Whatever the DCU proper is I guess after Final Crisis.

Got this from Newsarama. Sorry no link...on a very slow wireless connection.

DC plans to integrate the Milestone heroes and the Archie heroes. From what I understand it won't be much of a integration as an introduction. Atleast I hope so. Don't want any major retcons just have them visit from their own timelines.

I'm a fan of both Milestone and Archie heroes. Milestone has Icon, Hardcase, STATIX while the Archie heroes have Shield, the Fly, Jaguar, Blackjack, etc.

I'm not a big fan of bringing Archie heroes into DCU. Better to be published by DC on own Earth and cross-over occassionally.

Milestone, I can see melding into DCU.

Both sets will be folded into the regular DCU from what I've read. The Archie heroes will be appearing initially in Brave & The Bold along side "regular" DCU heroes. These appearances will serves as their introduction to the DCU.

As for Milestone...Statix will be joining the Titans apparently and the others will inhabit the DCU as well. Their home city will be part of the geography along with Coast City, Keystone City, Metroplois, Gotham, etc.

I like the characters, but I don't want more intermingling. It makes things more complicated, there will be another crisis to explain it all, and dilutes the characters.

I hate to say it but I think DC is doing this to alleviate some of it's diversity issues. The Milestone characters are some beautifully rounded characters with major power levels that happen to be black.

The archie line brings up The Shield, a patriotic character that DC is also in short supply of.

Didn't DC already have the Archie Heroes? Their Impact! line of the early 90's was pretty badly done IIRC. But still, I like the heroes.

For Milestone, its worth it for Static alone, but I remember Hardware and Icon--and those series weren't exactly stellar either. But that had more to do with the creative teams then rather than the heroes themselves IMO.

Like CJ, as long as this doesn't overcomplicate things or flood the DCU with even more never-ending streams of heroes to 'dog-pile' on the bad guy du jour. I like that the Milestone heroes are all in the city of Dakota. It sets them apart but not too far apart.

ME Lad is a direct descendant of Jughead's.
Ethel - Jughead
Eyeful Ethel - ME Lad

Makes sense now doesn't it!

Honestly, I would prefer to see the Archie heroes in their own universe rather than part of an already crowded DCU.

Name one good musical band in the DCU? Batman could seriously use a little Bang-Shang-A-Lang

Would this include the Impact line?

Yes, "Archie heroes" refers primarily to the characters from the Impact line.

My question is --

How does this affect the continuity of Archie Meets the Punisher?

(And what about Pureheart the Powerful, Superteen, Captain Hero, and Evilheart?)

So, from sales reports, it looks like the Shield and the Web have been a bust and are on the verge of cancellation--DC is now trying to add in new things to hype them up. From the talk on this website (re: nonexistent) it appears no one here really took an interest either.

I bought some of the issues and recently caught myself up so I'll review:

- The Shield - I picked up the Shield one-shot and was unimpressed...almost causing me to skip the comic. I'm glad I didn't. The Shield has been surprisingly pretty good! For someone predisposed to say "meh" to a military-oriented superhero (been there, seen that too many times) it was going to take some effort to pull me in and not bore me, particularly if it starts getting preachy. Luckily, it has been good and I'd like to see it continue. I recently started a thread on Keith Giffen's Magog series, which started off with me on the fence (Magog appears in this initial storyline)--I think ultimately, I will cancel Magog and keep collecting the Shield, which is superior.

- Inferno back-up - the Inferno back-up in this title started off kind of dragging a bit and not really interesting me at all; however, its begun to heat up and I'm actually looking forward to it. I would never have bought Inferno if it was on its own, but as it is, it serves as a good back-up thus far.

- The Web - the Web was what I considered the best of the Red Circle one-shots by JMS. Great introduction of the concept and series and I was looking forward to it. Plus, the artwork and covers are gorgeous. Yet, its the opposite of the Shield: great one-shot, but the ongoing series is pretty bland and uninteresting. And the Web himself is a bit of cry-baby and suffers from "little rich boy syndrom" (re: rich kids deserve at least one good beating in their life, two if they complain about the first one). Interesting, Robert Kirkman and Todd McFarlane's Haunt debuted at the same time, and is very similar in the set-up of the series; its one of the rare occassions where an Image comic and a DC comic are very similar and the Image comic is a far superior product. Now, I know Matthew Sturges is coming on with #5 so I'm willing to dip back in the #5 and see what he can offer--I like House of Mystery but I'm not necessarily following him around from title to title like I would with some other writers.

- the Hangman back-up in the Web is actually really good thus far and better than the actual story its backing up. Still, its not enough to get me to buy the whole comic, so I'll likely drop the comic unless Sturges can improve the quality up front.

I'm pretty sure the back-ups for both comics are switching with #5 or #7 or something, and I don't mind that. I would mind either back-up continuing in the main story down the line. Really looking forward to Mike Avon Oeming coming on board too to revamp the Fox as well, as his type of energy could be used in these titles.

One final note--its well-known that when you license comics you lose another percentage of the profits because you have to pay the owners of the franchise. I suspect DC is losing money on these two titles. Yet, there is almsot zero promotion for them. Why even bother licensing them? What the hell is DC thinking? The same thing with the Milestone characters. Is this what they plan to do with Thunder Agents? Despite the praise I gave above to the Shield, unless DC does something to keep these titles going, this will be yet another failed revamp of these characters--going on 3 or 4 and counting.

I think they needed to introduce these characters slowly in other titles, as part of a larger storyline perhaps. (something that would develop over years, not just an event) The sudden influx of new titles with brand "new" characters is too much, too soon and with *no demand* for it.

I think it had more to do with the disconnect with the past. If they had launched them the way Red Circle did in the 80's, I think there would be more excitement.

As it is, the Archie characters are just more re-invention of the wheel rather than building upon the past to create an exciting & fascinating future.

I would be interested in the Archie heroes published by Archie. "Integrated into the DCU" Archie heroes hold absolutely zero interest for me.

Yeah, it's gotten to the point where integration into the DCU is a major minus for any concept or character these days, including the Captain Marvel franchise or Freedom Fighters, let alone the Archie heroes.

Seriously... DC and the comics industry as a whole would probably be better off if someone else bought up about half their properties.

The fact that these characters were being integrated into DCU was a big turn-off for me. I picked up the one shots, which I thought were good. Building upon what Nightcrawler said, these characters have a history, just not a DCU history.

For whatever reason, this worked a lot better with the Charlton characters. Maybe because it didn't seem so forced. Or maybe the DCU didn't seem as crowded then.

Actually I disagree with them not being in the DCU. I think they can work in a shared universe just like the Quality and Fawcett characters.

The problem is the same as with the Impact! version of the characters (which was separate from the DCU but failed just as much). Instead of continuing their adventures or introducing legacy characters based on the the original characters, DC decided to reboot them.

A concept that never works as we all well know. If they kept the history intact, then they might have had a chance at integrating better.

Further, they should have introduced a new Crusaders series. Team books usually fare better as they attract a more diverse audience.

I actually liked the first two issues of the Black Hood series. They're the only ones I have of that series, but they're the only issues of Impact I've fully read.

Hmm... I don't think reboots are necessarily a problem, particularly with properties that have lain fallow for awhile. It seems to me it would be even more of a mess if they tried to shoehorn the past Archie hero stories as things that happened in the DCU.

For Archie Comics, a Return to Superheroes...

Trying to all-digital route, it seems...

I'd actually be interested in the non-DCU Archies heroes but I don't do digital comics.

The relatively recent DC relaunch of The Web seemed interesting, but I don't recall the rest of the Archie super-heroes seeming that intriguing.

I was kind of surprised how many super-characters they had (scroll way the heck down!), what with the Mighty Crusaders and all.

So I read New Crusaders #1. Not bad, but also a story that it feels like I've read plenty of times before.

Still, I'm interested enough to see where it goes from here.

Three issues in and I'm still finding this comic enjoyable, but not definitely not anything mind-blowing. Still, it's a pretty solid "kids stepping in to fill the legacies of their super-hero parents" story.

Wow! New Crusaders has really stepped up its game with #5! The Brain Emperor is recruiting villainous allies at Z.I.P. prison, and the New Crusaders have their first mission to restrain escaping prisoners until M.L.J., the organization that usually handles such things, shows up, not realizing that M.L.J. has already been taken out by the Brain Emperor. Fortunately for the kids, it looks like they may be receiving unexpected help from inside the prison!

This is pretty groovy comic, with very much of an early 80s kind of feel to it. Fans of team comics with tons of characters, books with tons of history but without continuity getting in the way of story, sudden unexpected battlefield romances, truly vile villains, and talking monkeys would all do well to check out this book!