comin' to CW? Is the show a go? Anyone heard?

Surprisingly, this is the only thread I've found for the Flash TV show (Though I know it's been discussed in 'What are you WATCHING').

I thought the show should go to it's own thread, so I'm bumping this one.

My kids and I really dig this show. Far more age appropriate than Arrow, yet still fresh, fun and accessible. I'm hoping they can keep this balance going forward.

"Not God.... Grodd!"

I've repeated the canard in the past that DC seems to be almost ashamed of it's comic book heroes and the inherent goofiness of the genre, as if everything has to be Batman Begins levels of ultra-serious and colorless and grim, but the Flash totally makes me eat those words, because it's flat-out embracing the genre. Not everything is exactly the same (there likely won't be a city full of super-intelligent apes...), but they still have done some awesome and 'four-color' stuff, instead of sticking to very serious people doing very 'realistic' things.

I'm generally okay with things being different, between iterations of a property, such as being able to enjoy the Threeboot for what it was, despite it not being 'my Legion,' so I'm okay with the various changes being made adapting Flash (and his various Rogues) to the television screen (such as Weather Wizard not using a wand, or whatever).

I wasn't a fan of the kid playing Barry Allen, but his enthusiasm is infectious and really seems to be pouring himself into the role. I think I'd still prefer someone who looks a bit older, but I can't blame the guy for that, and he's doing an amazing job of it!

Between Gotham, Arrow and Constantine, we're not lacking for more serious shows, so it's kind of refreshing to have the Flash portrayed as a young hero who is totally enjoying his powers, and comes from a more idealistic 'I want to help people!' motivation.

It's not, IMO, a great show (usual idiot-ball plot devices, and some awkward dialogue), but it's got some heart to it, and hopefully it can grow into something even better.

As I said before, the fact that they've somehow turned Barry into Peter Parker is pretty much my least favorite aspect of the show.

It's definitely not how I'd do a Flash show, but it's pretty fun on its own merits if you watch it without preconceptions, though.

Arrow can be a chore for me to watch ( but not as much as Agents ). I really look forward to The Flash.


Re: Peter Parker


I think it's more the actor than the plan or did you mean the actual plot?

The Flash part, I think he's nailed. The postures and the movement are really good in my opinion. It's the Barry part. Any scene with or referring to Iris, he acts as if he's 14. I think over the year I notice a concerted effort for him to lower his voice. That is helping.

Ultimately, I think the actor is growing into the role.


I don't really like their take on the Rogues but I'm adjusting. The only character I really don't like is Cisco. He's an idiot and this actor also plays him as if he's a teen whose voice is changing. Iris would be my second least favorite.

Jesse Martin plays easily my favorite character.


Linda Park character and actor has it all over the Iris character and IMO, plays much better off this Barry than Iris but the plot between them got stale real quick.

Both, really. I mean... the whole science nerd, family tragedy, love life problems... all read more Peter Parker than how I think of Barry Allen. The fact that the actor is struggling to seem like he's over 18 doesn't help.

I've been raving about last night's episode over on Facebook. To me, this looks to be the episode where the show really starts clicking on all cylinders. (Other than the frag grenade thing, but I digress.) The actors, the plot, everything just hit the right note. For example, I was wondering if they'd just have Barry ignore that his discovery about his mom's murder meant that he, in fact, failed, but they didn't and actually nailed it.

And it sure didn't hurt that I have a soft spot for the Ronnie Raymond/Martin Stein iteration of Firestorm, and it was done so well! No, Ronnie's not a teenager, Firestorm apparently can't transmute elements--but the essence was absolutely there and KICKED ASS!!!

In earlier episodes they mentioned the original purpose of F.I.R.E.S.T.O.R.M. was for elemental transmutation, so the door is certainly open for them to bring that in.

I actually wouldn't mind it if they left it out, only because the power has always seemed like too much at times. I mean, he could transmute bullets into flowers (among other extravagancies)! If they can clearly define and limit the parameters, though, I'd be all for it.

Same here, Firestorm was extremely powerful and versatile. Maybe they can also have the transmutation show up as a new power and have him slowly learn it and define its limits.

Simple transmutation of one element to another might actually work well, but the full-blown restructuring of objects (bullets to flowers) might be a little difficult to pull off credibly.

I always did like the restriction of his powers to non-organics, though.

The fire thing is taken so I hope they do the transmutation but yeah, limitations please. At least Barry gets hungry when he runs. Converting mass has to have some restrictions on size or speed or something.

Not sure I'm liking the look of Grodd. Does he seem kind of plasticky? The FX people are going to have their hands full on that one I imagine. Still looking forward to the story line though.

It's a tough challenge on a TV budget to pull off a Grodd, but I feel that what we saw was pretty decent.

Maybe it's because I watched on the laptop. I fell asleep before it came on tv and didn't wake up until after so I caught up the episode on-line.

Between snows days, freeze days, sick days and holidays, I pretty much get paid to sit home, which has my active/sleep schedule all messed up.

So the last episode made my son cry and my daughter cheer. They must be doing something right.

It also made me cry and yes they are!

I teared up as well.

Can someone please spoil it for me? It might get me to give the show a second chance.

I'd rather ask what turned you off to it???

The pilot had a lot of rough edges IMO. The Johns influence and my own antipathy towards it at work, I guess. But everyone here has been saying it's improved by leaps and bounds.

It's freaking great!! But spoiling what happened this week won't entice you to watch if you aren't invested in the show.

Fair enough. Maybe I'll wait until the season is over and then watch the whole thing. Thanks, Lash.

You won't regret it, I think. It does a swell job of homaging the source material, but DON'T expect things to be 100% comic faithful.

I definitely wasn't sold on the pilot either, but, once you get over some major flaws in the setup of the show, it's actually quite a bit of fun. And not afraid to embrace it's comic book origins, which is the problem with a lot of DC adaptations in particular.

Dave, I need to hang out with your kids. I was basically doing both things too!

Ps - I'm pretty sure at this point the Flash is my comic book related show of all time, animated or live action. Hell, it beats most if not all the superhero movies too.

I stopped watching the show after episode 2. Based on the what you guys say, I guess I'll give it a second chance.

Thanks for all the feedback, guys.

And cheers, Stalgie. To second chances.

All my dorm mates have been on my ass for not watching the show. I guess giving it a second chance will get them off my back.

I will say this, I wasn't impressed with the first couple of issues, since they seemed to play like an after school special, falling into the same trap of since it was based on a comic, being schmaltzy, sappy and aimed straight for the ten year old.

They've gotten better, no more lines like "when I'm out there, it's not just me, it's us, a team." Really bad writing that.

However, it's gotten better, and they aren't futzing around with the villains. Still got a touch of too much angst, but much much improved.

Season 1 is on the books. Thoughts?

A very satisfying finale, and next year's spin off team series looks like a blast.

I go back and forth between whether all the winks and nods are awesome or groan worthy (Like last night when Barry's lamenting to Joe about how he can get Time Travel to work safely while literally sitting on a TREADMILL).

Anyone else think Thawne was the one who killed Joe's wife to prevent Wally from existing at all?

They have been teasing time travel all season, with many warnings that even the slightest change in the past could wreak havoc with the timeline.

And yet a massive alteration to both the past and future has occurred, and the present remains pretty much the same?

Nothing that happened this entire season could have possibly happened. Plus, they have created an irresolvable time paradox.

I think CW Flash has been written into a corner.

On the other hand, I laughed when Jay Garrett's helmet popped out of the wormhole and Reverse Flash says, "Time for me to go."

They have created a massive paradox, which is why I think the wormhole re-opened.

I suspect the first part of next season will be Barry trying to find a way to mesh the paradox with his present reality (which will likely lead to the appearance of Rip and the mid-season spin-off with all the Time Travel hijinx). It sounds like there's a plan, and they've been reasonably good until now with their payoffs that I'll give this some time to play out.

Yeah, the treatment of time travel was frustratingly inconsistent. With his previous time travel experience he replaced his former self and got to relive everything again, but this time we three versions of him co - existing at the same time.

Still... fun as long as you don't think about it too much. And Jay's helmet was definitely a geek out moment.

About as pretty a tv show to watch as I've seen. The effects were fantastic. Lots of reasons to rewatch, to catch easter eggs. Everyone brought the A game to the acting. First time Iris' emotional scenes rang true for me but Cavanagh was on a whole other level.



As mentioned, Jay's helmet and "Well's" comment were too fun and the penultimate scene set the internet abuzz with the word, "vasectomy." Before shooting myself in the chest I would have had least tried a little squeeze to see if Reverse Flash faded a bit.

Spin off:

Seems an odd assortment of characters. Any reconizable comic book based method there?


Captain Cold is really coming around to what I'd expected from the get go. At first he was too much from the Batman mold of bad-guys, ala maniacal murderer but he seems to be coming around to that snarky rogues leader with principals and limitations. There's enough room in the show for the killers but the rogues I prefer were blue collar guys just trying to make a dishonest buck and the cities were as much theirs as they were the Flash's.

I really like the Prison Break Bros being included in "Legends," and I really hope it gives them the opportunity to get some depth. I find their performances borderline cartoony at the moment. And I really don't understand why they "needed" Cold during that prison transfer episode. They had the power dampener in the truck and they had Cisco who y'know *made* Cold's gun (and Glider's gun in like what, ten minutes?) and even then, Cold didn't seem to actually do anything other than tag along.

Yeah, that whole prison transfer episode didn't make a whole lot of sense plotwise either, other than "we have a certain outcome we want to achieve to let's have the characters do completely stupid things to get there".

For whatever reason, this lineup reminds me of the "JLI" crew. (Canary in a new outfit? Cold and Heatwave has the Blue & Gold bromance down, a time traveler - Rip instead of Booster, charming billionaire Ray instead of Max (ok, that one's a stretch))

Spin off:

The Doctor: Time Lord

Rip Hunter: Time Master

The Doctor: Adventures in time with a variety of companions

Rip Hunter: Adventures in time with a variety of companions

The Doctor: TARDIS is bigger on the inside than the outside

Rip Hunter: Time Sphere is bigger on the inside than the outside

The Doctor: When he dies, regenerates with a completely different appearance and personality. No one knows his real name.

Rip Hunter: When he dies, is replaced by another Time Master with a completely different appearance and personality. Rip Hunter is an assumed alias; no one knows his real name.

The Doctor: First premiered on British TV in November 1963.

Rip Hunter: First premiered in American comics in May 1959.

I just re-watched the final and became even more convinced, strange science aside they just nailed it.

Would be really jazzed for a Crisis of Two Worlds and would probably giggle hysterically if two effects of his foray into the past were Wells isn't dead and Barry's hair turns blond (even though Mom was a redhead and Dad brunette.) Shrug.

So, I don't have TV service at home, but I just got the season 1 DVD. Which episode is the one in which Abra Cadabra turns Flash into a puppet?

^^That's the episode after the one in which Grodd makes him weigh 1000 pounds!

Cool!

Sorry, only one time-travelling supervillain per season, and this year its Vandal Savage!

Is it me or is it bad writing?

Dr. Caitlin Snow & Ronnie Raymond.

Ronnie is apparently killed in the big blast. Caitlin is mourning him for 9-10 months. Then she sees him, albeit with metahuman abilities and anmesia. And now she is all "Ronnie is dead. I have to move on."

Am I missing something or is this bad writing?

Quislet, you have to understand that CW The Flash is first and foremost a soap opera. Whereas a sit-com will sacrifice character development for a joke, the soap-opera will sacrifice character, continuity, and good sense for the weepy-teary, choke-in-the-throat moment of super-pathos.

Yes, bad writing. But comic books could be used to teach university-level courses in bad writing!

Just sit back and enjoy the show.

The show is not perfect, and there are certainly stretches of bad writing and plot contrivances, but overall the show improves as it goes. I first started watching it as a parental control for my kids to determine if it was something good for them, but by the end of the season I ended up enjoying it just as much as them.

I never said I didn't enjoy it. In face, I do!

Not everything can be Citizen Kane.

Also, I am enjoying the series. However little points like this make me enjoy it not as much as I could.

This is definitely a series in which the more you think about it the less you'll enjoy it.

Honestly, as a comics fan, we're used to suspending disbelief, so why do otherwise for TV?

In any case I think the great things about Flash far exceed its shortcomings.

Also true of ARROW. For the most part, for me it's like I just sit back and enjoy that it is even happening at all.

WASH OVER ME, FLASH & ARROW... like a great big ol bubblebath!

SCREAM QUEENS is the show I'm enjoying putting tons of thought into right now believe it or not.

Finally caught the rest of last season's finale with tonight's rerun, would be lying if I didn't admit Barry's reunion with his mom made me tear up a little.

CW's The Flash is still my favorite soap opera.

No spoilers here, but much deep pathos and near-weeping in the premiere episode. Also pretty good bad special effects.

And how do you resolve an irresolvable time paradox? Just ignore it!

I'm still back at the second episode of the first season.I really need to get around to giving it a second chance.

There I was, trolling the internet, minding my own business, when I come across the new Vixen animated series on CWSeed.

Seven episodes, five minutes each.

I have to say, Arrow and Flash look great as cartoons.

When I say trolling, I mean like fishing.

Loved the homage to the classic "Flash of Two Worlds" cover in the new ep! Little bummed that Jay was sans super powers, though.

I was a good episode, but this is the 2nd episode in a row where Barry kills the bad guy. I'm not digging this turn of events.

I loved the "On another Earth, Detective West might be a nobel-prize winning physicist" (you know, like he is in the comics) bit. I had a few moments a fear that the villain was going to turn out to be Sandy Hawkins, which would really have annoyed me.

There's still a lot of bits that frustrate me about this show, but, yeah, it's hard not to geek out at the Flash of Two Worlds homage.

The helmet is cool.

Barry (and Jay) killing without a second thought is a problem but then I'm not enamored with the Rogues either.

Terrific ending though.

Seems like a lot of meta-humans died in season 1, too.

Everyman, Multiplex, Blackout, Plastique, Deathbolt, and Girder.

Caitlin Raymond is taking her recent widowhood pretty well, putting the moves on Jay. But then, everybody is pretty clinically depressed all the time on this show, so I imagine they could be pretty good at dealing with situational depression as well.

And Barry and Iris are back to being just really good friends? For a show that's all about changes in the New 52 universe, nothing ever really changes. I guess, with Earth-1 that really makes 53, though.

My problem is Barry is old enough to have gone through college and have been on the job a couple of years at least, and yet he's "learning lessons" like a teenager.

Barry was always a bit old for his age. This views a lot more like Wally than Barry a lot of the time.

He also looks like he's about 18.

But, yeah, I've said from the beginning that to enjoy this show you have to ignore the fact that they just pretty much stuck the name "Barry Allen" on a character who has very little to do with the guy from the comics.

Sums it up pretty good. Oddly, the Jay actor would have made a decent Barry.

"I've said from the beginning that to enjoy this show you have to ignore the fact that they just pretty much stuck the name "Barry Allen" on a character who has very little to do with the guy from the comics."

They used the "Arrow" model-- where it's not just Barry or Oliver, but a whole team working together to support the "hero".

And the focus is on the relationships between the team members-- to the point of becoming soap-opera-esque.

But look at how successful soap operas have been over the years!

Same model is going to be used in the upcoming Supergirl. Supergirl's "squad" includes Jimmy Olsen, Winslow Schott, Jr., Alexandra Danvers, and she maybe ends up working for an entire government agency.

Again, not like in the comics. This is a different universe.

My problem with killing all the super-villains is that that the creators are not really thinking very creatively about Barry's powers. With the resources of Star Labs behind him, he ought to be able to safely contain and imprison his opponents. There have been references to the idea that Central City itself is also developing some ability to deal with and imprison meta-humans.

The deaths last season weren't great either, but they were situational and for the most part understandable. This season has been different so far. "Sorry I couldn't risk you hurting anyone else." Really?

And this week's "Hey let's just turn him to glass!" "Cool, then we can smash him!"

It's of course a by-product of lazy writing so they can't tell Barry any more about Zoom or where the portals are, but it's been grating.

I am becoming a little disappointed in Season Two.

I can forgive the silly pseudo-science. Captain Cold’s gun freezes lasers into ice? OK. Cisco’s machine looks for “ultra-violet cold signatures” instead of “infra-red heat signatures”? Dumb, but OK.

But the fundamentals of the show, the personal relationships, are just becoming unbelievable.

“So for nearly my whole life, you told me Mom is dead, but she’s actually just a dope fiend who took twenty years to dry out? Great! Thanks! When can we get all together? Can we have cake?”

“Captain Cold, I told you to stop killing people. Well, now that you only tried to murder me once this episode, and also murdered YOUR OWN FATHER maybe now I can trust you to start murdering the only the right people, and be a hero, like me.”

And Caitlin + Jay = Weird, but maybe that’s just me.

Ultra-violet cold is solid science, whether they know it or not. I suspect they do, at least superficially or I can't imagine why they'd set themselves up like that. Sci-fi writers are usually pretty savvy.

I'm on board though with some of the personal relationships, particularly Caitlin + Jay, "weird" being a great description and the smiley faced, he can be redeemed interview. Most of the others pretty good, better than in the past season and I think the attempt at parallel between the Snarts and Jesse was well done, plus it gave Martin a chance to do some real acting.


Not to pile on, I think they are finally starting to nail the Captain Cold character but the path they took to get him there was a fail. The father hate and close resulting relationship with sister was ALL they ever needed. Adding the "lives by a code" is a little revisionist considering what they'd already done with the character. Killing his father, I get. All the others? No.

Loved the opening sequence The actors I didn't think could act, are starting to learn. Barry's chemistry with Patty is promising but it helps that he seems to be interacting with a real actor now.


I'm liking the show more and more.

On the CW app, they keep advertising this show with the exchange between Jay and Barry about "They call you the Scarlet Speedster? I'm the Crimson Comet!" which amuses me because of how horribly inaccurate it those nicknames are for the actual colors of their costumes. So now I'm trying to think of an alliterative nickname that begins "the Bergundy..."

The Maroon Missile?

The Firestorm episode was a step back in the right direction (though I laughed at the scene with the Flash costume right out in the open while they were talking to Hewitt). I can only assume they couldn't get the same actor who played Jason Rusch in Season 1 back (but why not recast him?). Jefferson Jackson's a pretty obscure Firestorm character to bring into the fold.

King Shark was great!

One step closer to Wally, which made my kids jump up and down and dance a lot when the brother came up.

The Burgundy Blur?

The Careening Carmine Conflagration?

The Ruby Rush?

The Sangria Streak?

That's my favorite

They really need a stress reliever ep and King Shark would be perfect. That was really cool. Some of these shows are so trying to "be real" they forget to have occasional fun.

I'm really digging Patty Spivot as a character!

Much more appealing as a love interest than either Linda or Iris, imo.

That's true and this episode they finally figured out how to get him to ask her out. I was beginning to think the writers couldn't ask someone out.

Yeah, I like Patty "I'm a detective. You think I wouldn't notice you're blind" Spivot.

I am hoping she will stay because, boy, the turnover in characters is super-fast in this show. Henry Allen was gone in episode one. Martin Stein flew away with Jefferson Jackson at the end of last week’s episode and was not part of the team on this episode. Now Jay Garrick is gone, although Caitlyn Snow Raymond pathetically begged him to stay, and Hawkgirl shows up.

My head is spinning.

I can easily understand Caitlin/Jay. Jay's a goode olde-fqshioned superhunk! deelish!! and ronnie ain't ever afound fofr more rhan a few minutes becuse reasons!! Ain't nobody got time for that. hey Jay I like your haircut!!

You'd think that now that they know the singularity is a portal to another Earth that somebody would stop for a second and think "Hey, maybe Ronnie was dragged into that other Earth!" though.

For some of the greatest scientific minds on their Earth, they are all rather dense.

It would be awesome if Earth-2 Wells just stops every so often and says, "Man, you people are MORONS!"

The LOVE of her life has been dead for like a minute. I think a little mourning might be in order before jumping on the next banana.

Besides, she's one of the more poorly played characters IMO and isn't that also the same actress playing Harry's daughter on the other Earth? Ewww.


And when did Hawkgirl show up? I missed that somehow.

Kendra Saunders is the Post-Zero Hour Hawkgirl.

It's been 6-8 months since Ronnie's death, and his second one at that (and she spent a whole year mourning for the first one). I don't think it's unheard of for someone to enter into a relationship after that amount of time. Whether it's a legitimate romance on her part or displaced grief is another question entirely, that I imagine they'll explore.

6-8 months? Was that something in the storyline? I thought they probably just picked up this season where they left off last season.

Yeah, I believe six months was what they established in the Season premiere.

Ronnie needs to quit







dying for five minutes!!!!

I actually thought that briefly as well, but it's another actress (and rumored to be another prominent DC hero!).

OK maybe I get the no-prize for dumbness, but that emoji showed up accidentally. I have seen posters change text, quote direct from other posts, and insert descriptive links, videos, and pictures into posts. Is there an easy way to do all this? HTML does not seem to work.

I've feeling you're not seeing what most of us are. Above every post is an option to "quote." Hitting reply brings up many emoticon options as well as basic typesetting and options for including images and videos.

The "quick quote" button above each post allows you to easily quote the post in question.

If you click "Switch to Full Reply Screen" below your post you'll see a series of buttons above allowing you access to the smilies, to link urls, embed videos, etc.

Thanks! I was not seeing this. I also posted this question on the wrong thread. I wondered where it went then ta-da here it is.

re: Latest episode of Flash: Why didn't Zoom kill Flash when he had the chance? He has supposedly been trying to all season?

Don't think... don't start...

I got the whole "show off to the press, police and his friends that I've beaten him" bit (though how did he know about STAR Labs?). The bigger question is that if Zoom is this powerful and doesn't lose his speed on Earth-1 like Jay did, then why bother with sending other lackeys through to attack Barry at all?

I'm kind of surprised that they are getting away with a giant man-shark and a talking gorilla on this show.

But the ratings don't really seem to take a hit.

Plus, people from Earth-Two pretending to be people from Earth-One and vice versa. When will they figure out this isn't going to work?

puzzled. That's "Flash" ain't it? Talking Gorillas and stuff. I'd pee my pants for a Gorilla City one-shot. I think it'd make a great spin-off.

The Earth 2 Earth 1 thing is probably more a problem for those that can keep track, which wouldn't be me. Except for Jay, I don't really know who started where.

What's the run down on that?

Yeh, well, but you know Block only about a thousand peopel in the U.S. even read comics anymore, but those that are watching Flash on the TV seem OK with talking gorillas thing. And if any real gorillas were watching, I think there might be a kind of uncanny-valley thing happening there. Not critical, just an observation. I watch it for the soap opera. Everybody wants a Dad, everybody wants a Son, etc.

Each of the shows do seem to have some underlying theme. The "Dad" think is touching but I hadn't really connected Grodd into that until you mentioned it.


Still not seeing the issue with talking gorillas though I think it's actually thinking gorilla. Grodd talks doesn't he? Now that I think about it, I don't recall for sure.

I just finished watching the first three seasons of "Arrow" on Netflix and it was sooooo much better than I expected. Next is the first season of Flash. What I am really excited about is "Legends of Tomorrow" next year. It is supposed to feature Atom, White Canary, Hawkgirl, Hawkman, Firestorm, Heatwave, and Captain Cold vs. Vandal Savage. I can't wait!

“Famous” talking apes in TV and movies:

(1) The original Planet of the Apes movies the original with Charlton Heston, all notoriously bad.
(2) Mr. Smith: Talking orangutan, originally from the Clint Eastwood movies. Only talking. They ran all thirteen episodes before locking them away in the vault, never to be seen again.
(3) Congo: Haven’t seen it, but 22% on Rotten Tomatoes.
(4) The 2 most recent Planet of the Apes movies, with Andy Serkis as Caesar. Actually pretty good, both of them.

Nothing personal against talking gorillas, they just don’t seem to be at the top of the list in popular culture. Talking babies, dogs, and even mules have seen more success. But Flash seems to be making a go of it.

Yes, Grodd, Barry and Iris all have Daddy issues. Cisco and Wells, kinda-sorta, too, in a mentorish way.

And

The original Planet of the Apes is a classic!

From Wikipedia:

Planet of the Apes was well received by critics and is widely regarded as a classic film and one of the best films of 1968, applauded for its imagination and its commentary on a possible world gone upside down. The film holds an 89% "Certified Fresh" rating on the review aggregate website Rotten Tomatoes, based on 47 reviews.In 2008, the film was selected by Empire magazine as one of The 500 Greatest Movies of All Time.

The film won an honorary Academy Award for John Chambers for his outstanding make-up achievement. The film was nominated for Best Costume Design (Morton Haack) and Best Original Score for a Motion Picture (not a Musical) (Jerry Goldsmith). The score is known for its avant-garde compositional techniques, as well as the use of unusual percussion instruments and extended performance techniques, as well as his 12-note music (the violin part using all 12 chromatic notes) to give an eerie, unsettled feel to the planet, mirroring the sense of placelessness.

I STAND CORRECTED.

Back in the 90s my then-boyfriend took us to see ALL FIVE Planet of the Apes movies in an intense movie marathon. No breaks.

Apparently there was also a Planet of the Apes TV show.

A Gorilla City spin-off now seems entirely likely.

Man, I was so disappointed with Grodd's origin last year, but I was all "Well, I guess Gorilla City is just a bit too far-fetched for television."

Needless to say I was very pleased with this week's episode.

I know right!

Having Gorilla City be on Earth-2 was a clever shortcut to have it already be established without coming from out of nowhere and still allows Grodd to be unique.

This is beginning to make me think that trips to Earth-2 will be as frequent as Clark shooting back and forth from Smallville to Metripolis in "Smallville." (I swear, it seemed like they were just down the road with how often the various characters dropped by)

I was underwhelmed by the introduction of Grodd and pleasantly surprised by the character's return. I'm glad that the potential King Kong/Faye Raye bit was avoided and thoroughly enjoyed the notion of Gorilla City.

I'd love to see some of the Earth-2 characters pop up as heroes (such as Atom Smasher).

Still not sure how I feel about Vibe, but I haven't seen him break dance yet.

Fan fiction is weird.

Looks like Barry Allen / Leonard Snart slash is a thing now.

Tonight's ep! Jumpin Fishhooks!

Loved the Multiversal cameos!

Watched an episode of the Flash for the first time to catch the Legion references. I am glad I do not live in either of the two Universes this parade of clowns are tasked with protecting.

"You need to work on finding Zoom, and forget about what people who are not you are doing with their lives." -- good advice from Dr. Wells, but exactly what everyone in this episode is wasting their time doing. Then, when Zoom and his henchmen find them: No plan! No plan at all!

I'm betting that Earth-Two Barry 'Clark' Allen is Zoom, but I'm not wasting my time following this to find out.

There do seem to be some problems coming up with credible plans to further the plot. It's like the writers want to get from point A to point B, and it would be really interesting to do so, but lacking a good plan to make it happen, throw crap on a wall. Tonights "speed transfer" handshake deal an example. Who would do that? Who would believe the other party would follow through? Not credible in the least.

Complaints on-line about the treatment of "Jay Garick." I don't get why it's not generally figured out? That's not Jay Garick, it's Hunter Soloman. No WAY they turn Jay Garick/Flash into a bad guy. Jay Garick is the caged guy in the mask, right?

It's been awhile since comment but I'd have to say this week's episode might be the best single episode of a superhero show I've seen. Certainly of the main dc-marvel group.

They've found some snappy dialogue, good balance of serious and humor and unusual for ANY show, I can actually watch two characters talking to each other and enjoy it. They seem to have the best villain group to me.

Most importantly to Flash I suppose, the actors have grown into the Barry and Iris characters and they are meshing well together as a romantic couple but any scene with Barry and Jay is golden.

No, REALLY, HOW awesome was tonight's episode??? All I could keep thinking was how much Lash would have loved it. I can't get over how many of the actors from the combined DC shows can sing... Cisco, Winn, Dr. Stein, Merlyn..??? The GLEE twins had the cutest spotlight duet, but Grant took top honors with Barry's finale/ serenade for Iris-- of *course*, it's HIS show--!! Glad I watched it tonight!

Can't wait to watch it!

Flash Season 1: Wells/Thawne spends the entire season desperately trying to keep the team from inadvertently changing the future because time is so fragile.
Flash Season 3: The team finds it incredibly hard to change the future because time is so inflexible.

I'm watching the season 2 ending right now and all I can say is "Barry cries yet again".

Damn, that boy's got some waterworks.

Last night's episode (second to last of season 3) was so incredibly frustrating in terms of how incompetent all of the characters were in (barely) trying to prevent a Team Flash member's death... I gotta believe it was all just a setup to "trick" the big bad, but if not, dang, the writer's made Barry and co. come off entirely stupid...

The big story arc of this season definitely ended up pretty lame.

Apart from a few strong episodes (the musical one being the one that worked best), this season really blew what was a promising start, with the Flashpoint/Dr. Alchemy storyline. The moment they shifted to yet another evil speedster as the big bad, it just went downhill. It sounds like they are avoiding that trap next season, but I'm hoping we finally get to see Barry as the confident inspirational role model hero instead of the perpetual beginner.

Interestingly, Arrow, which I've always been pretty up and down about, ended on one of the best episodes of the series.

I'm currently watching all of season 2. It's tough slogging, I have to say. The special effects are great, and Black Flash is frankly awesome. But everything else plays like lame super-hero soap opera.

I thought season 2 was overall good, but season 3 really recycled seasons 1 and 2 for an overall dissatisfying experience.

However, season 4 has been a real delight to this point! They've lightened up the tone to the point where I routinely laugh several times per episode. I'm loving it this approach and hope it keeps up! Key to this working is the introduction to the show of one Ralph Dibny. While there are some notable differences to the character, specifically his backstory, they've found a really suitable actor for the role. So far, I'd say Flash is my favorite for best Arrowverse show this season! (My winners for the previous 3 years were Arrow season 5, Supergirl season 1 & Flash season 1, for anyone who's curious. Legends of Tomorrow, btw, is looking up this year with a similar turn to lightening up as Flash.)

Yeah, overall season 3 wasn't great, but it did have some great moments. What stood out the most was Tom Cavanagh, who got to play several different characters, and was a lot of fun. The musical crossover was fun, as was the Gorilla stuff.

The more time Caitlin spends as Killer Frost, the more I like her. I already thought her character was pretty cool (and sometimes, in a room with Barry and Cisco, feels like the adult in the room), but she just chews scenery as Killer Frost (and the CW shows are great for that, with Damien Dahrk taking the cake for scenery-chewing, across the shows).

I have a long history of preferring 'Lower Decks' characters who aren't the main lead over the main lead themselves, and this show is no different. I spend half my viewing time wishing Barry would either magically become half as smart as a six-year old, or run away very fast and not come back for a long time.

I do wish that with all the time resets, Firestorm/Ronnie would have mysteriously been alive again, but I suppose the actor hasn't been consistently available...

I would like to see Ronnie back again, if only for the Firestorm/Killer Frost interaction

I am SO glad they finally got away from Evil Speedster and Barry Needs To Get Faster tropes this season because I was honestly gonna give up on this show if they trotted that out again. I actually really like the Thinker and his wife, they have got a pretty unique dynamic for supervillains!

While I am glad the trial wasn't long and drawn out, it did seem weak in a few ways: (1) the lack of evidence regarding Clifford's visit to the Allen/West apartment. If Barry was really so threatening, why go alone? Where is the evidence that he gained entry without breaking in? How did the cops know to turn out at the right moment? Seems like Cecille had plenty of areas to cast doubt - especially in light of Ralph's pics. (2) Barry's alibi. As I recall (it has been a month since the prior ep), Barry was with a lot of people when he got the alarm that someone was in the apartment. (3) establishing time of death. If it was recent enough to tar Barry's alibi (2) but long enough for the cops to have gotten there, compiled with the wide's seeming new lover and HIS phone call to Barry while the cops are en route, seems like clear turf to argue it was a set-up.

I watched my first Flash show! It was the one with Ralph Digby and they face the Black Bison.

I thought it was fun and that Ralph Digby could not have been better cast! wow! I also really liked the update on Black Bison's powers.

I might watch from now on. Seems overwhelming to go back to the start!

Summary of previous seasons:

Season One: Barry has to get faster in order to beat the Reverse-Flash!
Season Two: Barry has to get faster in order to beat Zoom!
Season Three: Barry has to get faster in order to beat Savitar!

Now you're caught up!

Thanks!



Also, they're different?????

One is Eobard Thawne, the other is Hunter Zolomon (from another Earth, so he kind of fills the Earth-3 Johnny Quick role as well).

Mystery Girl/Jenni Ognats*/Dawn Allen showed up again in the CWverse last night.
She paid for Cisco & Ralph's coffee and talked about "the principle of infinite consequences at work in our lives". She also has a book that she writes in using the symbols Barry was writing with in episode 1.[u][/u]



*my guess

Amunet Black is a painfully annoying character... Any time she turns up, the show slows to a grinding halt...

All Arrowverse shows (including Black Lightning, which may or may not be part of the 'verse) have been announced to be returning next season.

Flash is doing well with its first non-speedster Big Bad, with the main caveat that with the Thinker hopping bodies, we aren't seeing much of the actor who originated the role--who I think is fantastic!

Legends of Tomorrow has had really improved and witty writing since mid-season. They've even made me enjoy Damien Darhk somewhat when I've always hated the character and especially the actor who plays him (I thought he was okay as Dum-Dum Dugan, though, in the first Captain America film). Looking very much forward to Matt Ryan being a full-time cast member next season as Constantine. I enjoyed his cancelled CBS show and think he makes a great Constantine.

Supergirl and Arrow have been....mixed bags...this season, but I've never considered stopping watching either of them.

CW hasn't yet committed to (definite non-Arrowverse show) iZombie yet. I've enjoyed the show over its course, but the current new season may be stretching the concept to its logical conclusion with its outing of the zombie population.

I'm also super-annoyed that we seem to be losing a number of cool characters as the Thinker absorbs the bus metas. I think my biggest complaint about the Flash is that all the focus on the seasonal "big bads" has really taken away from building the Rogues in the way I'd like to see.

That's a good point, Edie. I've lamented the deaths of the bus metas as well. The episode with the Fiddler was particularly heartbreaking. I'm sure it must be hard for a show to have recurring rogues when the actors may not be available when they need them, but killing them off is making it impossible. I'm hoping that maybe these characters aren't as dead as they appear to be somehow.

Apparently, a lot of fans don't like Ralph, either. I really do, though.

According to the Flash Season 5 trailer at ComicCon, Iris & Barry's daughter Nora uses the nom de guerre XS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9xKs5ItM_Y

According to Gideon (the AI in the Time Vault), Nora (aka XS aka (possibly) Dawn) is (or will be) a member of the reboot LSH...

And in an earlier episode, Nora compared Barry's lightning bolt symbol to Lightning Lad's