Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Spaceopoly Spider-Villain Idol (Finals)

Good Morning, Everyone!

I am starting the planning stage of this Idol today because I expect to be busy next week. Just like with the Batvillain Idol, we will have the difficult task of making the list 100-200 characters maximum. There are so many Spider-Villains that have only made a few appearances, so this may take a week.

I would prefer to copy-paste from wiki's as a last resort, as I am reluctant to include characters that have less than two appearances. They are highly likely to be voted off in the first two or three rounds, so it feels like a waste to include them.

The List so Far

Big Man
Big Wheel
Black Cat
Beetle
Bookie
Boomerang
Carnage
Carrion
Chameleon
Chairman
Circus of Crime
Clash
Coldheart
Commanda
Conumdrum
Crime Master
Delilah
Demolition
Demogoblin
Digger
Dr. Octopus
Electro (Maxwell Dillon)
Electro II (Francine Frye)
Electro (Ultimate)
El Muerto
Enforcers
Equinox
Freak
Fusion
Gray Goblin
Green Goblin (Norman Osborn)
Green Goblin II (Harry Osborn)
Green Goblin III (Bart Hamilton)
Green Goblin (Ultimate)
Gray Gargoyle
Grim Hunter
Grizzly
Hammerhead
Headsman
Hippo
Home Wrecker
Hotshot
Human Computer
Human Fly
Hydro-Man
Hypno-Hustler
Hobgoblin
Iguana
Itsy Bitsy
Jimmy-6
Joystick
June Jitsu
Kangaroo
King Bee
Kingpin
Kraven the Hunter I (Sergeii Kravinoff)
Kraven the Hunter II (Ana Kravinoff)
Larcenous Lil
Legal Eagle
Lightmaster
Lizard
Living Brain
Lobo Brothers
Magma (Jonathan Darque)
Mendel Stromm
Menance
Meteor Man/Looter
Mindworm
Molten Man
Morbius
Morlun
Mysterio I
Mysterio II (Daniel Berkhart)
Mysterio III (Francis Klum)
Mysterion
Occultist
Overdrive
Panda-Mania
Paper Doll
Persuader
Photo-Man
Print Out Man
Prowler
Puma
Punisher I (Frank Castle)
Queen
Sable
Sandman
Sandstorm
Shocker
Speed Demon
Stunner
Supercharger
Styx
Swarm
Ramrod
Tendril
The Fly
The Jackal (Miles Warren)
Tombstone
Rhino
Simon the Evil Swami
Simple Simon
Shadrac
Shathra
Shriek
Silvermane
Scream/Donna Diego
Scorpia
Scorpion (MacDonald Gargan)
Shocker
Stegron the Dinosaur Man
Skinhead
Slyde
Squid
Stone
Richard Fisk (aka The Rose and Schemer)
Rocket Racer
Tarantula
Venom (Eddie Brock)
Vemon II (?) (MacDonald Gargan)
Venom (Ultimate)
Vulture
Vulture II (Raniero "Blackie" Drago)
Vulture III (Clifton Shallot)
Walrus
White Dragon
White Rabbit
Will O Wisp

I want to thank to the contributors to this list: Jposey, Paladin, Set, Elvar, Fanfic Lady

I'm sleepy, but here's a lot more:

Lizard
Scorpion
Electro
Kingpin
Green Goblin III (Bart Hamilton)
Carrion (possibly separated into I & II?)
The Jackal (Miles Warren)
Meteor Man/Looter
Rocket Racer
Prowler
Puma
Tarantula
Grizzly
Kangaroo
Punisher
Hammerhead
Silvermane
Richard Fisk (aka The Rose and Schemer)
Mindworm
Man-Wolf
Dr. Doom
Living Brain
The Enforcers (Fancy Dan, Ox I, Ox II, Montana)
Ringmaster & Circus of crime
Crime Master
Spider-Slayers (Do we separate different ones?)
Spencer Smythe
Molten Man
Rhino

Emily and I are at a crossroads, should J. Jonah Jameson be considered?

If individuals that aren't necessarily super-villains, but have served in an adversarial role to Spidey, such as Black Cat, Rocket Racer and the Prowler are being considered, then darn tootin' J. Jonah Jameson should also be counted.

Right off of my own head, I'd also add;

Lightmaster
Morbius
Will O Wisp
Scream/Donna Diego

I added most of Paladin's suggestions, but I have a handful of questions.

Kingpin: Do we still want to list him as a Spider-Villain even though he is better known as a Daredevil Villain? Marvel bascically considers him a Daredevil Villain, as he was part of Daredevil's film rights when he was leased.

Dr. Doom: I'm not including him as he is definitely more a FF Villain or general Marvel Villain Tournament material.

Carrion (possibly separated into I & II?): If they are two distinct people, then they should be listed separately. If one or the other is obscure, I will list the one with more appearances.

Meteor Man/Looter: Was this a name change or a change in powers/alignment? (good or evil) If it is the later, I will list them separately.

Punisher: I'm reluctant to include him as a villain, as he is more of an anti-hero. I know Felicia is kind of gray zone too, but she was definitely a thief.

Please give me the number of appearances for the below:

Rocket Racer
Grizzly
Silvermane
Richard Fisk (aka The Rose and Schemer)
Mindworm
Living Brain
The Enforcers (Fancy Dan, Ox I, Ox II, Montana)
Ringmaster & Circus of crime
Crime Master
Molten Man

If you're working with antagonists, then yes. If it's super villains, then perhaps not (unless J cubed has been a mind controlled villain in his time)

Just some of the many.

Big Man (Frederick Foswell)
Big Wheel (Jackson Weele)
Black Cat (Felicia Hardy)
Bookie (John Ladue)
Boomerang (Fred Myers)
Carnage (Cletus Kasady)
Carrion (Miles Warren clone)
Carrion (Malcolm McBride)
Carrion (William Allen)
Chairman (Windsor Glastonbury)
Chameleon (Dmitri Smerdyakov)
Clash (Clayton Cole)
Coldheart (Kateri Deseronto)
Commanda (Lady Catherine D'Antan)
Conundrum (Unrevealed)
Delilah (Unrevealed)
Demolition Derby (Basil Mendelsohm)
Digger (Digger)
Doctor Octopus (Otto Octavius)
Doppelganger (Unrevealed, possibly inapplicable)
Electro (Maxwell Dillon)
Electro (Francine Frye)
Equinox (Terry Sorrenson)
F.A.C.A.D.E. (Unrevealed)
Fly (Gardner Polley)
Freak (Unrevealed)
Fusion (Wayne Markley)
Gray Goblin (Gabriel Stacy)
Green Goblin (Norman Osborn)
Grim Hunter (Vladimir Kravinoff)
Grizzly (Maxwell Markham)
Hammerhead (Unrevealed)
Headsman (Cleavon Twain)
Hippo (Mrs. Fluffy Lumpkins)
Hobgoblin (Roderick Kingsley)
Home Wrecker (Matthew Mitchell)
Hotshot (Abraham James)
Human Computer (Conrad Turing)
Human Fly (Richard Deacon)
Hydro-Man (Morris Bench)
Hypno-Hustler (Antoine Delsoin)
Iguana (Inapplicable)
Itsy Bitsy (Unrevealed)
Jackal (Miles Warren)
Jimmy-6 (Giacomo Fortunato)
June Jitsui (June Hayashi)
King Bee (Unrevealed)
Kraven the Hunter (Sergei Kravinoff)
Kraven the Hunter (Ana Kravinoff)
Larcenous Lil (Lilith Moll)
Legal Eagle (Ralph G. Fake)
Lizard (Curt Connors)
Lobo Brothers (Eduardo and Carlos Lobo)
Magma (Jonathan Darque)
Menace (Lily Hollister)
Mindworm (William Turner)
Mister Negative (Unrevealed)
Molten Man (Mark Raxton)
Morbius (Michael Morbius)
Morlun (Morlun)
el Muerto (Juan-Carlos Estrada Sanchez)
Mysterio (Quentin Beck)
Mysterio (Daniel Berkhart)
Mysterio (Francis Klum)
Mysterion (Unrevealed)
Occultist (Unrevealed)
Overdrive (Unrevealed)
Panda-Mania (Unrevealed)
Paper Doll (Piper Dali)
Persuader (Roland Rayburn)
Photoman (Vincent Charles)
Printout Man (Windsor Babbage)
Queen (Adriana Soria)
Ramrod (Unrevealed)
Sandman (William Baker)
Sandstorm (Tony Trainer)
Scorpia (Elaine Coll)
Scorpion (MacDonald Gargan)
Scream (Donna Diego)
Shadrac (Gregory Herd and Gray Dolman)
Shathra (Shathra)
Shocker (Herman Schultz)
Shriek (Frances Louise Barrison)
Silvermane (Silvio Manfredi)
Simon the Evil Swami (Simon Sesgood)
Simple Simon (Unrevealed)
Skinhead (Edward Cross)
Slyde (Jalome Beacher)
Squid (Don "Donny" Callahan)
Stegron the Dinosaur Man (Vincent Stegron)
Stone (Gerald Stone)
Mendel Stromm (Mendel Stromm)
Stunner (Angelina Brancale)
Styx (Jacob Eichorn)
Supercharger (Ronnie Hilliard)
Swarm (Fritz von Meyer)
Tendril (River Verys)
Venom (Eddie Brock)
Vulture (Adrian Toomes)
Vulture (Raniero "Blackie" Drago)
Vulture (Clifton Shallot)
Vulture (James "Jimmy" Natale)
Walrus (Hubert Carpenter)
White Dragon (Unrevealed)
White Rabbit (Lorina Dodson)
Will o' the Wisp (Jackson Arvad)

Emily, I'll gladly nominate my favorite forgotten-90s-Spidey-villainess-turned-2000s-Thunderbolt: JOYSTICK!!



Extra details about her:

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/joystk.htm

I will definitely be participating in this Idol from start to finish.

EDIT: While I was preparing my post, Elvar posted his list. I was worried that he may have nominated Joystick ahead of me, but it turned out she's so obscure she didn't even make Elvar's list of obscure Spidey-Rogues. LOL

Seriously, though, Elvar, I gotta hand it to you. Some of the ones you listed are probably only known to the hardest of hardcore Spidey-Fans.

He debuted as a Spidey villain and fought him MANY times both before he and DD ever clashed and many times afterwards.



He fought Spidey on many occasions. If this were one of Ibby's very inclusive Idol games, I think he's be included.



At some point, Carrion was explained to be more of a virus infecting hosts with basically the same personality and abilities. It's probably alright to just list him once as carrion.



Same dude, same costume and basically the same powers. He's just gone by 2 different names. No reason at all to separate.



He's definitely been an antagonist to Spidey. I would include him, just as I would J. Jonah Jameson.

Please give me the number of appearances for the below:



All of these have a minimum of 2 appearances. Most have a lot more.

I have added most of Paladin's and will be adding all of Set's shortly.

I'm excluding anyone at the moment that I feel is debatable until I get some sort of consensus.

Elvar, please remove any names on your list which match that of the first post on this thread. That way it will be easier for me to look up the appearances.

Punisher definitely started as a villain (arguably he's never stopped being a villain, but that's just me). Prior to the late 80's though he was always a villain (and usually against Spidey or DD).

Kingpin was a Spider-Villain, and even though he's gone over to DD more in the last few decades, he's still one of the "New York" villains they shared.

Doom I wouldn't consider a Spidey Villain (he's really fought everyone).

I bolded the ones on the list that seem to be on first post. might want to remove King Bee, Occultist and Simple Simon on my list i believe each only has one appearance.

Here is a site that might help with your research http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/spdmappx.htm

I remember Kingpin as a Spider-villain on a couple of old cartoons. More support for him being included.

And Jameson has been such an antagonist that I think he could do well in this game.

As for including characters, like Lardy says I tend to be more inclusive. It's not too much work, and while most characters do get eliminated early, you never know which ones will become dark horses (Ma Hunkel anyone? :p)

I feel like I have deja vou. I am going to find the Bat-Villain Idol thread and see if a precedent has been established for any of these cases. I feel like we had the same discussions there.

I'm adding Elvar's now and will add Joystick once I look up her profile.

Important Edit: I found the post in the Bat-Villain Thread, which could be precedent. I might also dig around some more there and the Flash Rogues Thread to see if there is anything helpful.

http://www.legionworld.net/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=872316#Post872316

Do we want to list groups as separate members or as a whole? I have done both in Flash Rogues Idol and the LSV Idol, so there is no clear precedent.

I wouldn't want to list the Sinister Six as a separate choice because all participants are very prominent as solo villains and having the Six available would seem like a cheat. On the flip side, the individuals that comprise the Enforcers would probably do much worse separately than they potentially could as a group (and they were almost always presented together), so I would list them as a group.

He's a can of worms for you: What about Ultimate Spider-man Villains? Obviously some, like the Goblin, are completely different from their regular marvel counterparts. Do they get separate entries?

I can only speak for my own Idol games, but I have created separate entries for characters whose versions are significantly different. In Multiverse Legion I had separate entries for Preboot Brainiac 5, Postboot, Threeboot, SW6...

Agreed, particularly with these examples. Doc Ock, Sandman, Mysterio, Elektro, etc. have all been significant villains on their own. Fancy Dan, Ox and Snake Marston, not so much.

I have never read a story with Snake Marston, nor seen any description, or even knew about his existence bfore this very minute, but based on the name alone he is now my odds on favourite to win the Idol.

You're not thinking of his cousin, Snake Plisskin are you?

Listed with the other two Enforcers, maybe Set meant to say Montana?

Oh, a quick wikipedia look-up shows that Snake and Hammer Harrison were occasional members of the Enforcers in addition to the core three!

We can include other versions if they are significant. I have been doing that since the Bat-Villain Idol (where the majority of our Prep discussion was about whether various Bronze Age characters were different than Modern ones). For the Marvel Games, I would like to list them by either Universe Name or Number.

I only read one Trade Paper Back of Ultimate Spider-Man, so I have no knowledge of those villains.

Are there two versions of the Enforcers? And I thought the Circus of Crime were Fantastic Four villains?

This could get messy with all the team-ups Spider-Man has done throughout the years. If I do the FF separately, I imagine I am going to have the same problems with Thing Team-Ups.

Important Edit: Is Kingpin equally important to Spider-Man as he is to Daredevil?

I found out that I included Vandal Savage in the Flash Rogues Idol because he was equally a JSA and Flash Villain?

Circus of Crime were Spider Man foes (I believe they started in a Spider Man/Daredevil team up) but they were used for pretty much everyone - F4, Thor, the Hulk...

In his early career, Kingpin was a major Spidey foe. But it's an earlier version of Wilson Fisk (if that makes sense). He's nowhere near the menace he is in Daredevil (IMO).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_Spider-Man#Villains

Most are significantly different.