Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION The Anywhere Machine The Flash CW TV Series Super-Fun Discussion Thread!

comin' to CW? Is the show a go? Anyone heard?

Surprisingly, this is the only thread I've found for the Flash TV show (Though I know it's been discussed in 'What are you WATCHING').

I thought the show should go to it's own thread, so I'm bumping this one.

My kids and I really dig this show. Far more age appropriate than Arrow, yet still fresh, fun and accessible. I'm hoping they can keep this balance going forward.

"Not God.... Grodd!"

I've repeated the canard in the past that DC seems to be almost ashamed of it's comic book heroes and the inherent goofiness of the genre, as if everything has to be Batman Begins levels of ultra-serious and colorless and grim, but the Flash totally makes me eat those words, because it's flat-out embracing the genre. Not everything is exactly the same (there likely won't be a city full of super-intelligent apes...), but they still have done some awesome and 'four-color' stuff, instead of sticking to very serious people doing very 'realistic' things.

I'm generally okay with things being different, between iterations of a property, such as being able to enjoy the Threeboot for what it was, despite it not being 'my Legion,' so I'm okay with the various changes being made adapting Flash (and his various Rogues) to the television screen (such as Weather Wizard not using a wand, or whatever).

I wasn't a fan of the kid playing Barry Allen, but his enthusiasm is infectious and really seems to be pouring himself into the role. I think I'd still prefer someone who looks a bit older, but I can't blame the guy for that, and he's doing an amazing job of it!

Between Gotham, Arrow and Constantine, we're not lacking for more serious shows, so it's kind of refreshing to have the Flash portrayed as a young hero who is totally enjoying his powers, and comes from a more idealistic 'I want to help people!' motivation.

It's not, IMO, a great show (usual idiot-ball plot devices, and some awkward dialogue), but it's got some heart to it, and hopefully it can grow into something even better.

As I said before, the fact that they've somehow turned Barry into Peter Parker is pretty much my least favorite aspect of the show.

It's definitely not how I'd do a Flash show, but it's pretty fun on its own merits if you watch it without preconceptions, though.

Arrow can be a chore for me to watch ( but not as much as Agents ). I really look forward to The Flash.


Re: Peter Parker


I think it's more the actor than the plan or did you mean the actual plot?

The Flash part, I think he's nailed. The postures and the movement are really good in my opinion. It's the Barry part. Any scene with or referring to Iris, he acts as if he's 14. I think over the year I notice a concerted effort for him to lower his voice. That is helping.

Ultimately, I think the actor is growing into the role.


I don't really like their take on the Rogues but I'm adjusting. The only character I really don't like is Cisco. He's an idiot and this actor also plays him as if he's a teen whose voice is changing. Iris would be my second least favorite.

Jesse Martin plays easily my favorite character.


Linda Park character and actor has it all over the Iris character and IMO, plays much better off this Barry than Iris but the plot between them got stale real quick.

Both, really. I mean... the whole science nerd, family tragedy, love life problems... all read more Peter Parker than how I think of Barry Allen. The fact that the actor is struggling to seem like he's over 18 doesn't help.

I've been raving about last night's episode over on Facebook. To me, this looks to be the episode where the show really starts clicking on all cylinders. (Other than the frag grenade thing, but I digress.) The actors, the plot, everything just hit the right note. For example, I was wondering if they'd just have Barry ignore that his discovery about his mom's murder meant that he, in fact, failed, but they didn't and actually nailed it.

And it sure didn't hurt that I have a soft spot for the Ronnie Raymond/Martin Stein iteration of Firestorm, and it was done so well! No, Ronnie's not a teenager, Firestorm apparently can't transmute elements--but the essence was absolutely there and KICKED ASS!!!

In earlier episodes they mentioned the original purpose of F.I.R.E.S.T.O.R.M. was for elemental transmutation, so the door is certainly open for them to bring that in.

I actually wouldn't mind it if they left it out, only because the power has always seemed like too much at times. I mean, he could transmute bullets into flowers (among other extravagancies)! If they can clearly define and limit the parameters, though, I'd be all for it.

Same here, Firestorm was extremely powerful and versatile. Maybe they can also have the transmutation show up as a new power and have him slowly learn it and define its limits.

Simple transmutation of one element to another might actually work well, but the full-blown restructuring of objects (bullets to flowers) might be a little difficult to pull off credibly.

I always did like the restriction of his powers to non-organics, though.

The fire thing is taken so I hope they do the transmutation but yeah, limitations please. At least Barry gets hungry when he runs. Converting mass has to have some restrictions on size or speed or something.

Not sure I'm liking the look of Grodd. Does he seem kind of plasticky? The FX people are going to have their hands full on that one I imagine. Still looking forward to the story line though.

It's a tough challenge on a TV budget to pull off a Grodd, but I feel that what we saw was pretty decent.

Maybe it's because I watched on the laptop. I fell asleep before it came on tv and didn't wake up until after so I caught up the episode on-line.

Between snows days, freeze days, sick days and holidays, I pretty much get paid to sit home, which has my active/sleep schedule all messed up.

So the last episode made my son cry and my daughter cheer. They must be doing something right.

It also made me cry and yes they are!

I teared up as well.

Can someone please spoil it for me? It might get me to give the show a second chance.

I'd rather ask what turned you off to it???

The pilot had a lot of rough edges IMO. The Johns influence and my own antipathy towards it at work, I guess. But everyone here has been saying it's improved by leaps and bounds.

It's freaking great!! But spoiling what happened this week won't entice you to watch if you aren't invested in the show.

Fair enough. Maybe I'll wait until the season is over and then watch the whole thing. Thanks, Lash.

You won't regret it, I think. It does a swell job of homaging the source material, but DON'T expect things to be 100% comic faithful.

I definitely wasn't sold on the pilot either, but, once you get over some major flaws in the setup of the show, it's actually quite a bit of fun. And not afraid to embrace it's comic book origins, which is the problem with a lot of DC adaptations in particular.

Dave, I need to hang out with your kids. I was basically doing both things too!

Ps - I'm pretty sure at this point the Flash is my comic book related show of all time, animated or live action. Hell, it beats most if not all the superhero movies too.

I stopped watching the show after episode 2. Based on the what you guys say, I guess I'll give it a second chance.

Thanks for all the feedback, guys.

And cheers, Stalgie. To second chances.

All my dorm mates have been on my ass for not watching the show. I guess giving it a second chance will get them off my back.

I will say this, I wasn't impressed with the first couple of issues, since they seemed to play like an after school special, falling into the same trap of since it was based on a comic, being schmaltzy, sappy and aimed straight for the ten year old.

They've gotten better, no more lines like "when I'm out there, it's not just me, it's us, a team." Really bad writing that.

However, it's gotten better, and they aren't futzing around with the villains. Still got a touch of too much angst, but much much improved.

Season 1 is on the books. Thoughts?

A very satisfying finale, and next year's spin off team series looks like a blast.

I go back and forth between whether all the winks and nods are awesome or groan worthy (Like last night when Barry's lamenting to Joe about how he can get Time Travel to work safely while literally sitting on a TREADMILL).

Anyone else think Thawne was the one who killed Joe's wife to prevent Wally from existing at all?

They have been teasing time travel all season, with many warnings that even the slightest change in the past could wreak havoc with the timeline.

And yet a massive alteration to both the past and future has occurred, and the present remains pretty much the same?

Nothing that happened this entire season could have possibly happened. Plus, they have created an irresolvable time paradox.

I think CW Flash has been written into a corner.

On the other hand, I laughed when Jay Garrett's helmet popped out of the wormhole and Reverse Flash says, "Time for me to go."

They have created a massive paradox, which is why I think the wormhole re-opened.

I suspect the first part of next season will be Barry trying to find a way to mesh the paradox with his present reality (which will likely lead to the appearance of Rip and the mid-season spin-off with all the Time Travel hijinx). It sounds like there's a plan, and they've been reasonably good until now with their payoffs that I'll give this some time to play out.

Yeah, the treatment of time travel was frustratingly inconsistent. With his previous time travel experience he replaced his former self and got to relive everything again, but this time we three versions of him co - existing at the same time.

Still... fun as long as you don't think about it too much. And Jay's helmet was definitely a geek out moment.

About as pretty a tv show to watch as I've seen. The effects were fantastic. Lots of reasons to rewatch, to catch easter eggs. Everyone brought the A game to the acting. First time Iris' emotional scenes rang true for me but Cavanagh was on a whole other level.



As mentioned, Jay's helmet and "Well's" comment were too fun and the penultimate scene set the internet abuzz with the word, "vasectomy." Before shooting myself in the chest I would have had least tried a little squeeze to see if Reverse Flash faded a bit.

Spin off:

Seems an odd assortment of characters. Any reconizable comic book based method there?


Captain Cold is really coming around to what I'd expected from the get go. At first he was too much from the Batman mold of bad-guys, ala maniacal murderer but he seems to be coming around to that snarky rogues leader with principals and limitations. There's enough room in the show for the killers but the rogues I prefer were blue collar guys just trying to make a dishonest buck and the cities were as much theirs as they were the Flash's.

I really like the Prison Break Bros being included in "Legends," and I really hope it gives them the opportunity to get some depth. I find their performances borderline cartoony at the moment. And I really don't understand why they "needed" Cold during that prison transfer episode. They had the power dampener in the truck and they had Cisco who y'know *made* Cold's gun (and Glider's gun in like what, ten minutes?) and even then, Cold didn't seem to actually do anything other than tag along.

Yeah, that whole prison transfer episode didn't make a whole lot of sense plotwise either, other than "we have a certain outcome we want to achieve to let's have the characters do completely stupid things to get there".

For whatever reason, this lineup reminds me of the "JLI" crew. (Canary in a new outfit? Cold and Heatwave has the Blue & Gold bromance down, a time traveler - Rip instead of Booster, charming billionaire Ray instead of Max (ok, that one's a stretch))

Spin off:

The Doctor: Time Lord

Rip Hunter: Time Master

The Doctor: Adventures in time with a variety of companions

Rip Hunter: Adventures in time with a variety of companions

The Doctor: TARDIS is bigger on the inside than the outside

Rip Hunter: Time Sphere is bigger on the inside than the outside

The Doctor: When he dies, regenerates with a completely different appearance and personality. No one knows his real name.

Rip Hunter: When he dies, is replaced by another Time Master with a completely different appearance and personality. Rip Hunter is an assumed alias; no one knows his real name.

The Doctor: First premiered on British TV in November 1963.

Rip Hunter: First premiered in American comics in May 1959.

I just re-watched the final and became even more convinced, strange science aside they just nailed it.

Would be really jazzed for a Crisis of Two Worlds and would probably giggle hysterically if two effects of his foray into the past were Wells isn't dead and Barry's hair turns blond (even though Mom was a redhead and Dad brunette.) Shrug.

So, I don't have TV service at home, but I just got the season 1 DVD. Which episode is the one in which Abra Cadabra turns Flash into a puppet?

^^That's the episode after the one in which Grodd makes him weigh 1000 pounds!

Cool!

Sorry, only one time-travelling supervillain per season, and this year its Vandal Savage!

Is it me or is it bad writing?

Dr. Caitlin Snow & Ronnie Raymond.

Ronnie is apparently killed in the big blast. Caitlin is mourning him for 9-10 months. Then she sees him, albeit with metahuman abilities and anmesia. And now she is all "Ronnie is dead. I have to move on."

Am I missing something or is this bad writing?

Quislet, you have to understand that CW The Flash is first and foremost a soap opera. Whereas a sit-com will sacrifice character development for a joke, the soap-opera will sacrifice character, continuity, and good sense for the weepy-teary, choke-in-the-throat moment of super-pathos.

Yes, bad writing. But comic books could be used to teach university-level courses in bad writing!

Just sit back and enjoy the show.

The show is not perfect, and there are certainly stretches of bad writing and plot contrivances, but overall the show improves as it goes. I first started watching it as a parental control for my kids to determine if it was something good for them, but by the end of the season I ended up enjoying it just as much as them.

I never said I didn't enjoy it. In face, I do!

Not everything can be Citizen Kane.

Also, I am enjoying the series. However little points like this make me enjoy it not as much as I could.

This is definitely a series in which the more you think about it the less you'll enjoy it.

Honestly, as a comics fan, we're used to suspending disbelief, so why do otherwise for TV?

In any case I think the great things about Flash far exceed its shortcomings.

Also true of ARROW. For the most part, for me it's like I just sit back and enjoy that it is even happening at all.

WASH OVER ME, FLASH & ARROW... like a great big ol bubblebath!

SCREAM QUEENS is the show I'm enjoying putting tons of thought into right now believe it or not.

Finally caught the rest of last season's finale with tonight's rerun, would be lying if I didn't admit Barry's reunion with his mom made me tear up a little.

CW's The Flash is still my favorite soap opera.

No spoilers here, but much deep pathos and near-weeping in the premiere episode. Also pretty good bad special effects.

And how do you resolve an irresolvable time paradox? Just ignore it!

I'm still back at the second episode of the first season.I really need to get around to giving it a second chance.

There I was, trolling the internet, minding my own business, when I come across the new Vixen animated series on CWSeed.

Seven episodes, five minutes each.

I have to say, Arrow and Flash look great as cartoons.

When I say trolling, I mean like fishing.

Loved the homage to the classic "Flash of Two Worlds" cover in the new ep! Little bummed that Jay was sans super powers, though.

I was a good episode, but this is the 2nd episode in a row where Barry kills the bad guy. I'm not digging this turn of events.

I loved the "On another Earth, Detective West might be a nobel-prize winning physicist" (you know, like he is in the comics) bit. I had a few moments a fear that the villain was going to turn out to be Sandy Hawkins, which would really have annoyed me.

There's still a lot of bits that frustrate me about this show, but, yeah, it's hard not to geek out at the Flash of Two Worlds homage.

The helmet is cool.

Barry (and Jay) killing without a second thought is a problem but then I'm not enamored with the Rogues either.

Terrific ending though.

Seems like a lot of meta-humans died in season 1, too.

Everyman, Multiplex, Blackout, Plastique, Deathbolt, and Girder.

Caitlin Raymond is taking her recent widowhood pretty well, putting the moves on Jay. But then, everybody is pretty clinically depressed all the time on this show, so I imagine they could be pretty good at dealing with situational depression as well.

And Barry and Iris are back to being just really good friends? For a show that's all about changes in the New 52 universe, nothing ever really changes. I guess, with Earth-1 that really makes 53, though.

My problem is Barry is old enough to have gone through college and have been on the job a couple of years at least, and yet he's "learning lessons" like a teenager.

Barry was always a bit old for his age. This views a lot more like Wally than Barry a lot of the time.

He also looks like he's about 18.

But, yeah, I've said from the beginning that to enjoy this show you have to ignore the fact that they just pretty much stuck the name "Barry Allen" on a character who has very little to do with the guy from the comics.

Sums it up pretty good. Oddly, the Jay actor would have made a decent Barry.

"I've said from the beginning that to enjoy this show you have to ignore the fact that they just pretty much stuck the name "Barry Allen" on a character who has very little to do with the guy from the comics."

They used the "Arrow" model-- where it's not just Barry or Oliver, but a whole team working together to support the "hero".

And the focus is on the relationships between the team members-- to the point of becoming soap-opera-esque.

But look at how successful soap operas have been over the years!

Same model is going to be used in the upcoming Supergirl. Supergirl's "squad" includes Jimmy Olsen, Winslow Schott, Jr., Alexandra Danvers, and she maybe ends up working for an entire government agency.

Again, not like in the comics. This is a different universe.

My problem with killing all the super-villains is that that the creators are not really thinking very creatively about Barry's powers. With the resources of Star Labs behind him, he ought to be able to safely contain and imprison his opponents. There have been references to the idea that Central City itself is also developing some ability to deal with and imprison meta-humans.

The deaths last season weren't great either, but they were situational and for the most part understandable. This season has been different so far. "Sorry I couldn't risk you hurting anyone else." Really?

And this week's "Hey let's just turn him to glass!" "Cool, then we can smash him!"

It's of course a by-product of lazy writing so they can't tell Barry any more about Zoom or where the portals are, but it's been grating.

I am becoming a little disappointed in Season Two.

I can forgive the silly pseudo-science. Captain Cold’s gun freezes lasers into ice? OK. Cisco’s machine looks for “ultra-violet cold signatures” instead of “infra-red heat signatures”? Dumb, but OK.

But the fundamentals of the show, the personal relationships, are just becoming unbelievable.

“So for nearly my whole life, you told me Mom is dead, but she’s actually just a dope fiend who took twenty years to dry out? Great! Thanks! When can we get all together? Can we have cake?”

“Captain Cold, I told you to stop killing people. Well, now that you only tried to murder me once this episode, and also murdered YOUR OWN FATHER maybe now I can trust you to start murdering the only the right people, and be a hero, like me.”

And Caitlin + Jay = Weird, but maybe that’s just me.

Ultra-violet cold is solid science, whether they know it or not. I suspect they do, at least superficially or I can't imagine why they'd set themselves up like that. Sci-fi writers are usually pretty savvy.

I'm on board though with some of the personal relationships, particularly Caitlin + Jay, "weird" being a great description and the smiley faced, he can be redeemed interview. Most of the others pretty good, better than in the past season and I think the attempt at parallel between the Snarts and Jesse was well done, plus it gave Martin a chance to do some real acting.


Not to pile on, I think they are finally starting to nail the Captain Cold character but the path they took to get him there was a fail. The father hate and close resulting relationship with sister was ALL they ever needed. Adding the "lives by a code" is a little revisionist considering what they'd already done with the character. Killing his father, I get. All the others? No.

Loved the opening sequence The actors I didn't think could act, are starting to learn. Barry's chemistry with Patty is promising but it helps that he seems to be interacting with a real actor now.


I'm liking the show more and more.

On the CW app, they keep advertising this show with the exchange between Jay and Barry about "They call you the Scarlet Speedster? I'm the Crimson Comet!" which amuses me because of how horribly inaccurate it those nicknames are for the actual colors of their costumes. So now I'm trying to think of an alliterative nickname that begins "the Bergundy..."

The Maroon Missile?

The Firestorm episode was a step back in the right direction (though I laughed at the scene with the Flash costume right out in the open while they were talking to Hewitt). I can only assume they couldn't get the same actor who played Jason Rusch in Season 1 back (but why not recast him?). Jefferson Jackson's a pretty obscure Firestorm character to bring into the fold.

King Shark was great!

One step closer to Wally, which made my kids jump up and down and dance a lot when the brother came up.

The Burgundy Blur?

The Careening Carmine Conflagration?

The Ruby Rush?

The Sangria Streak?

That's my favorite

They really need a stress reliever ep and King Shark would be perfect. That was really cool. Some of these shows are so trying to "be real" they forget to have occasional fun.

I'm really digging Patty Spivot as a character!

Much more appealing as a love interest than either Linda or Iris, imo.

That's true and this episode they finally figured out how to get him to ask her out. I was beginning to think the writers couldn't ask someone out.

Yeah, I like Patty "I'm a detective. You think I wouldn't notice you're blind" Spivot.

I am hoping she will stay because, boy, the turnover in characters is super-fast in this show. Henry Allen was gone in episode one. Martin Stein flew away with Jefferson Jackson at the end of last week’s episode and was not part of the team on this episode. Now Jay Garrick is gone, although Caitlyn Snow Raymond pathetically begged him to stay, and Hawkgirl shows up.

My head is spinning.

I can easily understand Caitlin/Jay. Jay's a goode olde-fqshioned superhunk! deelish!! and ronnie ain't ever afound fofr more rhan a few minutes becuse reasons!! Ain't nobody got time for that. hey Jay I like your haircut!!

You'd think that now that they know the singularity is a portal to another Earth that somebody would stop for a second and think "Hey, maybe Ronnie was dragged into that other Earth!" though.