Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Legion of Super-Heroes #8 (+ Action Comics #1024, 2020) - Preview and Spoilers

This bothers me as well. It's just bad writing (and art? and editing? and proofreading?) that until now, nobody is even sure of Ayla's code name and powers. And it's one thing if she's just been on-panel without doing/saying anything (hello, Green Skeleton person!), but another if she's had several scenes AND USED HER POWERS ON-SCREEN A COUPLE TIMES.

Those stupid Kirkman (spelling?) tags. Introduced specifically in-story for the purpose of letting everyone know who everyone else is... I fume every time I see them because for many of them, no matter how much I squint and hold the page up to the light, I still cannot read them.


I laughed at the way you put it, Blacula, funnily written, but I'm also crying inside a bit. Now, I don't quite yet feel as strongly, but my patience is indeed wearing thin. Every issue leaves me dissatisfied and mildly annoyed...

worst thing is, I don't feel like I could muster up the energy to care so much I just feel vaguely indifferent.

I totally agree with Blacula, on everything

With Ayla having inconsistent portrayals, I'm beginning to feel like the writer / artist / whomever haven't really nailed them down yet.

For instance, we saw Ultra Boy seemingly create a green energy barrier to hold off some Horraz attacks earlier, but that's not one of his typical powers, nor is it one mentioned on his Frich tag thingie, so I'm beginning to feel like it's not something new and original and potentially interesting, but just yet another symptom of the creative team having no f*cking idea what they are doing.

That all said, Ryan Sook's art is still quite nice.

Oh the art in this issue is great, no doubt. It just feels like all these artists who've never worked on the Legion before are being wasted with such a subpar story. Especially Dustin Nguyen.

I'm actually a little surprised by how opinions on this series, even outside of here, are only on both extreme ends of the spectrum. It's either loved or utterly loathed. Damian Wayne fans in particular HATED that third issue.

It's the same thing with Lyle/Jacques. Are there two Invisible Kids on the team? Or did they just forget they'd already introduced him?

And as much as it's nice to see Ferro Lad, where was he the first six issues? Why wasn't he around when they did the group picture? A simple "Good to see you back from your mission on Plevitz" or something would do wonders to cover up the fact that they probably just only decided to include him after the series began.

I gotta remember Plevitz, thanks Eryk

BTW, there's still absolutely NO mention of XS in The Flash, despite the fact even Inertia had an appearance

"The problem is, I have no idea where the Legion can go to from here. Any return to previous versions will be seen as "white-washing"; but sticking with these vapid "in-name-only" versions of these characters is a total non-starter IMO. I actually think the Legion as we/I know it is now over. Each reboot has told a tale of diminishing returns. It actually feels to me like each subsequent version has been around for exactly half the time as the previous one? It won't be long before this property has been ground into dust."


I say bring on the white washing! Scrap this current book and bring back a more familiar Legion for us, the faithful and devoted readers! Did I mention patient?
Just don't let Bendis anywhere near it!

Guys, it's easy. Just confirm the other Legions still exist and go from there. The Bendisboot doesn't HAVE to be written out in order to do a different Legion, because that's the exact same mindset that created this mess in the first place.

This is exactly why I preferred the Retroboot, because we all knew the Reboot and Threeboot Legions still existed alongside them even if the Retroboot was in the spotlight.

I'm a faithful and devoted Legion Fan (obviously) and despite my confusion over continuity and wanting more, I'm loving this new Legion. I love the looks and all of the changes. And the whole point of reading these adventures is to want more.

This book is giving me the fun and excitement that I had when I first discovered the Legion. Back then, I'd find tidbits of reprints to go along with the Levitz and Giffen stories. It was a confusing but glorious adventure.

That's what this book is. And I think too many of you are obsessed with just reading the same stories about the same characters. But, we got that already with Levitz's return to the series. It was boring and quickly degraded into a pale reflection of what once was great that eventually led to death and destruction and the JL3000.

This book is like the Silver Age for me.

One story, it's Lightning Boy, the next Lightning Lad. He claps lightning, no he can generate lightning without clapping. He's dead. He's his sister. He's back (or is he Proty?). He's a founder, except for when Sun Boy remembers his audition.

Cosmic Boy's powers are in his eyes. Just kidding. Saturn Girl and carve kryptonite with her mind. That's just a cover.

Who joined in what order anyway? Brainiac 5 is there when Superboy joins, but he also joined along with Supergirl.

They're the children of the team that recruited Superboy until they aren't. Superboy and Supergirl are on the same team at the same time and Clark never remembers her when Kara debuts after he's an adult.

It's the 30th century or the 21st. Xanthu is the base or it's Earth. Smallville or is it Metropolis.

Starboy! Who? Oh, here he is but with different powers. Ultra Boy has vision powers, no, he is actually Superboy and Mon-El level, just one-at-a-time! Why don't they cure Mon-El in the 20th century?

Shadow Woman is white, but her younger self, Shadow Lass is blue.

I could literally go on and on and on...but these are things most of us LOVE about the silver age Legion. It's fun to talk about and dissect.

This Legion is fun too. Lot's of it. Interesting and beautiful and finally not everyone is white or just random colors. They represent their readers.

This is the Legion. I'm sorry a lot of you can't accept or enjoy it for what it is.

Thank you, Nightcrawler. I feel the same way. Maybe this isn't the best version ever of the Legion, but I am enjoying it. And when I feel a yearning for the more familiar Legion, I do what I did a few weeks ago. I re-read one of the Showcase volumes. Or I buy some back issues via E-Bay that I was too young to buy the first time around. To paraphrase the late critic Gene Siskel, "Review the comic book you're reading, not the comic book you wish you were reading."

Well, I'm happy you guys enjoy this Legion.

Personally, I don't like it because I can't get any sense of narrative or personality for the characters. I don't mind different - I love that this isn't just the same old Silver Age Adventure Era Legion. But I'm judging it on its own merits, and not giving it an F just because it's different from other versions.

Fair enough. However, there is a vocal group that feels like if they can just get this series cancelled and stomp and complain that this very series exists every chance that they get, that it'll magically be replaced with their version of the team that actually only exists in their heads.

Hate it and don't enjoy it if that's the feelings you have for this version, but I'm just asking that everyone not assume that everyone else feels the same way and needs to read about how they should cancel or replace this book with every discussion.

I agree with you, Nighty. I've stopped reading comments on Legion fan Facebook groups, because every time there are some who say "this isn't the REAL Legion". As if there's anything as a REAL Legion, all versions of the team are equally valid. And I get your frustration, I feel it too - every version of the team will have first-time readers who have never heard of the Legion before, and will feel it for the first time.

That said, while I don't like this series, I DO like that there are many departures from the past: Mon being a descendant of Superman/Superboy, and the new romantic pairings, and the reimagining of Computo are some of the things I like.

Ibby and I are pretty much on the same page. I don't care that it's a new continuity. I wouldn't even care that much about internal continuity glitches, if we were getting high quality stories otherwise. As it is, it just feels like they're a symptom of the series being a rush job by a writer who has too many other series on his plate to be focusing on this one, which, by its nature, needs a writer who is really focused.

Honestly, the things that interest me the most are the new characters, especially Monster Boy and thus far still nameless skeleton person. Doctor Fate and Gold Lantern are a bit less interesting to me, just because I'm not as into non-Super-family legacies in the Legion, but I'm interested in actually seeing Gold Lantern's story, rather than just being told how awesome it is.

Well I'm a broken record at this point so I'll say I agree with Ibby and Eryk. I don't like this comic, but it's as valid as all the other Legions.

It deserves better than Bendis.

v8 Issue 8

The main plot sees a not very well executed fight whereCrav Nah retreats with his underused super-retinue. So pretty much no movement at all there. 8 issues in and theres not much to show at all in this department. The fight was resolved by the age old -if-you-hit-him-hard-enough-he-will-fall approach.

Elsewhere, it's revealed that RJ Brande had no idea about any of the backgrounds to the Legion she was instrumental in forming. It's not a premise that holds up well, and has the firm look of a fill in excuse.

With so little momentum in the main plot, it's an odd time to be having an origins issue. V4 did one around the same issue. That was due to behind the scenes fallout. From Nighty's interesting post regarding the plots advertised, but never seen, in this volume, I'm left to believe that this volume is suffering from similar issues. It would certainly explain a lot on a book that had such a long lead time. Having such a huge artist jam issue could also be an attempt to boost sales; to allow backroom issues/ delays to be resolved or due to various bits of feedback on earlier issues.

Linking the origins pages to the main plot is okay in places, but doesn't really work in providing a satisfying action scene against Crav. The villain is up against an entire group who are joined at the hip. The heroes' sheer weight of numbers is lost in the choreography, and Crav's minions don't offer any solutions as to why that happened.

The rest of the issue is taken up with snapshots of the team's recruitment. Bendis has obviously spent a lot of time in the build up to the launch, and this is the strongest part of the issue. There are some good snippets for most of the cast. Some new, some borrowed as the previous incarnations are mined. Nothing that couldn't have been revealed in book having more of a plot, but then that's not the purpose of this issue.

We have the modern plot condensing, where previously disparate characters are reduced into a more linear plotline. Roxxas and the space pirates are now the Horraz that we've already seen. Mon-El loses his Daxamite heritage and becomes a descendant of Superman. I though the latter one was telegraphed last issue, so the extra build up to the reveal here seemed a few panels too much. Jeckie cites a Justice League for all ages, tying the book into previous eras as if a Trident (Aqualad can't be far away), Power ring, Super legacy and helm of fate weren't enough.

Mon-El was a distinct personality in previous volumes, his time in the buffer zone, offering a different personality to the rest of the Super Family. His links with Tinya suggest that some of that is retained. Hopefully that's the case, if only to stop him being a second Superboy in the team. Bendis' habit of having the same speech pattern for all characters wouldn't do Mon El any favours, if Mon doesn't have those clear traits.

Nura's gender; Jeckie's ego and possible real status behind the illusion (threeboot?); Gim's real size (threeboot?) are all good examples.

Ayla is a strong character within the team. I'd have liked to have seen more interaction between her and the founders regarding the Legion's purpose. Particularly Garth's part in it, as their relationship is a bit more genuinely sibling like, than previous versions.

Wildfire is early into the battle too, as per previous versions. Dawnstar is close by in a few panels with him, so they may be a couple here. It's odd that one of Crav's minions has a device specifically tailored to capture Drake, but the others have no plans at all and are easily beaten.

Brainy's lack of experience undermining his vast intellect was a nice touch, and one that makes him fallible. Having learned of Nura's powers in this volume, it's a shame they played no part in the battle.

Rokk's attempts to deal with what he sees as a major setback in his life is really well done. His reaction at his age shows that Bendis understands the perspective of his cast.

One place where the origins could have been old was in Millennium's second issue. To hear that Rose Forrest's main purpose is to get RJ Brande "to do what's right and good." is clunky in both dialogue and plot. Like taking until now to find out more about the Legion, it's odd that Rose was allowed to wander around the Legion without anyone in the UP asking a couple of basic questions.

With a huge roster, Ferro Lad's appearance was another oddity. He wasn't in any of the previous issues that I noticed. He wasn't in any of the many, many group shots. With DC's fumbling over the ethnicity of its Legion cast, I get the nagging feeling he's been belatedly added in response to BLM. I'm sure there's a lot of good feeling that he's finally being portrayed as Jim Shooter had wanted. "Look how far we've progressed!" But I still notice that he's a black man who has to wear a mask, which was done initially to conceal his ethnicity, wrapped in a disfigurement origin story. In an age of acceptance and optimism, having someone with a physical disability hide behind a mask never sat well with me either.

I can't think of any reason why the Legion had to surrender in this issue. Crav being there "to win" and Imra being unable to read his mind, is no reason for this to happen. It's a flimsy bit of dialogue to get to the plot point where they can advertise "The trial of the Legion." How that goes depends in part on which one of RJ Brande's flip-flopping personalities turns up. I thought it was supposed to be Rose who had identity issues.

It's a very mixed issue, trending towards the negative. There's even less plot movement here than I had expected in a Bendis book. The premise and resolution of the plot to get to the next issue blurb is very flimsy. A flying Sebastian Shaw and some panel filling minions (as the Horraz were ) offer an unconvincing fight against a horde of heroes, a number of which do nothing at all.

There's precious few pages in a normal comic as it is. A page devoted to a plot summary, is a wasted page. Especially as there's been so little plot movement in the issues we've had so far. I can see it's meant to tell new readers what's been going on in a visual way. But that used to be done in a caption or two.

Balanced against this are some excellent character developments and a number of little character snippets. There's still some of that early energy of having a bustling, newly formed team around the book. It could do with a solid plotline to move it along and get some of that excitement combined with showing us subgroups of the cast strutting their stuff.

Well, I'm definitely not included in that group. I hated Levitz's boring nothing of a run almost as much as I hate this one. And I blame him for totally ruining the perfect foundation for great future Legion stories that Johns and Frank left him with after Lo3W.


This echoes my thoughts too. I am certainly not turned off by "different" with the Legion. Heck, one of my problems with this team is that it isn't MORE different! Having a half-assed mix of characters who are all pretty much either a) exactly the same as they used to be; or b) exactly the same as they used to be BUT RACE-BENT, doesn't seem all that innovative or forward-thinking to me. If this is meant to be an ALL-NEW! ALL-DIFFERENT! team, then why aren't they all all-new and all-different? Making it a mix like this just adds to the feeling of rushed incompleteness that permeates every facet of this run; like Bendis and Sook only had time to re-imagine half the team before they met their deadline to print. In fact, based on some of the after-changes we've already seen, I'm pretty much positive that that's exactly what happened.

And how "different" are any of them anyway? Sure, a couple of relationships have changed and some look a little different (not that much different though; no one on the team was gender-bent unless you count whatever non-evident difference Bendis has made to Nura; and all of them are still four-limbed humanoids) but the three founders are still the same, the hierarchy within the team still seems to be the same, everyone's personalities seem to be more or less the same (with minor exceptions like Rokk who will probably evolve); everyone's powers are the same, the formation and function of the team is still the same, the types of threats are still the same, a lot of the old relationships remain, some of the "plots" (a term I use very loosely) are just rehashes of older ones... other than a quartet of new members (half of which are just derivatives of older DC characters) I am straining to see what's new here.

And all that just exposes what IMO is the single biggest flaw with this run (and why I personally hate it):

Bad. Writing.

I am happy for those of you who do like it though and I hope you continue to do so for the remainder of its run.

Just read the issue and read through all your comments. Phew. So trying to dissociate the two and judge the comic on its own merits.

Well we learned a few things this issue about some of the legionnaires which I guess is a good thing since that was how it was promoted with its different artist for each page and different legionnaire focus for each page.

Skipping the first few which we discussed in the previews and the things already mentioned above, the ones that haven't had much traction are:
Ultra Boy - his tag seems to describe him as "Battle Prince of Rimbor" (my sympathies for print readers, I had to enlarge the digital image). Also I hadn't noticed before that his dad has the same symbol as Ultra Boy but scarred into his chest, so not a stylistic version of a space dragon but something Rimbor specific, even Nah family specific.
Light/Lightning Lass - yeah weird continuity but explainable by a good plot from a good writer - hey it could happen - her tag describes her as Revolutionary
Shadow Lass - actually Blok's page but have we ever seen Shady do anything other than complain? She has had more to say over the issues than many of the others but doing something? Not sure.
Imra - beautifully drawn, not much else to say except she seems to be acting as a peacemaker/intermediary for the team which could make sense with her ability to see inside others minds.
Timber Wolf - violent huh? - haven't noticed his pointy "ears" before
Cosmic Boy - very glad to see him coming back when he is needed (although if next issue's cover is a guide he is going to be too late)
Brainiac 5/Computo - glad to see Brainy's self-doubt, after all they won the last fight against the Horraz by ignoring his advice - the floating interlac I could read says "This is to exercise ??" "emergency ...tocols (protocols)" "contac? (contact) Coluan..." "
is coluan intell" (could be seeking advice from Colu or questioning his own abilities here)
Ferro Lad - like everyone else I'm wondering where he came from all of a sudden. Also his hands look like normal (dark) human flesh so what substance did he change in to (hardest substance known to the galaxy but still calls himself Ferro Lad) and it doesn't show in his appearance? Also if you hit someone with a rock or a metal hammer for example because the object is harder than flesh it won't give and will cause more damage but its strength is still dependent on the force behind it so how is Ferro's punch stronger than Mon-El's? (OK let's forget this one, every writer has bent the science/reality rules at some point - white dwarf star anyone?)
Tinya - 4th Dimension? Ok
Mon-El - i'm not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand it gets rid of the old Daxamite problem of why aren't they more prominent in the galaxy etc (assuming they don't exist anymore which could be wrong) but this feels like probably th emost significant character revamp so far. No 1000 years in the Phantom Zone makes a huge difference. OTOH his resentment of Jon's presence makes perfect sense with him feeling like he was the Legion's number one powerhouse and then his great grandad joins. Can't imagine any of us would like to be in that position.

Oh and did anyone notice how the cover has nothing to do with what happens inside? The cover shows the team fighting amongst itself which they don't do in this issue (apart from a few personal character differences). I know covers are created well ahead of time but this is still a bit annoying.

This series has mostly been a positive for me. I have loved Sook's artwork and it has been fun seeing the Legion as a genuinely young organisation again. I haven't minded much of their fumbling because it reflects that youth. Still we are 8 issues in and that is getting a long way to still have so much unknown, and so little team development. Sure it's harder with a cast this large but there have been many series over the years with fairly large casts that have accomplished acclaimed story-telling in fewer issues. Issue 6 was perhaps where my enthusiasm began to diminish a bit. It was meant to show a big success by the Legion but instead they won by accident, by not working as a team and by working at cross-purposes to one another. I still have hope but if I am honest, if this wasn't the Legion but some other new team to me I'm not sure I would still be reading it.

That's a downer to end on. I'm still reading the book and I still have hope. I have seen other tales disturb fans because the writer was taking them on a journey to become the heroes we expected but this one is taking a bit too long. Let's hope my impression has changed by issue 12.

I was wondering about the lack of change in his appearance as well.


It matches up with the solicitations about the Legion fighting amongst themselves, however. It would've been nice if we'd gotten matching covers to the two parts of the "all-star jam".

There are MANY things I do enjoy about this new Legion, and more than a few that I don't care for .... but I'm still buying multiple copies of each issue to show my support, and having a Legion is better than NOT having a Legion to read and enjoy every month.

I guess even for some dislikes I have (and those are purely only my own opinions) I'm pretty sure I still WILL back up this Legion, and support it, AND see it through to its entire run.

If I am passionate about commenting on what I see as flaws/oversights/radical changes etc, then that criticism comes from a place of deep love for the mythos. Where better to "vent" my passion than a forum such as this great one?

I'm still picking up issues for Candle since she can't get comics on her own. Just because I'm not a fan doesn't mean I'll willingly deny her the chance to read the series for herself.

How's she doing? I was wondering about her recently.

I haven't spoken to her in the last few days but the last we spoke she's okay.

Overall I enjoyed this recent issue a bit more than the normal ones, potentially because the fight scenes featured quite a few Legionnaires.

It's been a jerky ride so far though and if its bringing in new readers I admire their dedication because it felt like the complete opposite of how I'd try to introduce a large team (break them down to more manageable sub groups and play off their differences to characterize them).

The Good :
-Enjoying Saturn Girl (though the outfit seems like Alpha Flight).
-The artwork is usually nice.
-Alluding to Cosmic Boy as a heavy hitter was interesting.

The Bad : (this can change of course and hopefully does )
-Pacing is horrible, feels disjointed and like the storyteller is constantly interrupted and can't remember where they left off.
-Legion is a large team, if you're gonna add new characters on top of it; give them time and show why you created a new character instead of using an old one, alluding to a great backstory that isn't ready to sell in the near future seems weird.
-Hard to differentiate most of the personalities from their dialog.

The Ugly:
-Some of the costume redesigns feel like a big downgrade (Element Lad, Shrinking Violet , Karate Kid, White Witch, Star Boy, Phantom Girl ).