guy = Gear, and the Energy Cloud (Odu?) = Quislet*

*My apologies, I am not as familiar with the Omega Men as I should be, and don't have the actual issues with me right now to have their names straight!

PS - Broot looks too much like Strata, but otherwise, awesome art! Another vote here for seeing Garv in the near future.

on wildstar's lack of consent: again, i felt like it was the "lack of time" issue. and, no i'm fully aware that he's a horrible man but considering his back story, i think it'd be out of character for him to ask or explain fully first. these past issues he's been very "hurry hurry" about everything. he even tell's strata to just come with him and that he'd explain on the way (which doesn't apparently work, he ends up having to explain the situation there).

he does comment that her pain "only lasts a millisecond" and "i changed her form a cripple to a goddess", which is SO...cute to me because he's very much that "missing the point" type of person. hahaha. another interesting point is that QUERL (!!!) thinks vril's out of a line a couple times in this. Vril's response that "you didn't ask me first!!". i think there's a conversation between a pot and a kettle we could mention.

and ANOTHER characterization point is that as upset as wildstar is, she is concerned/weirded out that vril's talking to himself. she seems to be pretty happy at the moment and also seems to have focused on helping more than anything, but eventually? yeah it'll probably cause a lot of turmoil and sadness for her.

it takes a LOT of violent threatening for him to spill, and part of these kinds of stories is waiting for the end to know everything that's going on. that plot structure is good when you have a character like Dox that's such a horrible bastard that it's like pulling teeth to get information out of him (which i much much MUCH prefer to the very annoying and frustrating 'mysterious character' that you see used a lot in his place).

the omega men have been around for a good long while (1981 or something). again, i wouldn't take the correlations to legion members too seriously. at all. i think you'll lose a lot by overthinking and trying to stuff them into neat little legion-related boxes. quite frankly, that Tamaranian is much more "a boy version of Starfire (from teen titans)" than "sunboy". i think they're already differentiated themselves quite well.

bedard's said the omega men will be a subplot for a while.

speaking of, i think i linked to one of these on another thread but... here are links to a bunch of interviews he's done that i only found because i'm psychotic.

on warning, there are some spoilers about what characters will/won't/might appear so read at your own risk, ok?

Bedard Interview on Ain\'t It Cool News

Bedard\'s Interview on CBR\'s Robot6

Bedard\'s Interview with The Pulse

Bedard CBR "Reflections" Interview

Thanks for posting those interview links, very very; they were very very interesting.

I'll try to make time to get to those, too.


sigh
I don't think that Bedard is writing him poorly or that Vril isn't interesting, because he is.

I just don't like how he does things, in general.
And I don't want the other Brainy's to be a repeat of him.

But, Bedard is portraying Vril totally in character, I think.
And the artists are just fantastic.
Mystery Lad commented on Vril's expressions being so wonderful, and they are.
What an amazing team!

Vril's always been to busy to explain things.
And when he does, it's kept to a minimum, partly because he doesn't think anyone can understand and partly because he's got such intricate plots going that everything would just take too long to tell.

I've followed Vril through all of .LEGION and .REBELS for lots of reasons, but never because I thought he was a hero.

I don't think of him as a villian, either.

He's just a complete butt head who's blind to his own egomania and how that hurts him and those around him.

You can count me in as someone who enjoys the nod to the traditional Legion of Super-Heroes characters by the replication of their powers, somewhat, in the current REBELS.

LSH books are the only comics I read so it is a real pull for me when there is a connection like that. At least there aren't any actual Legionnaires in REBELS, unlike in the original LEGION where Phase (Phantom Girl) and RJ Brande were both members. In fact, I can remember enjoying Tinya's character so much more in LEGION than I ever did in the LSH stories

claude st. aubin is stepping in for the art on the next two issues (i'm assuming andy clarke was almost killed by both penciling and inking on the book and needs time).

check out some art from the next two issues here. but seriously, be careful because there are hella spoilers.

understood? ok:

robot 6 - claude st aubin art

DC\'s The Source - Claude St Aubin art

Not THEM again!
Ugh!

can I just be smug and point out I totally claled the Dawnstar/Wildfire hybrid that would be Wildstar?
I'm only doing this because I have NEVER guessed a plot point before and I'm quite excited lol
(let's face it, it was a bit of an obvious thing to do though.)
I liked her wings

I love stories with THEM! Next to Nazi's, they're probably my favorites to watch get their butts kicked. Just too smug.

Characterization of Vril is keeping me on and I like the art. Can't say I'm enthralled with the tight connection to Legion characters if that is to be all there is. Though I found imaginative how Vril came up with the plan, the original had a much better balance and created some terrific new characters while making great use of some lost characters. The lineage characters also worked well and became fan favorites.

Derivative characters just do not do it for me, take part A from this character and part B from that... I can see where someone might say, it sounds like a good idea, but then someone else (editor) should come along and mention that it lacks imagination.


I've had all three books in the house for three days and haven't finished reading them. Not a good sign.

Picked up issue three to read. One of the characters that I thought well done and with promise was Wildstar (derivative name aside). The cliff hanger on #2 was pure Dox, going to burn off those wings. Such a considerate guy.

Took exactly two pages into #3 for this series to "jump the shark" for me. I set it back down. Maybe someday I'll get back to reading it, but it won't be on a nice sunny day.

Can't recommend.

Read the first two issues. Am feeling very... eh about it. On the one hand, Dox is Dox and I like that because he's such an ass. But... I don't know how I feel about him using villains (or their ancestors or whatever)...

I'm intrigued by the idea of L.E.G.I.O.N. being comprised robots instead of living, breathing beings. It reminds me of the Manhunters, y'know? It just figures Vril would think he could outdo the Guardians. He's always trying to have his cake and eat it, too, that one.

I'm somewhat disappointed that Khund guy (gah, blanking on his name) hates Dox, though. I mean, everyone hates Dox (even Dox, I bet) but he was cool. And the way he shirked his heritage was really interesting.

I miss Telepath! And Stealth! I hope what he did and why are explained because I avoided a lot of the space-crossover stuff like the plague it was and requiring me to read it now to understand the series would definitely put a damper on things...

Thanks for reminding me -

Spoiler filled pages of #4 at the Source!

Also a look at the new Starro .

OMG! Claude St. Aubin's art is really, really good. And very compatible with Andy Clarke's, too. Based on the four pages of his work that I've seen on the link above, I'd welcome him back as a guest artist whenever he wants--or even as the regular artist if Mr. Clarke ever leaves the book.

So, I read #3, too. Am feeling a smidge less "eh" about it but not totally sold. Also, didn't Vril say he was going to get the Legion's enemies ancestors? 'Cause I sure haven't seen that happening as of yet. I mean, he's got that one monster thing but Wildstar is a Dawnstar/Wildfire composite and Strata's kinda like Blok, right? Or are there villains I'm forgetting?

On the plus side-- STRATA!! I <3 her. I remember when she turned pink and was like, "Hey, I didn't know I was a girl! Cool!" That was awesome.

Yeah,I loved that scene, too.

(Although, I remember it more like: "Congratulations, I'm a girl.")

Anyway, . . .
I loved Strata's lines in this issue!

Hate the shapeshifter (Durlan?)
I hope Tellus doesn't show up in REBELS if that's how she's going to treat telepaths!

Tribulus is obviously some sort of ancestor/thingy of Validus.
I don't think we've seen another villian type ancestor yet.
Well, maybe the Khund?

We've got an ampted-up Bouncing Boy, though!

This artist can draw the LSH, if he wants!
Gorgeous stuff.
It might be fun to have .LEGION/REBELS stories with a similar style of art to the Legion.
Talk about continuity!

Vril even said please!

It's interesting to compare R.E.B.E.L.S. with Lo3W.

Both have losts of 'guests' hogging lots of page space (Superman/Superboy/Bart/Yat & Supergirl/Omega Men)

Both have zillions of baddies and one villain controlling everything behind the scenes.

Clearly Johns and Bedard are using the same tactics to get readers to jump on (and hopefully stay). It will be interesting - in say 12 months time - to see who was most successful.

I'm still enjoying the series but can do without the Omega Men involvement.

Both artists are very good and have a consistent look between them but I really hate the overuse of the grey and blue color palette in the characters. The colors used for Strata, Bounder and Wildstar is so monotonous. Also, Broot and Strata are far too similar in appearance and power to be interesting in the same book.

I agree with what the Man from Cargg just said. Well, just to be clear, I'd welcome the involvement of the original Omega Men with Primus et. al., but the current incarnation of the group leaves me wanting. (Having said this, though, I'd be okay with Tigorr, Broot, and Darkfire joining the R.E.B.E.L.S. for extra flavour and team diversity.)

As for the R.E.B.E.L.S. themselves, I'm happy to see new members added, but am also looking forward to possible additions in the future of older members such as Stealth, Telepath, Captain Comet, or even Garrin Bek (with the Emerald Eye again, somehow). I do realize, though, that this is not yet possible at the moment, so am content to enjoy the ride as is for now.

Ultimately--presuming that Dox doesn't win L.E.G.I.O.N. back--I hope that the team comes to resemble Marvel's Star Jammers somewhat, as it sort of did (a bit) near the end of the last run of the book when Dox got a hold of that weird alien starship.

No one has posted this ?

Look's like Lyrissa Mallor will become a Black Lantern.

Vril will never stop trying to get .LEGION back.

But I love the Starjammer idea.
I just love the Starjammers, period.

I hope the pasty white gal looses the starro and joins the team.
She's got an awesome look.
Or was she killed?


And Psions.
They're right up there with Dominators, for me.
I just don't like them enough to want to read about them.

But then, I've never been a Starro fan, either.

Oh, and I agree, beautiful drawings with boring coloring.

I'm kind of expecting some if not all of the Omega Men to get incorporated into whatever group eventually forms.

Fine with me, since my preference would be for this team to be populated by characters distinct from 31st century Legionnaire makeovers. That said, I do want to see Dox's version of the roll call in his head. Knowing full well that once introduced they'll have to become part of the fabric.

Sigh. I always come back to my fundamental issue with this whole concept- which is fear that it endangers the niche of a 31st century LSH title.

It seems rare that a fill-in artist can live up to a good regular artist, but I think Claude St. Aubin is not bad at all. He definitely keeps with the tone of the book.

Personally, I don't at all mind the limited pallet as far as costumes are concerned. As far as I know, the L.E.G.I.O.N. uniforms are more or less black and white, so it kind of fits. And really, aren't there already hundreds of other comics with apparently colorblind characters clad in ridiculously gaudy costumes? Oh yes, there are.

I don't know if anyone else has made the comparison but the Starro spokeswoman sure bears a striking resemblance to another former L.E.G.I.O.N. member. Could she be related? I seem to remember reading something about him killing off every other member of his own race. I dunno. I'm no Lobo fan by any stretch and would hate to see him make an appearance of any kind but guess I'm going to have trust Bedard not to make me hate this book by bringing in that ridiculous tag-line ridden Wolverine parody. His sister however, could be interesting (as long as she never says "bastich" (shudder)).

Both of your points are well taken, Uranus Lad.

While I'm enjoying the art of both the regular and guest artists, I suppose that where they've fallen short, in my opinion, is in the area of costume design. For whatever reason, the styles of costumes thus far depicted don't appeal to me greatly, although in Dox's case the only change I'd like to see would be for him to lose the tunic he's currently wearing, or those horrible contrasting black pockets, at least.

And, if you're right about the new Starro minion being a Czarian, well, that'd be really neat.

I ment the coloring in general, when I was commenting.
I also think that the non-REBEL characters could be 'gaudy' or 'vibrant'.

I've always liked the .LEGION's black and white shceme but I kind of HATE Vril's currant Nazi look.

As for the other REBELS, I dislike that Wildstar's suit is mostly pink skin toned when, if they're going for a bikini look, she should have Amerindian golden tones.
I also don't care for the bikini look itself ~ it even seems out of character for Vril to have designed such a thing.
Maybe he was in a hurry, but I'd expect an updated suit pretty quickly since I'd think looking at it would annoy him.

BB's 'white' look is cool but Strata's is way too much like Blok's costumes.
I've always wanted her in something a little more feminine!


And yes, Lobo is supposed to have killed off the rest of his species, but it's a BIG universe!

I LOVE that you noticed the similarity in looks between the 2 characters!

I knew that she reminded me of someone but I couldn't place her with Lobo.
That would mean that even if she were killed this issue, she would just come back as her own clone!
Something else else even Lobo can't do anymore!


Unlike you though, I have a soft spot for his craziness and enjoyed Lobo in .LEGION.

P.S. ~ does anyone else hope to see Wildstar's energy wings slowly grow longer and fuller, until they're these gorgeous, giant, golden, flaring, knockout beautiful appendages that she can use like a cape or for unspoken comments?

I want to see them even when she's NOT flying, too.
:so there:

Me, too.

am not reading this title but took a peek at this thread. hope the tpb comes out soon... :-)

Issue no. 5 came out today; unfortunately, I forgot what day it was and didn't get it. I will tomorrow, though.

Meanwhile, I looked at the preview art on the official DC Comics site, and man, all I can say is that the first five pages of the book look fantastic!

I'll give a more detailed and informed review tomorrow. Meanwhile, does anybody else have any thoughts on no. 5?

This was the first issue where I could hear the wheels starting to spin. Not much happening in the way of storyline or character development. I feel like the playing field is a bit too expansive too quickly into a new series.

Yeah, I kind of know what you mean. Things are just starting to happen, relatively speaking (i.e. the overall future plot direction is beginning to become apparent).

Unfortunately, I noticed that Astrild Storm-Daughter doesn't seem to be Czarnian as some posters earlier speculated (her eyes aren't red like Lobo's). Ah, well; she promises to be an interesting character in her own right--and powerful to boot.

My only real concern about issue five is that there wasn't enough Vril Dox. Yes, I do realize that R.E.B.E.L.S. isn't called the "Vril Dox Story," but come on--he and his (almost evil) manipulativeness and cold calculation do make him the star of the show, as well as the natural team-leader.

Beyond this, I do have a mild quibble about the sign for L.E.G.I.O.N. headquarters being written in English rather than Interlac, but realize that this is a pretty "small potatoes" sort of gripe.

Over all, it was a pretty good issue with fantastic art, in my opinion. Well done, Misters Bedard, St. Aubin, and Hanna!

What's that frown for?

Just your avatar and quote make me laugh ~ you're so funny MB!

As for the REBELS, the art IS beautiful.

The gal's eyes not being red is a good catch.

I thought Vril's point about her inability to go to hyperspace without a ship was interesting and very Vrilish.

And the story is starting to get confusing.

Did the Durlan stay?
Is she a new member of Vril's group.
She's a murderer and I can't stand her.

I can only take so many of those types (the 'I hate them' type) before I stop reading a book.

And it looks like veryvery was right, it's Starro but certainly, a different version of it/him.

Gee, Candle, I hadn't even thought about this as a possibility. With all due respect to your concern about evil main characters, I must confess that this potential development fascinates me, since it would in some ways mirror the old Vril/Lobo relationship (i.e. Dox having to carefully "deal" with a potentially lethal team-mate)

As for the frown icon, it wasn't about me, but rather my concern that this iteration of R.E.B.E.L.S. doesn't seem to be a smashing success so far, at least in terms of widespread reader interest and enthusiasm. However, speaking only for myself, I intend to stay the course for as long as the book is published.

But thanks for the kind words. Cheers!

Yes, the Durlan/Vril dynamic might be interesting, especially given Vril's history with Durlans.
She's a leader, too.
And she's a she.
That might be interesting, too.

Since Vril has Querl in his brain, does he have the sheild belt in his mind, as well?
I don't remember him using one before but it would surely shift the dynamics in his favor.


Does anyone else recognize the body/sword ability from past Wildstorm, Marvel and Manga type characters?
Heck, even the Silver Slasher from the Legion?
Have we ever seem Cham do something like that?
Interesting.

Thanks for esplaining the frown, ML.


I just huff and puff sometimes.
I'm with REBELS to the end, too.

From what I've seen of the Sept. REBELS cover, the Omega Men are going to do some evolving!

Here's what I thought of the current issue

http://bottlecityofkanga.blogspot.com/2009/06/rebels-5-ticking-over-nicely.html

I'm missing Andy Clarke's pencils though!

Yes, Candle, it is a good thing that the Durlan is a strong female character. Personally, when she impaled that telepathic character the first precedent that came to mind was the liquid metal terminator, but that's just me. And I don't recall Cham ever doing anything similar, but then again, he's restrained by the Legion life-sancity code and his own sense of decency.

Ha! Ha! And your comparison of the Psions' facial expressions and Judge Judy is hilarious, BCoK.

No, that's a great visual.

I knew I'd seen it in real life, somewhere.
IF you can call a movie 'real life'.
Maybe I should say in 'live action', instead.

But, the scene(s) were really done on a computer, so, maybe I should change my statement to 'computer simulated live action as realized in a movie'.

sigh
This summer vacation thing is really getting to me already, this year.

Well, R.E.B.E.L.S. no. 6 came out again today, and as usual, I liked the art. The only thing, though, is that the "group shot" on the last page of the story made me realize once again that many of the character designs need to be altered--including their costume colours--because as things stand they're a bit bland, as others have already noted in this thread.

This minor quibble aside, it was very nice to see so many Encyclopedia Galactica entires on so many of the DC universe's alien races. What's more, the feeling that the plot is really beginning to find its legs that began last issue continued in this one.

*** SPOILERS!


*** SPOILERS!


*** SPOILERS!

One thing that I liked in particular is the fact that Amon Hakk (the Khund) and Ciji (the Durlan) are clearly a part of the team now--for the moment, at least.

Indeed, I laughed out loud when Hakk tiredly rubbed his forehead and said, "I hate him so much I can't think straight," and Dox replied: "Yes, I get that a lot." Bwah ha ha hah!

As for Ciji, I continue to get a kick, for some reason, out of the fact that she generally manifests herself as a young girl, even though she's a cold-blooded killer.

In closing, I must say that I was also titilatted by the group shot of the team (who all had very determined looks on their faces) that closed the issue, with Dox saying, "...we're going to need more help."

Oh, yeah, there was one more thing that also pleased me this issue: the fact that Dox ordered: 1) Silica to self-destruct, and 2) his robo-sentinels to contain the Starro invaders in a force-field cordron. Hopefully, this will mean that sometime down the road (after Starro destroys the robo-sentinels in breaking their quarantine of Maltus and the Dominion homeworld) L.E.G.I.O.N. will be staffed by flesh-and-blood officers once again.

You said LOTS of interesting things in your post, but I just have to shout an AMEN, to your statement above!

It is so Dox to want to use a big computer and robots, so that he thinks he has total control over everyone without any 'dramatics'.
sigh
At least 'people' would have put up a fuss of some sort when word came down to subjugate their clients.

The writer really knows his Vril.

Very true.

By the way, Candle, are your summer vacation blues still getting you down, or are you feeling better?

Thanks for asking, MB.


THIS summer is a little strange because I'm struggling with a couple of things physically, and I might not be able to go back to working with kids because of them.

I wouldn't be able to keep up with the little stinkers or see enough to duck at the appropriate times.
sigh

The Lord'll open a door if He closes one.
I'm just not great at trusting or waiting.

Thanks again, your asking made me tear-up!
xsxsxs

(snip)

You can see a grab from just-before-5YL Giffen (I think... ) here that shows something similar. Just scroll down about 2/3rds of the way.

(Looks like it would hurt the perpetrator as much as the recipient, if you ask me. Unless your powers include altering your body density along with your form -- or unless your opponent is just a Ziploc bag full of tapioca) but that's comics for you. )

It seems likely that if a Durlan can form bone, horn, nail and other hard tissue in it's various forms, then it wouldn't be overly difficult for the Durlan to shape it's forearm into a bone or keratin blade.

Partial shapeshifting like that is always creepier than turning into a complete creature, IMO. Might be an uncanny valley thing.

MB posted my feelings well enough with exception, I like the uniforms and I think the writer's deserve a slap on the head for being so slow getting the story to this point. Only the fanatics are willing to pay $15 just to get to the story and by that time, the marginals have dropped and the books are on their way towards cancelation. How f-in stupid is DC?

3 * (Very true)

with additional kudos for creating new characters with potential (that wildfire-dawnstar frankenstein aside).

Another fine issue although I thought the art or maybe the inking looked pretty sloppy toward the end of the issue. Not bad but certainly not as polished as previous issues.

I have no issue with the pace as the previous poster seems to. I like that we are getting to know the players somewhat and I think the fact that they aren't all cut-and-dried good or bad one dimensional characters is great. Each has their own motivations for joining Dox whether he manipulated them into it or not. That and I can't wait to geek-out all the new Legionesque recruits.

Ciji didn't look like the 'sword through the brain' manuver hurt her.

Perhaps, Durlans have more metals in their systems to work with than humanoids.
And/or maybe, they have a lot less water/fluids, as well.

Do they need to eat 'food' to survive?
We've seen Cham eat, but does he NEED to?

His clothes are a part of his skin, we're told, so he might live on direct sun energies or even heat radiation.

We've never seen him take on matter or drop it, when he changes shape, no matter how big or small he gets.
Maybe, his tentacled, swamp dweller 'true form' is as much of an illusion as his orange humanoid form is.

Just some thoughts.

And ~
about Wildstar ~ why do fans insist of there only being one form of Wildfire?

Am I interpreting your comment correctly, BB?
Or is it just the combination of powers or the ugliness of the suit or what?

I always think that a new reality opens totally new options for characters so that new stories can be told.
The more characters are the same as originally seen, the more 'locked in' the old stories become.
And why would writers want to tell the same stories over again?

Do I have that wrong?

Or is the Wildstar comment because she's in the DC time period that she's in?
Please enlighten me.

Yup, that's the 5YL Giffen era.
He repeated panel after panel ~ time saving technique ~ and shadowing out most of the face was another.
sigh

Major Spoilers is a great site, thanks for bringing it up.

Ciji must have 'scanned' a metal(like?) creature who could do that, since we've been told in the past that Durlans have to scan something before they can copy it.
Cham's looked organic, Ciji's didn't.

Cham became Blok (on the same page of that display), too, after all.
We've always known he could mimic inanimate objects.

Maybe she did see Terminator 2!

(Insert 45-minute ramble regarding possible differences between external appearance and internal structure here.)

In the end, it always ends up being whatever the current writer needs it to be. I've defended that in the past, and now I'm stuck with it. (When trying to figure out how to approach skillsets in my own fan writing, I usually read contradictory and/or vague accounts of same until my head explodes. Then I flip a coin and go write. Sometimes I have a beer first, which helps. )

Quote

Partial shapeshifting like that is always creepier than turning into a complete creature, IMO. Might be an uncanny valley thing.

See, that to me as a total "Aw, Yeah," moment. It's the thought of total disguise that has a much bigger "Yipe" factor for me if I let it.

(But I'm a collage maker when I'm not geeking out here, so that may have something to do with it. I once got into a near-shouting match at lunch with another artist when I insisted that the villain of Toy Story was really a hero who was the victim of bad press. )

(snip)

Yes, yes it is. My only gripe is that Peterson doesn't credit everyone whose art and writing he samples. Sometimes he'll mention it in his writing, but not always. It's confusing for those of us who've been through the fandom revolving door so many times.

Quote

Ciji must have 'scanned' a metal(like?) creature who could do that, since we've been told in the past that Durlans have to scan something before they can copy it.

Yep. I've wasted countless minutes wondering if a shapeshifter could mimic a person they'd only seen in a 2-D or 3-D image, or on the air. Possibly they could, but with the caveat that the mimicry wouldn't be convincing up close. Maybe it would look flat or insubstantial around the edges, etc.

Quote

Cham's looked organic, Ciji's didn't.

Ah, okay. I thought they were both organic in nature, but I only saw Ciji in action in the preview. Don't have the book in front of me, alas. That was a rare preview that actually made me sorry I couldn't run out and buy the book.

Is that a common complaint? Anyhow, it's not mine. I've no problem with mimics, there's only so many powers. I wouldn't want LEGION filled with LSH mimics but again, not my complaint.

I don't care for this character for the reasons I've stated; it's a frankenstein and derivative. The writer KNEW and I'd imagine wrote the character because it would be a mimic not just of two LSH characters but of two characters identified with each other. It's not imaginative, which isn't a crime but that it's a merging of Dawnstar and Wildfire makes it forced.

Also, IMO it was a poorly done origin. It's beyond my imagination that any living creature could so readily lose everything that made it living and adore the person that made it happen WITHOUT CHOICE. Vril could have said, I can make it possible for you to get out of here and be useful but here's what has to happen....

I think what was done was way beyond even Vril's characterization.

There's a light hearted moments potential right there.

I rather liked that they were 'brought together'.
It's a bit like poetry.
Something else else that can't happen, a love/joining that can't be, then, through art (Dox and Bedard) there IS a fruition.
Only before it happened, the other part.

I agree, totally and have stated so earlier (I forget the 'earliers' sometimes, sorry.)

But I don't blame Wildstar for that, I blame Dox and Bedard.
Wildstar is just who she is.
She hasn't fully realized what she is, yet.
When she understands, if she ever does, that he did it TO her rather than FOR her, we'll see what happens.

Yeah, we've certainly talked about it here.
With the blueray HD we've got nowadays, it's probably a piece of cake.

I'd scan the panel for you but I still need a printer/scanner.
The metalic part of Ciji's extension was what was so interesting about it, the weapons look.
Anyway, it's a minor point.
And you're right ~ it's always up to the writer(and sometimes the artist who just throws something in for the fun of it! Lightle told us he did things like that all of the time. )

I've always wondered about that, too. In the Marvel universe, one way this could be explained is to theorize that he's able to take on mass from some sort of extra-dimensional source at will, much as the Hulk is thought to automatically do when he goes from being human to being all green, muscular, and giant. In Cham's case, I suppose this would mean that he could also shed mass to some sort of extra-dimensional storage place when he assumes a form that's less massive than his true form, whatever that may be. Indeed, he wouldn't even have to necessarily understand that his power works this way in order to use it. Just a thought, anyway, which appeals to me because I think its kind of "neat."

Her wings were LONGER this issue!!!!!
Maybe even the other stuff, the ones that I've erased from the quote, will happen some time!!!

I like the idea of longer wings, too.

But do you know what else I think would help WildStar to look even better? A wig over her helmet so that you would just see her energy "face" under her bangs. Seriously.

Sorry, I was just giving some more thought to the comparison of Wildfire/DawnStar and WildStar. I just realized that WildStar is Wildfire in reverse.

Think about it. When Drake became Wildfire it made him moody and wistful because he had tragically once been a healthy, relatively carefree human who seemed to fit in well with his peers. WildStar, on the other hand, was a physically disabled woman with no real future or worth in the eyes of her peers. Accordingly, her transformation was an opportunity for her to enjoy wider horizons and make a positive difference in the world as a powerful superhero.

Small wonder, then, that she hasn't expressed any dissatisfaction with her situation, unlike Wildfire, who used to complain all of the time.

'Extra-dimensional storage source' works for me.
It sort of follows him around like an invisible pear wood trunk (with feet, of course.)
Neat is right!


Remember the Legion 1,000,000 AD story where the girl from Imsk (or was it Cargg?) carried her home system in a tessaract(sp) in a jewel on her forehead?!

Maybe, the mass storage place is like that and every Durlan is born with one or they get one inserted somewhere in their bodies during a religious ceremony after a certain age, like a rite of passage or something.
Cool.

Wings: I thought Wildstar was forming those using her power? She can make them as short or long or gone as she wants? Meeting her view of physical beauty due to her previous "disability?"

Or are they actually a physical part of her like legs?

I think that they're part of her power, yes (but her whole body is like that, now?), I don't know if she controls them consciously or not, though.
The times that we've seen her use them, they've been short and stubby, like her original ones.

This issue is the first that they've been long!

I'm not liking this book as much I ought to. But I agree with the general appreciation for Bedard's pitch-perfect Vril Dox. Making Starro look like a Frazetta/Mars character really doesn't do much for me. I don't mind getting away from the old giant Starfish look, but this seems very cliche and unoriginal. Along the same lines, and a key source of my meh-ness to this title, is that I don't think we've seen anything new from the DC alien races. Waid's 3Boot Dominator story pretty much ruined them for me for a long time. I don't mind seeing them as players, but I WOULD appreciate seeing some new and different side to them, and to all the other over-used alien races as well. As much as I want to see more space-based DC stories, I feel like this book has already gotten to late Next Generation/DS9 levels of cramped and predictable use of the same old aliens. One of the problems Star Trek had in its more recent shows is the strait-jacket of a crowded universe with predictable species. R.E.B.E.L.S. is getting there, too.

On the Durlan's powers, I've pretty much given up on their ever being a definitive and consistent use of Durlan powers. I figure that any given Durlan can do just about anything as long as it involves morphing part or all of their "bodies," even manifesting non-organic materials, duplicating a species' actual abilities, being the size of a skyscraper or a paramecium, or whatever. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.

I have enjoyed all six REBELS issues so far. The artwork has been top notch and Tony Bedard has done a great job mixing in plot, action, varieties of alien planets and races, guest appearances, and introducing new characters all at the same time. This is the template for how I wish the Legion title would be conducted and I wish Mr. Bedard had more of an opportunity on it during his short run.

I would like to see the Khund, Dominators, Durlans, Citadelians, Spider Guilders all fight over planet systems, with LEGION in the middle defending them. The occasional Starro-like infestations would be fun too.

I confess I was disappointed with the "revelation" that Starro is actually some sort of Molly Hatchet. Starro is one of the really cool, bizarre untypical alien badguys in starfish form, and to humanoidize him seems somewhat of a copout to me. Here's hoping it's just Lobo-tomy under all the horns and chain mail controlled by the Real starfish.

Also, the WildStar character as a composite of two Legionnaires is disappointing. It takes me back to the Peyer/McCraw Legion days when LeViathan and Triplicate Phantom Girl and Jarth all emerged in the mindset that X-Men type characters with multiple powers are the way to go. The Legion has been and always should be a large cast of characters with individual, unique powers who team together to compose a fighting force. There are enough fighting groups out there who rely on 7-10 characters. The Legion/LEGION should have multitudes!

It's funny that you say this, because the new Starro's colouration and muscular arms made think that he might be Lobo underneath, too...for a while. Then I noticed that they actually do show his face in this issue, and it's definitely not Lobo's.

Ah, well. I miss Lobo, as rotten as he was at times.

By the way, did anybody else notice in the final panel that Amon Hakk was mistakenly drawn with more hair than usual? Personally, I thought that it suited him, because to be perfectly frank, I think that his mohawk haircut looks kind of lame on him.

Ummmm.
We all pretty much think the same thing.
But, kicking around possibilities is what we're sort of, here for.
Not?

About the book:
The new leader-bad-guy (ugly cuss) has a large sized starro on his chest, doesn't he?

I just assumed he was just a little different/superior to the ones with a large starro on their backs.

I, personally, find Bedards revamp an inspired and workable take on an old, and rather silly, concept.

I DO wonder if Dox realizes that earth biologists have changed the old starfish name to 'sea star'.
So, should Starro, and spawn, be called void stars or space stars or . . .

Never mind.

On the negative side, I don't much care for the reworking of Strata's 'look'.
I liked her all 'blingy'.

The REBELS' costumes are fine black and white and yellow.
I just don't want the enemy in the same colors, for the same reason that two opposing sports teams don't wear the same colors.

I'm starting to lose interest in this series... fast. I will give it one more issue to grab me like the first few issues did... otherwise my comic life will just have to be an Adventure from now on.

(snip)

If we're not, I've been dO1n it wR0nG for a whole lotta' posts now.

Not to be negative, but at 12k copies per month this series isn't destined to be around much longer.

Oh well.
It's been nice seeing Strata again, even if she doesn't look like herself.

Maybe REBELS wasn't meant to be more than a year long chapter in Vril's life.
sigh

Sadly history shows that apart from the S, Bats, WW, Flash and GL no DC books can hold an audience even if they get one in the first place. Some creators, eg Johns, Morrison can lift sales but only while they are on the book. After that it is the big C for most titles.

There's a good interview with Tony Bedard over at Legion of Substitute Podcasters , in which he expresses lots of love for all things Legion and says "As long as Vril Dox is a jerk, I'm happy". Which made me happy....

Also he pointed out that their ship is based on Quislet's shape and that Lyrl will be appearing in issue 10 or 11 (I forget exactly which). After getting the 1st issue, I figured I'd wait for the TPB, but after listening to him, I may try and get the individual issues.

I knew there was something puzzling familiar about that spaceship! Cool design.

He's got an interview at Newsrama and here is my favorite quote:

Yes, re-establishing L.E.G.I.O.N. is what I want. And it seems the title will try pushing Blackest Night as a life-saver.

More here .

Good news to hear, Ricardo. Thanks.

Lyrl will be back!!!!!!!!!
That means Vril DIDN'T kill him!!!!!!!!!!
Woooohooooooo!
gonna dance

Woooohoooo!
gonna kiss somebody

Yeah, I'm lookin' forward to seeing Lyrl again, too. And all the other Legionairres, of course.

I don't want to rain on the parade, but could Lyrl be a Black Lantern? I'd much prefer him to be alive and functioning, but still wonder about Vril's admission of killing his son.

Oh.
poo.

So what did REBELS fans think of L.E.G.I.O.N. characters appearing in LO3W #5, as one of the Legions drawn to Cosmic Boy/Saturn Girl/Lightning Lad's Legion magnetism?

same as the other characters not strictly from one of the three Legions, put there for fans and maybe a desire to draw them.

I enjoyed seeing all the characters and didn't read anymore into those few pages than that.

Just read #6 and I think this was a turning point issue in which the pace picks up and things start moving to the next phase. That's good, as I think the book needed that; its been strong so far but could use an added boost.

I like the full cast and think Dox was particularly awesome here, with his ruthless destruction of Silica. You just can't help but find him fascinating.

Love seeing the Durlans, Khunds, Dominators and Gil'Disphan, plus all the Omega Men / Titans alien races. Bedard really knows his DCU galactic history & geography.

Despite Starro's 'new' / 'never before revealed until now' appearance being a huge let down, I think LEGION is one of the best sci-fi books going right now. I'm definitely hooked.

The one L.E.G.I.O.N.aire who wasn't there was the Durlan (RJ Brande) and of any he should have been.

I liked it. Basically I looked at it as extra credit by Perez, he did say he wanted to draw every version of the Legion. And they are a version of it.

Since they were drawing the Legions from different times as well as realities, made sense to me.

Hopefully the BN crossover will help the book...right now it's fighting Johah Hex for monthly sales placement, and that's not a good thing for a Superhero book.


I like this series and I like Bedard...but I personally think what he did to Starro...well sucks to put it bluntly, I honesly cannot think of a duller character change. And this definitely falls unver a peeve of mine about changing characters just for the hell of it. I do not see anything about this new Starro that is in anyway in the slightbest bit as memorable as the Big Starfish.

The Giant Starfish completely rules this Starro.


I'm thinking there's some kind of in-joke in this that I'm just not getting.

Starro the Conquer..er....Barbarian?

The other thing is I am still hoping he isn't planning on comprising the book of imitations of the major Legionnaires. I really think that is a horrible direction to go, not just for this book, but for the regular Legion and those Legionnaires as well. It's just thoroughly uninteresting to me. Bedard, as far as I can tell, is a very good storyteller, but his character creation ability isn't doing much to grab me. That change to Starro actually hurt the character a great deal IMHO.

And at 12k copies per month, they need to listen to any and all advice.

For Starro fans, this must seem like the Sneckie case, in reverse.

I know nothing about Starro (and don't really want to) so what they do/did to the character won't affect me so much. I suspect, there's more to it than "humanizing" him, but it may be too late to tell that story.

I'm fine with the BN connection for reasons others stated. Vril wouldn't let a powerplay possibility pass. As long as I don't have to deal with zombies, I'm fine.

RJ got killed on Earth 0 and he was a Durlan, probably THE Durlan from dotLEGION.
And the pull was from Lady Quark's time which was quite awhile after the Durlan was exchanged.

This Starro guy just has a larger Starro 'baby' on his chest/stomach than the ones on the backs of the talking Starro slaves.
And bigger still than the ones on people's faces.
But it's still not the 'Big SeaStar in the Sky'.

I don't think Bedard got rid of the original, it's just changed tactics since it's lost all of it's other bids for our galaxy.

At least, that's how I'm understanding the situation.

I hoe you're right Candle but I could have sworn I read somewhere that this is actually the Real Starro...that he was the one manipulating the Giant Starfish since all the way back in the first Justice League Adventure.

It's always been Starro's tactic to take powerful characters over to achieve his goals(like the Justice League for instance) so I wouldn't call this a change of tactics.

The tacticak change would be allowing certain characters to be conscious and manipulated rather than just manipulated.

Has Starro ever not covered faces in the past?
I'm not the Seastar expert, but I just remember faces covered and zombie actions.

And this is the only comic site I come to at the moment, so you could have heard all sorts of things that I haven't.

Candle, I think he's always been pretty much a giant starfish from outer space bent on Universal domination and that has drones that go on people's heads that gives him control over them.

Basically I always knew him as the giant starfish from outer space that was well above average in the power department and who had given the Justice League and even the Avengers some challenging fights.

I do think he has had willing, fully coherent(non mind controlled) minions at times though.


For a giant starfish from outer space he had a pretty impressive portfolio of appearances in landmark comic events.

Near as I can tell he was accepted as a giant starfish from outer space that had drones he used to control people in his quest to become ruler of the Universe or something. And people were generally happy with him being that and those that knew of him generally had fond memories of this silly yet important and memorable character.

There was no mass outcry to fix him. He was accepted and in some circles even respected and beloved as a giant starfish from outer space.


Now, I think he's a medium sized starfish bonded with some Conan type dude who controlled the gant starfish that controlled the drones...

A character that wasn't broken is now fixed and I don't see anything about this change that leads me to be believe it will wind up being permanent or as successful as the giant starfish incarnation of the character.

I just don't really understand why writers feel the need to mess with long established characters that don't really need fixing.

It's one thing if the character hasn't ever amounted to much, but Starro launched the original Justice League, was in the JLA Avengers crossover, has been utilized by many great writers, as a giant megalomaniacal starfish from outer space.

He's outdone anything Bedard or the DotLegion has done in the comics, as a giant starfish from outer space.

The only one of his kind, or at least the most famous.

And that's one other thing...It has been shown in the past that there are other giant starfish like Starro from the same planet as he, something this new origin seemingly contradicts btw.


This version of the character is not going to match the track record of the giant starfish. Nor is it going to turn him into the next Joker(or even Superboy Prime) widely celebrated by comic fandom as a genius revision...IMHO, it just makes his origin more convoluted, and the character less unique.

I don't really see the need to call him Starro. Just make a warrior character bent on galactic conquest, or use one of the many pre-existing space warriors bent on Universal conquest and let it live or die on it's own merits, not the legacy of past writers and landmark comic events.


I'm not really some sort of Starro purist or anything either...but I don't see what was wrong the giant starfish from outer space...he was good enough to launch the Justice League and appear in the JLA Avengers crossover...

And now he needs fixing?


He's been effectively Hawkmanned, Donna Troyed and Legioned now.



All that said, it's not the end of the world as there is absoutely no way this revision is going to stand up. In fact it probably won't even be noticed by anyone outside of the 12k reading the book and is likely to be undone the very next time he is used by a different writer...but there will be some confusion left over from this.

I do like the book and don't mean to sound like I am trying to shred Bedard. I just don't like this kind of revision and subscribe heavily to the if it aint broke don't fix it creed, probably because of being exposed often to this sort of confounding revision as a Legion fan by writers(or maybe it's the editors), more than any other reason.


It comes off to me as creative bankruptcy or some sort of glorified fanfic, by a fan more than a writer, personalizing a longstanding character to his liking and leaving the character the lesser for it as far as the rest of the fans are concerned.

I am thinking more like Lyrissa Mallor....or Lydea Darkstar (have not seen her in a while)...or some dead Omega Men members such as Demonia, Primus, and others.

Personally I would love to see Lyrissa back, instead of Lyrl.

Is that an oxymoron?

sigh

Sorry, Superboy, but I couldn't resist.

I hope Bedard isn't trying to 'change' the basic Starro concept, but rather, he hopes to 'expand' on the concept.

The bigger tummy Starro is just a more important substar than the others.
The big guy is still up there calling the shots and spawning the endless littler ones.

I don't think I ever really thought of Starro as a 'bad guy' though, more like a primal force/creature driven by instinct, in this case, to expand it's territory.

I guess only time will tell what Bedard's ultimate intensions are for Starro, but I hope, like you, that the seastar won't shrink to just a single warrior size forever.

Well, issue no. 7 is out, and I loved it. Loved it!

First of all the art was great (albeit with a few of the small quibbles that have been discussed in this thread before; this time, I disagree with the way the Oan Guardian of the Universe was rendered, but otherwise I thought that everything was great). In particular, three things really jumped out at me this issue art-wise: the design of the Dominion spaceship; the facial expressions of the Durlan, Ciji, because they revealed a lot about her character; and the cover itself. Mr. Clarke seems to have a gift for spaceship design, and the way he draws the little Durlan girl make her look so disarmingly cute at times. Did anybody else notice, by the way, that Ciji looked a bit fearful around Strata (probably because she can't physically hurt her)? And did anybody else think that the disapproving look/snarl she gave Dox in the final panel was priceless, too (obviously I did)?


SPOILERS!!!

SPOILERS!!!

SPOILERS!!!

SPOILERS!!!

SPOILERS!!!


In terms of plot and characterization, I also loved that we were given a good look at the world of Gil'Dishpan. Needless to say, its a really neat place, or more correctly, I should say that it was a neat place!

Speaking of which, it "blew me away" when the Dominion General blew up the planet. Besides the science behind this being really neat, what impressed me the most was Dox's utterly cold and logical approval of the act. That was so in character for him, as was Strata's utter horror. And in terms of new character development, I enjoyed Amon Hakk's newfound sense of antagonism and shaddenpleasure (sp?), too, and can't say that I blame him a bit for it.

Anyway, needless to say, I'm really looking forward to the next issue.

Cheers!

1) I really enjoyed the issue as well. The Dominator General is an interesting addition to the story, and looks like he may tag along with LEGION for a while. I expect the next member of the team will be a Gil'Dishpan 'porter who stowed away in the nick of time. That would get the whole crew around a lot easier.

2) I love the way the Gil'Dishpan were drawn. Their skin had the look of earthworms! Cool!

3) Anyone else missing Tribulus already?

Tribulus?
No, is he missing?


I love 'weavers' of energies in stories and the warp weavers are a wonderful addition to DC lore.

I hope that you're right and one (or more) tag-a-long with Dox.

And yeah, I really enjoy Clarke's work.
Those little ball creatures were interesting and imaginative, too.

SPOILERS!

<span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text">What does Harbinger have to do with L.E.G.I.O.N./R.E.B.E.L.S.? And when did Stealth die?!? She was alive and well last time we saw her.

This Legion has more than enough dead members and villains to be Black Lanterns - </span></span>

Lady Quark's not dead.

The Dominator General is a pretty good character, a yellow Dox. Pretty ruthless and goal oriented, heh.

Not sure I'm ready for the board rage though if Bedard does humanize that starfish. I mean, I don't have a dog in the fight but hate to see history trampled.

HAS to be a misdirection to cause angst.

<strike>I thought she died in Infinite Crisis? When did she come back?</strike>

Nevermind, looked it up...

So she did die in L.E.G.I.O.N. but was brought back in for INFINITE CRISIS unexplained.

They left her floating in space. That is about as reliable as falling down a canyon.

Ugh -- I might as well drop it now.

<span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text">I couldn't care less about anything having to do with "Blackest Night," and if they're going to drag this Starro thing that long and probably beyond, plus do some crossover thing next year, my interest in the title is quickly tanking.</span></span>

no no no that's so wrong......why her and her? I would love to see Lyrissa Mallor and Bertrob Diib come back as Black Lanterns! groan - can somebody ask Tony Bedard if he has read all LEGION series? Did he?

I'm kind of glad it's not Lyrissa eating people's hearts and licking their skulls.
ugh

I'm so sad to hear that <span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text">Stealth</span></span> is dead!!???
When did that happen????!!!

I guess we'll find out in the Black Lantern issues. There hasn't been any reference to that death before.

Although I was going to wait for the TPB, I cracked and got the individual issues - and loved them! Don't understand why sales are so abysmal. There's so much going on, with so many different cosmic characters (it needs a second reading). Enjoyed even the Gil'Dishan did I - and the first time I felt some sympathy for a Dominator. The Durlan girl is incredible - funny, so horrible, and a nice counterpoint to the (usual) bikini and garters bad girl.

Way back in issue 2, the depiction and new history of Starhaven was welcome. Were those crucifixes on the wall, though? I got a bit of a chill when Dox said, Serve me and you will be reborn... of course he has a god complex, but what has been interesting is how he adapts his message to manipulate people.

The living computer who loved him... like Brainy building the Kara robot. Something else else in the genes, I guess.

I am kind of wondering how even Dox is going to get out of this.

Another funny thing I noticed was how many females are on Dox's team (if you count the Durlan as female).

I seem to remember someone arguing with Dox about programing the computer, Silica I guess, to love him.
Or did he do that to someone else?
He tried to do it to Lydea when she first showed up, after she killed Lyrissa, maybe?

He likes to do that.
He thinks they'll do what he wants more readily, I think he said.

I wasn't looking for the crosses.
The real Anasazi, in our world (Earth Prime?) disappeared from their homes long before contact with missionaries so I just didn't think about it.
Good catch and a very chilling comparison.

One thing that disturbs me is that we've got all this interplanetary, faster than light travel and marvelous machines - so what's left for the future? It seems that almost no progress (in terms of technological innovation) is left to be made between now and the 31st century, except on Earth.

There is the idea floating around in DC history that some cataclysmic war in the 27th (or 25th?) century occurred which wiped out a lot of development.

2783
It's from a Shooter story about 'Soljer's Private War' in Superboy starring the LSH ~ 210 (25 cents!)
'He lived during World War VI -- a holocaust which nearly ended life on Earth ... a war of SUPERWEAPONS ... a war directed by COMPUTERS!'

Of course, that wouldn't have affected the reast of the DCU.

But something must have happened, perhaps yet another Crisis or 2 or 3 or . . ., that took away at least some of the worlds out there's powers of interstellar flight, leaving J.R.'s gates to open things back up and make him lots of money.

I read # 7 last night... I think I'm starting to get into it.

Dox's closing line was PERFECT.

I **loved** the focus on the Gil'dishpan, and while we're on it, thank space they finally dropped the "gil'dan" crap.

I did like that focus on a neglected planet in the DCU- though I wish there was more forward movement on the 'blueprint' Brainy Prime sent back in time.

Even though I simultaneously want REBELS to carve its own niche in the DCU.

I hope there aren't any more clever 'combinations'. I like Wildstar, but think it's a huge mistake to have her exist in the pasts of the characters Drake Burroughs and Dawnstar.

She should be generations in their future.

That's a qualm I have about this property from the get-go, though.

I was thinking of posting this in a new topic, but screw it.

REBELS has officially reached a new generation. Bask in the cuteness of...

...

Plushie Vril.

http://Blackthornhiei.deviantart.com/art/Plushie-Vril-Dox-II-136967929

Well, I just read # 8. Stealth fans will want to avoid this one. Nice appearance by the remaining OMEGA MEN.

A father and son are reunited.

Overall, enjoyable issue despite my one huge gripe.

Lyrl, bright and devoted boy that he is, will surely have a great incentive to restore Mom to her original condition. We didn't see a death certificate, did we? Lyrl ran off to escape the robots. Stealth's strange biology leaves a lot of doors open, although I'm not counting on her return to life.

But is Lyrl an ordinary kid, no 12th level intelligence, or is it latent and waiting to be revived? I think it's interesting that he's grown up in a jungle; I wonder what he's learned.

I thought it was interesting that Ciji appeared to be comforting the kid, since she's not exactly been the warm and sympathetic little girl whose form she's taken.

Maybe we'll get a Teen R.E.B.E.L.S. with Strata and Garv's child joining the group.

One thing I love about R.E.B.E.L.S. is all the little history bits from Encyclopedia Galactica. Bedard includes a few other sources of information as well.

i.e. she's up to something. I think Bedard is putting more characters closer to Dox' standard of deviousness than we've seen before.

I enjoyed issue #8, and REBELS right now is my favorite DC read. I love Bedard's use of the DC Interstellar Universe, weaving Dominators and Khunds and Gil'Dishpan and Psions and others into an interesting tale. The artwork has been amazing!

It disappoints me that the sales on this series has been low. I hope the Annual and Blackest Night crossover bumps it up, but I'm not counting on it.

Maybe, once Legion bounces out Superboy from Adventure and takes over the headliner spot , REBELS and/or Omega Men will get a place in the backup.

Robinson just announced there will be a crossover with JLA in February or March. Which means DC is really trying hard with LEGION.

So many good books in the lower sales range. They need a new business paradigm, or something to support these at the level they're selling.

I really want to like this and love the art but it's difficult to muster up much enthusiasm.

I'm finding it hard to keep track of who is actually in the team and what the point of it all is.

I've already forgotten what the Dominator and the Durlan want! Maybe it's time to read all the issues again. Or play some memory-improving games!

I'm with Kanga. I like the idea of the book, and there have been a few great moments in the run so far. It's not wow-ing me right now. It still feels like it's building to something.

The art is also hit and miss. The medium shots and close ups are great, but anything from a distance looks less impressive.

Re: Annual #1

<span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text">The humanoid body that is Starro was originally a young boy named "Cobi"! </span></span>

Not really sure about what I thought about the annual. I really debated buying it and kind of wish I hadn't. I almost would rather have not known the background info on the Starros, their mystery makes them all the more imposing.

The regular book is still pretty awesome imo. Definitely one of the best things DC is putting out right now.

Just read number nine (a few days after the excellent annual, by the way): good story, good premise, good guest stars (?), use of continuity (best use of the 21 st DCU space maybe ever) and subplots (Dox Jr, the Omegans). Above average art.
I like this series and I'll follow this Star Conqueror storyline until it's tentatively thunderous end.

Love the 'eek'!

I thought the Annual was a good read and it surprised me by giving a much better origin story to the Molly Hatchet guy than I would've imagined. It explained his unique abilities and rise to power, while preserving the starfish creatures history intact (which I was really hoping for). I also enjoyed the background stories of two of his High Vanguard. They were compelling and well conceived. The artwork was enjoyable and the issue as a whole was a vital read in the current story line.

Issue #9 continues the build up as Dox acquires three more agents for his REBELS (how these guys are all going to get along seems to be Dox's biggest task), while the Omega Men begin their mission.

It's good stuff!

I'd like Storm Daughter to stay after the Starro storyline ends. She's a great character.

Cobie is an interesting character, too.

And as to #9, I feel so badly for Lyrl. How can Vril be so cold when he remembers his hurt from his own father acting the same way?
sad

We see GARV and ROCKY!
Rocky's cute in a butt ugly way!

I just hope that DC and Bedard don't see him as 'expendable fodder' for their clashing stories ~ Starro and Blackest Night.

We've already lost Stealth for no really good reason, when I would have enjoyed it so much more with Lobo being the casualty.

I hate Comet's current look.
He was major eye candy before and there's no mention of Mari'jn.

It's the kind of look/costume that few artists can draw effectively. Shane Davis did a fantastic job, but things have been hit and miss since then.

I agree that Captain Comet's new hair do is ridiculous.

I want to like this series but the pacing is so slow!

Have we even got the final line up there? It doesn't seem very Legion-inspired to me.

They should take some tips from Aquaman as to how to defeat Starro. He got rid of him in five pages!!

Behold:

http://bottlecityofkanga.blogspot.com/2009/10/rebels-9-starro-saga-goes-onand-on.html

Nice blog, BCK!

The group picture reminds me that there are no actual human type females in the REBELS, yet.

Wildfire's changed to energy, Silica was a machine and is now dead, as id Stealth, and Strata is, well, Strata.

I don't have any of my .LEGION books anymore, , but I was introduced (that I remember) to Captain Comet in .LEGION and I adored him.
I think Kitson was drawing him then.
But, Barry is wonderful with characterizations!

(Aquaman was so funny and sweet. That silly simplification is long gone from comics, I'm afraid. But it's our fault. We want scientific realism and complexity. We got it at the expense of quick pacing, among other things.)

I don't think there's much scientific realism in the superhero comics I read, it's just all really drawn out!

But you're right, I didn't notice the lack of ladies on the team. It just seemed awash with randomly coloured aliens.

Hopefully the final team will look a bit different to what we've got this issue. But it will be 12 issues and the first arc won't be finished and we probably won't have the final line-up. Gah!!

My scientific comment came after just reading the last 'Planetary' which addressed your complaint, in a way.


I don't think that .REBELS will really have a final line-up.
I don't think that it's structured for that really.

There might be a small 'core' group, like .REBELS had before, but a larger, permanent line-up probably won't occur until and if, Vril wins and takes back .LEGION.
So, try not to get too frustrated.

Just my thoughts on the subject.

Hi, there! Sorry that its been so long since I posted, but I've been quite busy with my new job in Ottawa--not to mention a funeral recently.

Anyway, I'm still loving REBELS, even if its not perfect. The art and characterization continue to be great, and there was finally a sense of an effective and reasonably large team coming together somewhat. Heck, I even liked the Omega Men this issue, which hasn't happened for me since the early days of their own book.

Small things in particular this time around that captured my fancy were the humorously put explanation of what REBELS actually stands for--something that wasn't done in-continuity the first time around, I believe (in fact, I don't think that they ever referred to themselves as the REBELS), and the Dominator admiral's way of coping with his adverse situation. Plus seeing Garv again was a real kick, too.

Anyway, the whole Starro plotline aside, I'm also looking forward to seeing Dox get his hands on a Black Lantern ring.

Cheers, and ciao for now!

LOL!

Annual: Not about dotLegion really. Nice story for another title. Well set up, might have made a nice Star Wars story.

dotRebel 9: I'm on the too slow side. Too many players that are not dotLegion members and I've not found any of the interesting. $40 in and not a whole lot of story completed and the art style isn't something to keep me around.

Hemming and Hawing. Probably done with it but I'll read the threads to see if anything actually gets done. If not, I'll save money. If so then I'll pick up the issues off the rack.

R.E.B.E.L.S. is kind of like a road trip story. I enjoy the views of various planets, the little background bits (Tony Bedard should write the entire Encyclopedia Galactica!)
and the odd team. They do seem to be forming some bond as a team, not just against Starro, but as a defense against Vril's continuous insults.

Lyrl looks like he's about 16 or so. I wonder how easily his father could activate his super-intelligence - although I'd like to see Lyrl survive and thrive with his jungle skills.

bite your tongue i am dieing for resolution where they have to go an amusement park and out wit the villain then laugh in there face as said villain goes 'i would have gotten away with it...'

At the risk of repeating myself, i take it as a very bad sign for th future of this book that nobody elsehas commented on the latest issue of REBELS yet.

From a plot and characterization perspective, the story was great, and the art was okay. This is fine with me, though--you can't have such detailed art be fantastic each and every issue, or we'd kill the artist(s).

Without going into detail, it was nice to see recap of the old versions of the LEGION and REBELS books, although it galls me that they didn't state whatLEGION actually stands for--but this is a minor quibble.

One thing in particular that especally appealled to me was the sense (as continued from last issue) that a large and effective team is coming together, even if the permanent core may ultimately not remain as large.

Needless to say, I can't wait for the next issue. Now, for those of you who like to "cheat", here are a few major spoilers:


***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****

***** SPOILERS! *****


1) As is already well known from preview blurbs, Stealth comes back--from the dead as a Black Lantern (Arghh! and double Arghh!);

2) Lyrl seems to more or less willingly join the Starro--which is again no real suprise if you think about it;

3) As is again also known from preview blurbs, Vril gets his hands on a Yellow Lantern ring (by actually joining the corps. yet--seemingly just in time to save his bacon; and

4) The Quislet inspired ship gets destroyed (this last one really floored and disappointed me, because I thought the design was really neat).

Oh, yeah, and one last thing that really tickled my fancy: Vril's expression of smug incredulity (sp?) that the Oan Guardian's give out their rings only to fearless individuals, since this goes against his own inclination to prefer only have people who are terrified of and therefore obedient to him. No wonder the Yellow Lantern ring was drawn to him: he quite naturally projects fear in many people. Speaking of which, has anybody else noticed that both our big, tough, and supposedly fearless - through cultural demand - Khund comrade, and our lethal Durlan friend frequently seem to have cowed or even fearful looks on their faces? Personally, I love this, because it is not only amusing but makes the characters less one dimensional. Just don't call them on this, though, because they'd kill you in a heartbeat if they knew that you know that they get scared of Dox and or the situations he gets them into (personally, I'd be an outright "basket case" of nerves if I was in their shoes--although I truly do respect Vril's ruthless logic and efficiency against my own wishes a great deal of the time).

Cheers!

Um... they did mention what "L.E.G.I.O.N" stands for--it's on the second caption of the second page:

In any case, it's another great issue--R.E.B.E.L.S. is one of the best books in the general DCU--to the point where it's hard to say anything other than stuff happened, and it was awesome.

So yeah, stuff happened, and it was awesome. I loved the last two pages: "I thought you'd never ask". And while I really don't care at all about the "Blackest Night" event suddenly infecting perfectly good books, this one has handled it quite well so far.

I have not read an issue of this incarnation of REBELS.

Picked this one up to get the ring...

I thought it was a good issue, and plan on picking up the conclusion next month. Good recap, as it let me know what I needed to in regards to understand the basics of what was happening.

Pretty fantastic story telling, I'd say!

Malia is certainly beautiful and Vril looks wonderful in the black and yellow.
He's kept the silly pants but he doesn't look nearly so Gestapo now.

And if I were Starro, I'd be worried about Brainiac 3.
Lyrl returned to his 12th level intellect and teamed with a starro will find a way to take the guy's place, for sure!

I'm glad I stuck it out this long because this was one fantastic issue.

I agree with you about B3 and he wasn't too dumb before having the mental chastity belt removed. Starro's about to have his mollusks handed to him.

I'm not into the GL color thing at all but Vril Dox with a power ring? Whoa! And I'm not concerned at all about Stealth's death, since she's been that before.

Having seen Stealth during the time that she was giving birth to Lyrl, I'd have to agree that she's not easy to kill or to keep dead.

She's a little like shooting a Durlan in the head when his/her brain is in the middle of his/her body.

Just a quick pipe-up to say the cliffhanger for issue 10 was FANfreakingTASTIC.

I can see this cliffhanger happening back in the early days of LEGION '89-90 etc.

Very deja-vu. Good stuff.

My only complaint about the series is--who is on the team? Strata looks very different now and I have no clue as to who these people are..

okay its almost 4 in the morning as i type this but its bugging me and i cant sleep, if you have a Yellow lantern ring does that mean you are evil? has there ever been some one with the ring that isn't bad?

I believe the yellow ring is related to fear, or the power to instill fear - and that's what was said to Vril Dox as he was given the ring.

A yellow ring once sought out Batman for his ability to cause great fear.

Also, in the Annual, Smite declares that "Vril Dox occupies a moral middle ground" - so, not evil. Not good either, which makes him the ultimate opponent for Starro, who is portrayed as beyond good and evil. But will he be beyond fear?

Perhaps there will be an eventual stalemate between Starro and Dox, although I suspect Dox will win, possibly with some behind-the-lines help from Lyrl.

Vril's reaction to Lyrl being taken by Starro was:
"Now the whole galaxy is SPROCKED!"
and
"BELIEVE me...the next time we see Lyrl, the KINDEST thing we can do is blow his head off."

Good ole Vril.
He's perfect as a Yellow Lantern.

I guess I'm in the minority here, but my first impressions is that yet ANOTHER DC crossover event is bringing down a quality title. I thought REBELS #10 read totally as a distraction to its current story by the Blackest Night events. The whole Starro storyline was already running risk of being drawn out too long, and this interruption isn't helping. Seeing Stealth as a walking corpse did not help - I always liked the character and her Black Lantern persona seems like the final insult to her death.

I can only surmise that in the end Blackest Night will be the excuse for ALL those Black Lanterns (good and bad) to be brought back to life, and DC will swear it to be the Last Time character resurrection will ever be used (until the next Main Event). So I expect we will see Stealth back to normal by next year (which is good).

Vril Dox as a Yellow Lantern? I dunno. I'll have to see more. My first impressions is that B2 is a strong enough character without the ring (like Batman). I would have preferred Xylon or Ciji to get it instead.

^^^ I don't think ALL the Black Lanterns will be brought back to life since a bunch seem to have been destroyed completely already (Ralph and Sue Dibny, a bunch of Titans like Lilith, Pantha, Baby Wildebeest and so on), but there's a good chance that at least some of them will come back.

I'd say Stealth has good odds of being in the 'brought-back' camp since she was a fairly big character back in the day and her off-panel death was so WTF.

One of the particularly interesting aspects of R.E.B.E.L.S. for me is the presentation of religions.

There is an undercurrent of Christian references throughout, from the opening scene of two people talking about the Second Coming, and Dox appearing, walking on water; Dox's reference to rebirth on Starhaven; Astrild citing a Christian gravestone epitaph, et cetera.

There are more general religion references, such as the repeated reference to Starro as a god to be served, description by the Omega Men of the communal mind of Starro as akin to prayer and a comment by one of the bounty hunters chasing Dox that he won't attack a place of worship.

Bedard also gives us a few interesting religion-driven planets. Pathon is a world united by its church and defended by four superhuman monks (also described as warrior-priests), the Sodality of Virtue. Astrild Stormdaughter was her planet Varidian's living god, who controlled life forces and created a utopia, free of religious strife, because all could see their god.

In the 3boot arc that Bedard wrote, he presented Winath as a planet with old gods and cults.

I don't know if religions are a common aspect of his stories generally, and I'm still thinking about how/if these religions tie into the underlying theme of beyond good and evil which is playing out between Starro and Vril Dox. Starro has taken out religion-driven planets, but he has also conquered the tyrannies and the structured political systems.

(A side note: of all the planets we've seen so far, the only reference to any voting has been for Khundia, which I find rather amusing.)

Good eye on the Christian references! I spotted a few, but not nearly as many as you have, Ms. Cramer.
(Visualize Strata and Rocky and Garv visited last issue by the Vanguard 'Kings').

Thank-you for your insights, FC.

I just read the latest issue and I have to reread it and pour over it but my first impressions were that it was a little confusing but the Lyle/Vril interchanges were so wonderful that I didn't care.

I hope Lyle remains a major personality in the future of .REBELS/LEGION.
I'm growing to love him as much as a teenager as I hated him as a baby!

He is a MAJOR new character for DC and I hope they see him as the treasure and future treasure that he is.

The problem is that now that I've begun to care so much about him I'm starting to get scared for him.
sigh

Lots of conflicting emotions in the last issue. Vril seems to be very proud of and concerned for his son, while feigning indifference. Lyrl's accusations of his fathering abilities in earlier issues sounded a bit like any grumpy teenager at odds with his parents (not that Vril is Dad of the Year by any means).

The game's still afoot, and I'm still expecting Lyrl to join the good guys' fight, since I suspect that starro doesn't have so much power over his big brain. He could just be serving Starro to annoy his old man.

Vril must have been confident of Lyrl's survival abilities if he sent him back to Starro with the Stealth creature.

I know we had to be shown how brilliant the kid is, but now that he's invented transmatter portals, that's pretty much the last of the 31st century tech to fall into the present. There's just nothing left for Brainiac 5 to do except the flight ring, and that can't be far out of Vril and Lyrl's reach.

The Legion of Substitute Podcasters were discussing the likelihood of Smite or Astrild Stormdaughter switching allegiance. I hadn't thought of that and it would certainly be an interesting moral tale. What would cause them to change sides? Simply realigning with a new power base, or some emergence of free will?

Comet and Adam Strange don't seem to have much character here; not really part of the team, just hired hands.

I think that if the Starro queen on the leader's chest is injured or killed, his power over the rest of the Starro creatures will end.

A number of things could happen then, I guess.

They were a completely murderous species BEFORE he took them over and he controls their killing pretty firmly.

If the leader is killed, will the queen choose another to join with or can she be forced to join with someone else.

The person would have to be a telepath or empath, someone capable of communicating on the Starro's level, imo.

Stormdaughter might be strong enough for that.
SHE might use her power to heal the galaxies damaged by the Starros.
By absorbing the life of her 'people', the Starros, she could free those 9 galaxies from Starro control, destroying most of them.

That's just a theory, for fun.

I wasn't crazy about the ending to the BLACKEST NIGHT tie-in.

I just don't know what to do about this book. One month I enjoy it and the next I don't.

The two BN issues were almost like an interlude. Lyrl appeared and disappeared, Wildstar caught up to the group, the ship got broken and repaired, Dox got a ring and lost it - so we're more or less back to where we started, with a little more information.

Did Dox learn something from his brief time
with the Sinestro Corps, something he'll use to defeat Starro?

I'd like to see Stormdaughter break free and go back to being a healer.

It took me over a month to get around to reading the last issue.

I can't be bothered with this series but the art's nice and I really want to like it.

Does anyone else have a problem with the pacing?

14 issues and an annual seems like a really LONG time to take to tell the first story of a new ongoing series.

I'm still enjoying the series but agree it could use a little push to conclude this storyline and move to the next phase. BCoK is absolutely right--14 issues and an annual is asking for a heck of a lot for one full story, let alone the *first* story of the series.

No wonder young readers don't collect REBELS--most of them haven't had relationship half as long as this storyline has been running!

I seem to be in the minority here, but I absolutely LOVED the two part BN tie-in in REBELS! In fact I'd rank it as the best non-GL/GLC BN crossover to this point.

Why? Well, in my opinion it just seemed to fit in within the framework of the series very well. While the plot may not have moved forward by leaps and bounds, it DID move forward. We got to see Lyrl emerging as the threat Dox anticipated once on Starro's side. His invention will bring the series out of the holding pattern its been in for a while. We got to see the REBELS coming together more as a team.

Most importantly, we got glimpses into what's beneath Dox's cold exterior. None of his teammates called him on it, but Dox admitted he had feelings for Stealth aloud by stating that the BL Stealth exploited the will it took to suppress his feelings for her. And that scream after what he did to Lyrl--very telling. A classic Dox moment followed by a very revealing and unusual one that was very character-defining.

And it just made sense for a space series like this one to interact with a crisis of an interstellar nature. Going with that nature (and aginst what Cobalt said), I'm perfectly fine with the storyline not ending to soon. The scope of it works very well for longform storytelling. Starro wouldn't be much of a threat if he were dispatched very easily. And then REBELS wouldn't be "REBELS" anymore, would it?

Yeah, Dox's Sinestro Corps membership was brief and contrived, but it was still kinda fun while it lasted. Kinda reminiscent of Spidey being captain Universe for a day or Doc Doom stealing the Surfer's surfboard in a way. He and the ring's kiss-off to each other was actually quite hilarious!

In any case the teasers (LOVED 'em!) showed me that there is progress in store for the series. Bedard is definitely getting better as he goes along, so this title is sitting pretty with me. I'm much more worried it'll be cancelled by DC than by me.

Yeah, Lardi.
I enjoyed them, the second book, especially.

Of the books I'm getting, .REBELS is my first read.
I'd love to see a .LEGION even in the 31st century, working outside of the UP and at odds with &/or working with, the LSH.

While I do stand by what I said about the larger storyline coming to a conclusion (and going somewhere else thereafter), I do want to reiterate that I'm enjoying the hell out of REBELS right now. I certainly have no plans to stop buying it and hope cancellation is nowhere in sight.

Bedard really seems to have Dox nailed down and he's just so enthralling to see on the page. The rest of the cast is just the perfect mix of people, from LEGION characters, to old DCU favorites Adam Strange and Captain Comet, to all kinds of psychos and villains. I'm loving the inclusion of the Dominator General.

I thought the Blackest Night crossover was the best BN crossover that DC did for the entire event. It was fun and was just plain awesome to see Vril with a Sinestro Corps ring. It just fit--moreso than any other DC character with any of the various rings.

I want more than anything Stealth to be an ongoing part of the series. Other than her, I'm pretty comfortable with Bedard adding in whoever he wants (and taking them out too) at his whim.

And the art is simply fantastic.

Post-Crossgen, Bedard stumbled a little in places but here it feels like he's recaptured the magic from Negation, the much-missed series that makes my top 10 of the decade.

I'm behind a few issues on this series, but I'm on my way to catching up!

I think fun is the keyword here with what's working and what's not working in BN crossovers. Even when there is serious subject matter, this should be a fun event! I'm feeling the fun in the core BN series (I had fun being shocked by the end of BN #5!), in GL, in GLC and definitely in the REBELS tie-in. Those titles and some others get it. JLA, BN: Batman and some of the others simply don't.

I had tons of fun reading the REBELS tie-in, and that's why I'd recommend it to anyone. Comics can still be fun, right?

I never would've thought I'd like Lyrl from his days as infant tyrant. But I do! I hope he survives and antagonizes Vril for years to come. Wonder if they'll meet up with Lyrl's straight-from-the-tube aunt any time soon?

I second the idea that Stormdaughter should join with Dox, post Starro (assuming she survives).

I want to see the rest of the blueprinted ones from Brainiac 5 Prime's file, sooner than later.

I think the title could benefit from a few one or two issue storylines for a period, as this Starro tale seems to be going on forever.

Does anyone else want a bit of resolution?

It's been 12 issues and it just feels as if we're getting nowhere!!!

I really enjoyed the first few issues but it would be nice to see the team interacting with each other or just getting things done.

One issue just seems to slump into the other.

Strata's just been written out but what did she bring to the book / team in the first place? It'd be nice just to see something happening every now and again.

http://bottlecityofkanga.blogspot.com/2010/01/rebels-12-still-no-end-in-sight-sob.html

i definitely agree! if i wasn't such a legion junkie i had dropped this book months ago. the story it too slow and, btw, starro the conqueror is one of the banalest ideas ever.

I'm still enjoying the ride, even though the final defeat of Starro looks like it's a few issues away yet.

Since Starro is such a big and difficult opponent, what will Vril Dox do next - assuming he does triumph over Starro?

Maybe the Omega Men will be the ones to defeat Starro. That would certainly be a thorn in Vril's side.

It'd be a good idea, too!
(If the Omega Men beat Starro.)

If Vril beats Starro, who's almost a demigod, how do we keep his head from exploding with aggrandizement?

Unfortunately, I dislike the Psions intensely, even more than Vril's inflated ego!

I was weary when I wanted to read this book when it first came out but loved the First issue because of Brainiac 5 being in it and then from each issue on have grown to like the characters and love this book. Vril is one of my favorite Characters and Adam Strange and Comet were before this so I am glad they are apart of this and Starro is a badass Villain now that I hope this book stays for a long time because I love this book.

I'm still mixed... liked parts of 12, didn't care about parts... I'm going to hang in there...

Possibly a one-sitting reread of all issues so far is in order.

More Lyrl, less Despero... more Adam Strange, Captain Comet and Omega Men... still want to see a couple more of Prime Brainiac 5's 'recommendations' (while simultaneously wanting as few direct LSH analogs as possible-- I know, impossible to please)... let Stormdaughter join after unStarroed...

Just read #13. I'm lovin' Braniac 3 but this story is dragging!! The durlan came on so strong a few issues ago & now all she does is stand around in the background with no dialog.

Exclusive DC Preview - R.E.B.E.L.S. #14

Thanks for the sneak peek, Nightcrawler.

Yes!
That was fun, thank-you!

Well, I'm sort of glad it was Vril who really did defeat Starro, even though the Omega Men came up with the anti-starfish toxin. After all, he's supposed to be the mastermind. He also got to portray some entertaining facial expressions - and wasted no time reasserting his control.

No doubt we'll be seeing more of the devious Lyrl. Father and son seem to be far more attached to one another, for good or for ill, than either will admit. I do wonder is Smite and Stormdaughter are going to be on-going characters, though. Not crazy about Smite, but I would like to see more of Astrid.

I was one of those clamoring for a resolution to the Starro storyline, but I was surprised it wrapped up so quickly. Still, I thought Mr. Bedard did a great job of entertaining. The characters are fresh, the variety of characters is refreshing and interesting, and the artwork has been top notch throughout. I think REBELS is the best book out there that no-one's buying. I really hope TPTB let it ride for a while.

I think Astrid would be an interesting addition to LEGION, as would Smite. They sort of remind me of Lady Quark and Lobo elements not yet introduced in this new version

I'm glad to see the series moving on past the Starro plot! I thought it was a solid issue and I want to know where we're going from here.

Love that Starfire is joining the series. She deserves to be a heavy hitter on a team, and for years has just drifted around. She looked great too.

In fact, the artwork is just spectacular. Really great stuff.

One complaint: more Starro? Breaking free? Ugh. C'mon Tony, no more...

For me, the StormDaughter/Starro dynamic is interesting.
I liked the original children that they both were and hope that they can somehow work through their capture and twisting by the Starfish.

Kory was certainly beautiful on the cover!
I really hope she's a long term addition to the team!

I'm looking forward to the 3 Brainy fight, but I wish B5 was included somehow.

Preview of #16

I was pretty angry about Bedard's comment, through Adam Strange or Captain Comet, I can't remember which, about Israel being plopped down in the Middle East being comparable to Rann being added to that region of space.

Israel has a 5,000 year history in that region. Jerusalem is known as the City of David.
Solomon built the first Temple there and the children of Israel rebuilt the Temple when they came out of Babylon.

That kind of personal politics doesn't belong in DC comics and if he repreats such garbage, I'm done with the book.

Which I still like.
The book, not the garbage.

Yeah, I don't think that Mr. Bedard should have made the reference either, regardless of what my own personal beliefs on the matter are. To be fair, though, he did have Adam Strange say outright that it was an inappropriate comment (meaning that he realized some people would undoubtedly object to the reference and characterization of the situation).

Clearly, it was meant to give the plot development a sense of reality; however, I don't think that it was wise to pick such a hot-button real-world issue to reference. Besides, we'd really miss you on this thread if you left, Candle.

My other complaint about the issue is the art and colouring: both seem to be somewhat in the decline, I'm afraid.

Having said this, though, the general story and the characterization of the book remain strong. And I, for one, am glad that Starro and Stormrider still survive (sorry, this is a reference to a prior plot development that I missed commenting on at the time).

Beyond this, I'm also wondering whether or not they're going to go back to calling the book L.E.G.I.O.N. 2010.

Many writers over the ages have tried to interject "real world" politics into stories to give them an underlying meaning, so this is nothing new. I do agree with you Candle, however, about the comments being historically inaccurate (or incomplete), and therefore distasteful.

The biggest problem I had with Mark Waid's latest version of the Legion was his hard core depiction of the 31st Century as some sort of Socialist-Progressive utopia. His vision of this universe was meant to be edgy and hip with the times, but came across as arrogant and unimaginative IMO.

Yeah, it was one of the reason's I disliked the Primeboot.
(I had a number of reasons, but that's another thread.)

I just take Israel and their continual struggle, pretty seriously.
They're certainly not perfect, but I feel they have every right to be there.

And thanks, MB, I know I miss you when you're not here.

I think they might be changing the name, too.

I didn't think it was too big a deal to put that comment in there, considering it came from Captain Comet in an throw-away fashion and Adam's follow-up comment about it.

Regardless of the comment (I didn't even really remember it until I came to this thread), I thought the issue was solid and I'm glad to see things moving along. Starfire's presence is welcome and I'm glad Captain Comet is sticking around.

That being said, I don't want this to be the Adam/Comet/Starfire show--there are a ton of awesome characters new & old introduced that I want to see more of. Ciji the Durlan and the Dominator particularly.

The artwork remains great IMO, but the inking seems off for me as does the coloring. I was wondering what it was until I read Mediocre Boy's comments. I've just been flipping back through the issue and think that was it. The inking should have heavier line work and the colors seem muted for some reason.

From a storytelling perspective though, I'm pleased we're moving away from Starro and onto new things. Looking forward to what's next.

Now if they could get Stealth on the team...

Yeah.
If they could get Stealth ALIVE again . . .

BTW Shady, I love your sig!

Thanks.

(Just to keep you otherwise occupied and unaware of our ongoing female ploting.)

So......

No one has mentioned

<span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text">we now seem to have an origin for Pulsar Stargrave</span></span>

It's certainly different from the original.

If so, what happened to Lydea Darkstar and Lyrissa?

I'd love it if Lyrissa was still alive and Lydea grew up more naturally, as long as her mutant shadowstar powers remained.

I'd love for her to meet Lyrl and have them fall in love, etc..

To be honest I've lost interest in this new version of R.E.B.E.LS. since around issue #6.
I don't like this Vril Dox, and I am fed up with the disconneted plotlines and whimpy guest stars.

I still see no reason to pick up this book again after thumbing through the current issue during a visit to my local comic shop.
It looked really boring.

oh can they please please show Lydea to be the great hero that Shadow Lass alluded too in the Great Darkness saga?

#18 preview is up! (If you can stand the Newsarama Ads... !)

I still am enjoying the series - I guess it's just the Trekkie in me but I love good Space Operas.

The Pulsar Stargrave angle is a great idea - another Brainiac loose-end that Mr Bedard can use to keep main character Vril interesting. I am not so interested in the Starfire/Captain Comet subplot, and would rather see more of Ciji and Bounder and the Dominator featured, but it's all good.

I hope the sales are staying up there. It is one of my top five favorite titles right now.

i dropped it. barely saw, "Starro" thru completion.
i don't like the replacement artist as much. he is sub-par. even though the inker does a good job of meshing the pencillers.
many issues in and i know next to nothing of Tribulus, Bounder, and any member apart from Vril. this is not why i buy team comics.
the addition of Starfire, totally negates the female Wildfire (whatshername?) with her flying and energy blasts. In fact, the addition of Capt. Comet, Adam Strange, and Starfire seem DC mandated to continue the Strange Adventures line-up. They haven't added anything at all to the book. lame book. DC wants a cosmic book to compete with success of Abnett/Lanning cosmic series at Marvel, but this is nowhere close.

Well, DnA have multiple books going there so it's hard for one book to compete, I think.

I, myself, enjoy the book.

But, I DO wish that Bedard had just kept the original would be okay, if she was used for more than her sexual titulation.
and find out why she's not with him.
(sorry for all the pictures but it seemed like fun)

She's probably not with him because he was so concentrating so hard on being/tolerating Bek's attempt of sabatoging their relationship that she went back to eating..and if she stopped and instead got "her power back" as its said these days...she told him to take a hike.

I have really enjoyed the last few issues, post Starro. The recent battle of the Brainiacs has really turned this book around.

Vril hasn't really taken the name Brainiac has he? It seems more an appellation given to him. In which case, you can't fault him there.

Lryl's creation of Pulsar and their limited conversation was a treat to read. Ditto starfire and Captain Comet's relations. it's moments like these that make the book a fun read, more so than the actual super hero throwdowns.

This book took sometime, but it's definitely worth reading each month.

I'm all for more of Ciji!

The latest issue seems to have done a good job giving everyone sometime. Here's to Bedard building up the cast of DC's cosmic corner.

Finally read #18. Loved it!

There's a worthwhile story to be told in how/why Comet resigned from dotLegion (which he was leading) and what happened to Marij'n. I figure, though, that it's just been retconned away.

Hmm.. this new Pulsar Stargrave seems interesting, but more like just a killing machine. Nothing like the 30th Century version. I'm wondering if at some point he comes in contact with the humanoid form of the Computer Tyrants of Colu and perhaps merge their power and become one entity?

Yes, but one really, really, VERY POWERFUL, entity!

And I LIKED , darn it.
She and Comet were good together!

Maybe the Eye came back and took her away as it's Empress.
Lobo was gone, after all, and with Cera we saw how it could lurk and wait for the right moment!

I am loving the Brainiac fight.
And, I thought I was tired of Brainiac!

Lyrl is still a wonderful character, even if he IS being shown to be his old, amoral self as an infant.

I would have thought that his time with Vril/Stealth and later, just Stealth, would have had some sort of impact on him.
He should be grieving for his mom, too.

I don't think that having a 12th level mind makes someone a sociopath, without the ability to care for others or to have remorse or grief.

If that were true, the Coluans would be right in calling them Abominations.
The beings with the hightest intellegence on THIS planet, certainly have shown connections to others, compassion and 'humanity'.

Anyway, I really enjoye Lyrl's interchanges with Vril, this issue, Vril 'on the run', everyone trying to out think Brainiac, Pulsar Stargrave (whatta creation!) and the last pages with Lobo (he's on next month's cover so spoilers seem unneeded here.)

The art is so beautiful, right down to the fish faced people!

I think I'm going to drop it, I'm just not enjoying it.

It's less a team book, more a Dox solo series with the occasional appearance from supporting characters.

I also can't keep the plots straight in my brain from month to month as it's all about tactical skulduggery. Maybe it will read better as a trade?

I don't understand why Bedard's introduced a team of characters in the first 8 or so issues and then done nothing with them subsequently.

Sales, probably.

The mostly-new team may not have been going over well so more familiar characters like Adam Strange, Starfire, and Captain Comet were brought in. That's likely why Lobo is coming back as well.

The book got a charge from Blackest Night, but the boost from that is gone. Ian Sattler said in San Diego that the book is sticking around, but that's probably due to the crossover planned with Green Lantern Corps. (It was originally going to be a crossover with JLA, which might have helped more.) I'm sure TPTB will check those numbers to see if it's worth it to continue the book.

The latest issue was great!! I loved the art!!

I liked the latest issue as well. I think it has a great story and great art, and is one of the better DC titles. I'd hate to see it canceled, so even though I'm not a big crossover fan, if it will sell more bring on the GL Corp and the JLA and whomever.

ps - I'd like to see more of the Omega Men, but a little better distinguishing between Strata and Broot.

Writer TAKES R.E.B.E.L.S. Toward DC\'S Next Space \'Event\'

R.E.B.E.L.S. will now stand for Regional Enforcement Bureau Ending Lantern Supremacy and be replacing L.E.G.I.O.N. as the team's name.

I am more than happy that DC appears to be still behind this book.

But I hope these events generate some sales.

I liked the last clash between the Brainiacs!
I enjoyed Vril's faces when he was with Lobo and his interactions with Lyrl.

I thought that at one point, he'd taken away Lobo's power to regenerate.
But, that might have been a boot ago or something.

I really enjoyed Pulsar Stargrave.
I mean REALLY.
He was so funny with Lobo.

I DO wish that Brainiac hadn't gotten away with both PS and the Coluan core.
Like he needed more power.
sigh

Argh! I somehow lost track of when the new issue came out and missed getting it. I guess O know what I'm doing after work: tracking it down.

I'm still reading, but if they're going to bring back all the old charactors and ignore the new ones I'm gone. If we're going to keep Lobo I'm gone. If they keep Lobo then please add Guy Gardner too. That way I can avoid one book and be done with it.

I caught up on the last three REBELS issues and am reminded that while there is still a little room for improvement, I'm enjoying the series quite a bit. The War of the Brainiacs was done in a really fun way and the inclusion of Pulsar Stargrave was a big plus. He did sem a bit too much like Solaris, but was fun nonetheless.

I surprised myself by actually enjoying the heck out of Lobo's inclusion. While I used to get a little annoyed when he was *everywhere*, I've always loved the way he interacts with Dox. I think he's a welcome addition here so long as he doesn't dominate the series.

The two Green Lantern's have gone from being very annoying to only slightly so. The Okarrian GL has become interesting suddenly and I want to learn more. I just wish their visuals were a little more appealing.

REBELS is still my favorite title out there. The 3-way Brainiac battle was a lot of fun. I thought Pulsar Stargrave was excellent, and enjoyed seeing Lobo get thumped some. Wasn't Pulsar Stargrave created way back in the original Legion series by the scientists of Colu, and didn't he contain all the information of the Coluan computer core? The non-ending leaves the possibility of a Brainiacs rematch almost a certainty, which is good.

Not a huge Lobo fan, but I didn't mind him here. I agree with the posted sentiments that we should see some of the other REBELs characters more (has there been a Tribulus sighting lately?).

I don't mind Lobo when he's used sparingly, but I'm really not interested in him getting the spotlight too often.

It was odd seeing Strange, Comet and Starfire crowd out the regulars for a bit, and then Lobo come along and crowd out almost everyone. Probably sales driven (though I'm not sure it helped).

Hopefully the next story arc will give more characters screen time.

Yes, Kori.
sigh

I hate the whole rape/alien sex thing that goes with Starfire's origin and having it brought back as a planet wide way of treating their females is very off-putting to me.
ugh

The fact that the Guardians say that they MADE the Psions makes everything worse.
Millions and millions, perhaps billions, of females treated like souless meat and the Guardians did NOTHING!

The very idea makes me dispise them.
Fun stuff.
Not.

I enjoyed the Brainiacs story; even Lobo seemed to fit in as opposition to Brainiac.

However, not great news that Starro is returning. I would have liked to see Astrid Stormdaughter again, but fear we're going to get a big Starro-Lobo fight, which just doesn't appeal.

I had to sigh, too, when I saw Starro (or Starro's host, or whatever) return. I would have thought that he would have slinked ("slunk"?) back to re-establish his authority over his first galaxy long before he'd decide to go after Dox.

However, I like that Stormdaughter is still around. Visually, she is such a striking character, and her background is rife with possibilies. I could even she her getting a violent/romantic relationship with B2. Remember his first date with Stealth, anyone? He had to be measured for a box instead of a wedding ring.

Honestly, I love both Adam Strange and Captain Comet, but does the title need both? I know there are commercial reasons for pasting Green Lanterns on DC covers, but we've gotten to know these GLs before we have really explored the characters we met in the first few issues.

I suppose my griefs all have to do with wanting more of these characters. That must be a sign that the creators are doing something right.

Hey, Cramer, have I ever told you that your tag-line has helped me more than once? Especially in traffic!

A Stormdaughter/B2 "romantic" alliance could be pretty interesting. He would be driven by self-interest, she would still be serving Starro but could Dox work over her mind to suit his own purposes? Even under Starro's power, I figure Dox will look out for himself.

Glad the quote has helped you. I leave it there as a reminder to myself to have more patience.

I loved your other quote but this new one is interesting, too.

Stormdaughter, I love that character for some reason, certainly had no trouble with Lobo!
THAT would be some match-up, for sure.

I don't know what she sees in Starro or why she'd stay with him if she didn't have to.
He's so ugly, inside and out.
Maybe, it's Stockholm Syndrome?

Vril better not trust Blackstar, either.

I wonder again, about Lydea Darkstar.
Where is she?
Did Vril put her in stasis for the last years so that she could emerge at her correct age with some more healthy growing years in her memory?
I wish.
sigh
I'd like her to team up with Lyrl again, as equals.

I feel so sorry for Comet.
He's one of my favorite DC characters, ever since he was in .LEGION.

Starfire has some major issues from her days as a child victim of rape and torture, which she's never resolved and may NEVER resolve.
Sad.

I caught on Rebels a bit but realize I’m way behind in terms of this thread still. All I know is the last few issues have been pretty good in terms of being solid stories, but there are a few things about this comic that are becoming more and more noticeably annoying. Namely, way too much attention is being focused on Dox and the Green Lanterns. For a ensemble cast, no one seems to be doing much other than Dox, Starfire and Lobo. Adam Strange & Captain Comet have good scenes every 2-3 issues but even that’s not enough. Worse than that is the large group assembled within the first 12 issues, who haven’t done anything in awhile. I hope this is rectified immediately.

Meanwhile, Starro is returning and that worries me too, considering scenes focusing on Starro a lot are already starting to bore me. Now that he’s returning, I’m realizing the ‘barbarian king’ look of the Starro is pretty dumb; the giant alien starfish look was much cooler, weirder and scarier. I must have just given it a pass at first so I could enjoy the new Rebels series. By now, I’m realizing its kind of sucky.

The writing is tight and the artwork is great. But the series needs to refocus on what makes it different from the other GL titles; it should be reveling in it’s diverse cast (and should by now have brought in Stealth completely restored).

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The writing is so brilliant for this book!
And the art is fantastic, too.
I love the Lobo clone twist and can't wait to see what happens next.

I WAS a little troubled to see what Lobo did to Storm Daughter, though.

Bleeding Cool has the book (and Doom Patrol and others) canceled. Mostly to make way for the Flashpoint minis that tie into the crossover.

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/02/14/dc-cancels-books-to-make-way-for-flashpoint/

Oh, fuck that.

Honestly, I think DC has given REBELS (and Doom Patrol) a pretty fair shake, given how much both have struggled saleswise pretty much from the get-go. I think if both were successful, Flashpoint would not have impacted them. The writing's been on the wall a long time. Marvel would've cancelled them after 4 or 5 issues.

The first Starro story went on too long, I considered dropping the title when I read of the new storyline.
I'll stay with it to the end now. Too bad, I did enjoy it for the most part.

Sales have been very low but stable for a long time...the writing was on the wall.

Gaa...aaahh...aack!

I like REBELS!

I'm trying not to take this news personally.

Drats!

'Drats' is right.
sigh

One of the few comics with limitless possibilities.
Super types not stuck to being heroes only.
Complex multicultural and angst ridden character interactions.
Backdrops to explore by the billions.

Did I sigh already?

Sorry to see this title go.

I thought the Starro plotline had been resolved by now. Guess not.

Still, hate to see a space-based title get axed. Such a variety beyond the Legion is good for DC.

Giffen's Doom Patrol was a good book too.

L.E.G.I.O.N./R.E.B.E.L.S. is a book with infinite potential and is a perfect compliment to DC's cosmic Green Lantern franchise, touching upon many of DC's cosmic properties that the Green Lantern hasn't touched upon (Vegan system, Omega Men, Tamaran, Psion). The book never seemed to find it's audience, partially because DC resisted the urge and missed to opportunity to tie the title closely to the Green Lantern Corps universe. Playing up the name of the organization, the part about Ending Lantern Supremacy, but more importantly the fact that Vril Dox was given a ring in the Sinestro Corps. If reinstated into the Corps Dox, as leader of R.E.B.E.L.S. would become the 2nd most powerful member of the Sinestro Corps. This would both provide Sinestro with a powerful new faction for his organization but also a powerful rival for control of his name sake Corp. Seeing Sinestro and Dox playing off each other would be a joy to read. Both are ego maniacs and their views of the universe aren't really that different. They are both all about control, whether by cunning, intelligence and/or manipulation. Sinestro while realizing that Dox is a treat would also recognize him as a tool for keeping him constantly sharp and on top of his game. It would also make R.E.B.E.L.S. a defacto Sinestro Corps book as well.

*removed*

And the writers kill a great character like Stealth for nothing....

Well, I'll miss it.

Lyrl gave Tribulous brains, head gear and a reboot.
NOW he looks like Validus.

I'm one of the few, I guess, but I hated Levitz's idea all those years ago of making one of the Granzz twins into Darkseid's revenge.

I was happy to see that debunked or something, in the retroboot.

*removed*

Well, I like REBELS and think it is one of the best titles out there, and I am sad to see it ending. While I'm not a big fan of how Wildstar came about (her creation did undermine the existence of two Legion characters from decades earlier), I still think the writing was sharp, innovative, and did credit to a large cast. I've always liked a science fiction space opera, and REBELS is one of the few that DC has out there. The artwork throughout the run has been top notch.

In regard to Validus, I thought the Validus virus that Garth/Proty had in 5YL was really an explanation on how Darkseid twisted the Ranzz child into Validus. The origin of the Validus-type creature(s) was never really explored until now, even though there have been random sightings of Validus-like creatures (besides Tribulus, the GL Validus for one). In regard to Pulsar Stargrave, that character was infrequently used, so a definitive origin for it was still open. The Pulsar Stargrave entity in REBELS was imaginative and fun.

I don't think that having similar characters in titles that are different from each other, in this case by about a thousand years is a problem, at all.

That's like saying that Supergirl bastardizes Superman or Jean Grey does the same for Saturn Girl or Sue Storm/Invisible Kid or Green Lantern/Green Lanterns or . . .

I find Wildstar to be the beginning of a wonderfully relized character. The fact that she was a cripple and outcast of her people alone, gives her a uniqueness that's sufficient to me.

Is the Roman goddess Venus bastardized because she's a direct copy of Aphrodite?

And I love the reverse Legacy of the dotLEGION idea.

Besides, I don't know if the Flashpoint title 'Legion of Doom' is about the Doom Patrol or dotLEGION or LSH or what?
So, maybe it's not canceled.

Love Kid Quislet's explaination of the Validus virus!

*removed*

My point with Venus/Aphrodite wasn't that it was unique but that it didn't seem to hurt either characterization. The Romans still worshipped her and the Greeks still loved her, too.

I <3 the Imperial Guard, both on their own and as a tribute to the Legion.

Lots of Kryptonians don't bother me.
Supreme doesn't bother me.
I like little side-kicks.

Since there's a thousand years between Lyrl's Pulsar and Tribulus and the Legion villians, I don't really even see them as connected much, other than for fun.

It's okay that you don't, you know.

But I'll take every type of dragon story I find, almost or animal/human bonding story or Stargate series or Star Trek.
Just me.

I'm just glad I get to read other people's opinions and state my own about these comics.

*removed*

I agree that it's doing damage for you.

But these characters are so far away from the Legion time period that they really have nothing to do with any of the LSH characters.

Lyrl's Stargrave, and certainly by it's nature and formation, has probably nothing to do with the 31st century version.
The possibly unaging Coluan tyrants might be a closer fit, but they were a number of boots ago.
Querl recently mentioned him in one of his journal posts, I think.

The Starhaven of the 21st century may have only limited association with the Dawnstar colony.
That tribe seemed to be limited and unhappy at best.

A new colony of Ameriands may decide to join the reminants centuries later forming the genetic basis for the newbies to grow wings and become interstellar trackers.

I know that I prefer to think that rather than loose the joy of Bedard's .REBELS or the original .LEGION.

Bedard introduced a number of technological goodies that had previously been from the Legion's time. What I'd like to see now is what happens between now and the future, the big technology standstill, or destruction. Flight rings and time travel are pretty much the only things that weren't available to R.E.B.E.L.S.

Why Bedard didn't develop the original team - the Durlan, the Khund, the Starhavenite, the Dominator et al - is a mystery and a disappointment. They really had some potential; at one point, they were a real team with individual personalities. Instead, we then got Adam Strange, Starfire, Captain Comet and - what must surely be the death knoll for a series these days - Lobo.

Regardless, I enjoyed R.E.B.E.L.S., especially the loony Dox family battles.

I agree 100%. This team was so kick-ass & had loads of potential, then POOF!!, relegated to one page or less per issue.
That, and the neverending Starros is what lost me.

I agree with all of the above.

Seems to me that an editor's job has changed over the years from one of providing continuity/consistency guidance to the creative team and reference footnotes to the reader to one of keeping tabs on the sales and providing helpful "suggestions" on which characters to insert to boost sales. REBELS sure seemed to be constantly receiving tweeks in this past year to improve the sales, unfortunately with little result.

Starros was overdone, but I think Mr Bedard wanted to complete his story, and probably didn't have time to give justice to an unrelated new story.

Well, the REBELS last issue (for this run) is out, and I guess the fact that there has been no comment on it here for days pretty much justifies DC's decision to end it.

I thought the artwork was superb, as with EVERY issue in the series (28 plus an annual). The read was as expected, a little rushed and trite, obviously trying to tie up as many loose ends as possible. I would have preferred an extra two issues to finish up everything, but Mr. Bedard did a nice job under the circumstances.

The most interesting thing about this issue was the modified Tribulus in action. The relationship of Comet and Starfire, and Vril Dox and Blackfire was also suitably addressed. Unfortunately, there wasn't enough time to address the Psion/Czarnian experiments - that was frustratingly not dealt with. The status of Smite, the 'final' fate of Starro, and the whereabouts of Lyrl were pleasantly left open for another day. The possibility of the rest of the REBELS reappearing soon in a GL story seems likely, especially with Mr. Bedard at the GL Corp writing helm.

I will miss this series. Any suggestions on what I might replace it with?

I don't know.
The GLC is the only other 'outer space' kind of DC comic besides the Legion books, isn't it?
I'm not up on all of the possibilities.
sigh

I loved the series, all of them.
I didn't love Starro much, though.
And what did Lobo do to Storm-Daughter, dang it?!

I hope Lyrl, the whole series was worth his development, imo, went to join Strata's family and figure out how to help his mom regenerate.

I'll miss that smarmy Vril, too.
And Wildstar, and Captain Comet and the others.