Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! The Legion # 38 - spoilers

After reading this thread, wanted to add:

The credits box was indeed super-cute.

Karate Kid and the Persuader's daughter? Jillikers, what about poor Andy? He'll be devestated!

Pinter has my vote for BEST NEW LEGION CHARACTER for the entire run of this current series.

I love the way Geoff Johns has made the villains as or even more interesting than the heroes in FLASH. I saw Gail doing something similar with the Persuader here, and approve.

I LOVED the cover art. Now if I can just get a Mike Allred cover...

I thought the story started out strong, but ended with a bit of a fizzle. It seemed rushed. Another issue or two to expand and tell the story completely would have been better. I would have liked to see Ms. Simone have a longer run on the title. Too bad it ended here. The art was good if not spectacular. Reminded me of Karl Kessell from a while back...

I nominate Infectious Lass for membership. She proved she is very powerful, and able to handle, plus finish, confrontations in a more peaceful manner than some of the Legion big guns.

I, for one, will be happy to have The Legion Of Super-Heroes back for a title too. The Legion just didn't have the same uuummpphh for me.

I am tired of arcs in comics now too. What happened to the ongoing story? One story leading to another with character and plot development. It used to be like a soap opera on paper, for lack of a better example. I miss the eighties...But I am hoping for the best with Waid coming on board.

Now if I can only get Blok and Tellus back in the ranks...

Eh... maybe I've just been spoiled by DnA but I hated this story arc. The villains were lame, and there was so much stuff left unexplained (i.e., how the hell have certain Legionnaires just been kidnapped out of the blue--Dreamer and Wildfire). Maybe it's a marketing ploy.. by putting a weak story before Waid's dynasty it will make his work seem that much better by comparison.. hmmm...

I thought it was a satisfying, if not spectacular end to the arc. All and all, I was a bit underwhelmed, but more in a "Magic Wars" kind of underwhelmend, rather than a "Floundations" kind of underwhelmed. We got lots of nice things over the course of the arc, but there were also a few things that kind of grated.

Marvel actually did that on F4 - v3 57-59 was über-crap. So don't start the conspiracy theories...

That was actually pretty smart of Jo: bringing Winema out in public, and in front of cameras, so people can see that the President of the U.P. is still alive (because rumor of her having been shot was bound to have spread by then).

Some more detailed comments:

--I like the fact that we do get hints that the Devil-Canary relationship is more than just "She's in love with me". The problem is we don't get any more than that it's not that. Whqt exactly *is* Canary's motivation? Is Devil wrong about the motivation of the other anarchists as well?

--The whole "civilization is collapsing, so let's all loot and pillage" is kind of cliched. Not necessarily a bad thing, but I'm not sure we needed to see as much of it as we did. I'm not exactly clear on what Brainy needed Tasmia to do other than help he individuals she could, however.

--Devil started off as an really interesting villain in the arc, someone very diabolical and insane enough to cause massive damage. Somehow by the end she seemed almost pathetic, with all the marking off Legionnaires who weren't really dead, and the whole scene this issue where she "could have gotten two more Legionnaires" but it's not exactly clear how. Just by throwing her spear at them?

--I like the basic idea of the Val-Persuader's Daughter romance, but we weren't really given the chance to see it develop. They've talked all of about five minutes, as far as I can tell. The suggestion that they might start dating seems to come from nowhere.

--The Rimborian internal organs not being human line just seemed completely anachronistic. Rimbor has always been portrayed as a colony world, and a relatively young one at that.

--I thought the radiation shields going down was an interesting idea, if I'm reading it correctly as implying that environmental damage has been so extensive that the Earth relies on artificially imposed protection from solar radiation. It just seemed to be introduced a little late in the game. Why haven't any of the numerous other catastrophes that have befallen Earth effected them?

--Wildfire being sent into action looked cool. Too bad we never actually got to see him in any action.

--Dreamer saving the day was the highlight of the issue, easily.

--I actually kind of liked the "Hannah Wells" scene, myself.

--The simple solution to the Kharadian situation wasn't so terrible, but I didn't really understand the point of the Epilogue other than to establish that it had fixed itself.

Others have suggested that the epilogue is aimed squarely at LEGION fans prepping them for the upcoming indie-rock re-imagining. It makes sense.

Wow!

Just got back from vacation, and I'm utterly exhausted...lotta good comments, some less so, but I hope to tackle this thread some in the morning.


One thing I do want to say, the last page was in NO WAY a shot at Legion fans. I hope you guys know I respect loyal readers a lot more than that. Does it have a message other than what's happening to the characters? Sure, but it's simply a positive one about one of the things I think is special about this book, which is that it CAN change in a way that books like JLA or Batman really don't, as a rule.

More shortly,

Gail

I think leaving the villians mysterious was a good move by Gail. It leaves us something to discover later on down the road.. which I'm definitely looking forward to. Who says all the villians secrets and motivations need to be revealed at the end of one story-arc?

As for a romance between Val and Lialla, it did seem kind of abrupt, but with a cast this big, things can happen behind the scenes. The same with Persuader's change of heart for his daughter.

Heck, we've assumed things happen behind the scenes ALOT when it comes to the Legion history... That's one of the big things that's attracted us to the Legion IMO.

Vi and Ayla... Brainy and Lyle..
We've just never really seen the writers do it on purpose...

Great job, Gail!!

I wouldn't have a problem with the villains being mysterious if I was confident that they were going to be revisited, and by Gail. If there is an overarching backstory to the group, then I'd feel much more comfortable if the writer who was in charge of creating them were going to be around longer.

I guess my problem with Val-Lialla romance is that there's not really that much time for something to develop "behind the scenes". I can see an attraction having developed, but being at the point where she'd suggest they start dating just seems forced.


So I'm going to speculate on the epilogue, and indeed the whole point of the Kharadia subplot:

Could it be that there's some sort of parallel between the theme of change, evolution, and de-evolution among the Kharadians and the anarchists opposition to change, or desire to "go back"? I'm not quite putting the message together, but it's a possibility...

I just had a thought about radiation. The earth's magnetic field reverses every few hundred thousand year (or thereabouts). Current evidence suggests that we're entering one of those periods now, but IIRC, it'll take about a thousand years before we'll see any big differences. One of the changes is that the field will temporarily weaken letting in more solar radiation.

I mentioned this at the Calling the Roll thread, but I believe the art shoulda/coulda given us more indication that Lialla and Val were immediately attracted to each other. If a certain look in the eye was drawn, particular body language shown. I mean, if that was done, I'm sure a bunch of us would be saying stuff like "Was Val checking out Lialla's @$$ in panel 4, page 17, or what?" That is my main complaint about this, the final story for The Legion series... the art was good, but it wasn't very detail oriented, particularly considering the kind of readers we are. There were lots of little errors and inconsistencies in each issue.

As for the villains, well, I found Devil and Canary to be very entertaining in their own ways. I would love to see them again, someday, somehow. Canary has power beyond belief. That's something to look out for. I have lots of fan-fic ideas for what Devil can do (hee!) Maybe she's a mutant Starhavenite, and can seek out sentients who have special abilities. Maybe because she's from Starhaven, she appreciates a world that is largely undeveloped, and cannot help but go out and find the right allies to make other worlds that way. Huh? Not bad? Gail? Was that right?

Good stuff, Dean. I can't say if you're right or wrong, but it's certainly a fun theory!

Gail

I really enjoyed this arc. I've never read any work of Gail's so didn't know what to expect. I was looking foward to Jurgens art since as a kid his Dev-Em issues were a fave.

Jurgens blew me away. Reading the last two issues today I really couldn't believe how good Jurgens did. I mean I don't remember him looking this good. Everything from individual characters, layouts, wow.

I wish we could have learned a bit more about the villains. My guess for Devil is she is from Tartarus or Lupra (Color Kid's world...looongshot I know)

I really enjoyed the story though. Liked the Karate Kid part of the story...I hope he does hook up with Persauder's daughter personally.

I think a big reason that I enjoyed this arc is my favorite characters were used: Jo, Cham, Brainy, Tinya, Tasmia, Violet, Timberwolf. Those are my top 4 fave male members (Monel next) and my top three female members. Never really cared much for Karate Kid but I'm a fan of his now.

This was lots of fun.

Jorge

Also besides having my fave characters it had my favorite villain the Persuader. While I don't want him becoming a softie any time soon I don't mind this added depth either.

What if Karate Kid dates the daughter? Persuader kinda likes the kid anyways. I can see Persuader still trying to kill Legionnaires but maybe not KK.

Jorge

I enjoyed this arc Gail, well done for keeping the story moving through all four issues. I'd like to see what you could have done with an ongoing contract though.

We were left with a few unanswered questions and the introduction of a lot of idea and characters, here's hoping Waid and Kitson can give them time and space to develop.

Bxx

Did anyone mention the awful cover? Dreamer as a big headed corpse? Blech.

I read this issue as part 4 of 4. Gail handled the size of the cast well, added a few new villains with teasers to get us interested, and told an exciting tale. That's what I expected.

I would have liked to see Devil DO something. But there was enough hints that she could be a serious meany, given the chance. I don't know much about Canary, but I am interested in her. As for the other two, they roughed up the Legion, so they got some future potential. Val dating the Persuader's daughter might make for a fun scene in future issues. Brainy and Umbra's exchange has provided some ethical debate material.

The artwork was great, better than some of the recent artists we've seen here. I liked the crisp figures. Seeing KK work was a great showcase, and I liked the slight older look to the Legion.

As a wrap up of the series, not so much. But when she wrote this, Gail wasn't trying to wrap it up. She wrote an interesting story arc, with plenty of potential story material. Each issue moved along, had some great character moments, and made the Legion work. Gail, good job!

<<I would have liked to see Devil DO something.>>

I dunno. She manipulated the other villains, masterminded the whole plot, captured Dreamer, nearly killed Timber Wolf, and is responsible for the deaths and injuries of who knows how many people, not to mention the destruction of property. Devil may not have demonstrated a super-power, but that hardly prevented her from being a formidable villain.

You know... that's a really good point. Part of my sense of being a bit let down by the arc (though I enjoyed it quite a bit) was that it felt more like a solid "middle-of-a-run" piece, that was as much about setting up material for the future as being a self-contained story. It feels kind of out of place closing the series, but that's not what it was intended for. I'd still feel a lot better about it if I knew that it wasn't just going to be irrelevant to the "re-imagined" Legion.

I've been drawing some of the pages to use as examples of sequential pencilling, for my portfolio (and to show Gail!). I'm pretty happy with some of the re-working I've done. I'll show them as soon as I get done. I have to wonder if Dan Jurgens did his breakdowns/layouts rather quickly, relying on the finisher to fill in important details, details which really do matter.

Okay. I figured out what I missed from this story. (I knew there was supposed to be a #39 when she first wrote the story, so that wasn't it.)

A back story! I wanted a panel or page or more of this:

Devil explains to someone (Dreamer?) why she hates technology so much and how she got this group together. It turns out that she's from a relatively primitive world with beings that all look like her. The UP had arrived on her planet and brought it's advanced technology as trading gifts in exchange for their natural resources. Eventually, this tech corrupted her people and caused a civil war.
Devil was among those blindly fighting in the war. Until she came across a couple of mercenaries. The one known as Arrow was using non-tech weapons. She was fascinated by the notion of his fighting an advanced war with primitive materials.
It turns out that his sister is Canary. She was born a mutant whose aura disrupts artificial power sources. This forced his family to take desperate measures and live a simple life away from 30th Century technology. Growing up in this environment, he learned how to use ancient weapons. He joined with his pal, Lantern (a hybrid offspring of a Guardian and Zamaron, whose powers are unaffected by Canary's aura) as a mercenary in foreign wars. They were attracted by the politics of Devil's planet's war.
He also tells Devil of the time when Canary's powers expanded to affect a larger area when she came into physical contact with a Naltorian at a Space Carnival when they were kids. (Naltorians have spent centuries trying to downplay their abilities, hoping to prevent outsiders from exploiting them. Occasionally, when off-world, some seek compensation as fortunetellers.)
Enlightened by her new allies, Devil determines to take the war to the heart of the UP. She realizes that Legion World and Dreamer, the most powerful and well-known Naltorian, are the keys to her plan. She's using Metropolis as a testing ground to see if Canary's power really will expand with physical contact with Nura.

Anyway, I felt the story needed something like the above back story. Otherwise, I was pleased with Gail's arc and enjoyed it.

Wow....when I compare this issue to the first issue of The Legion, I am amazed at the way the whole just went belly up. Awful story, interior art, cover and ending. Let's hope the relaunch doesnt sink after a few years...Sorry to be so negative but the powers at DC should invest to make this property the sales giant it can be. Levitz and Giffen did it...we need some creative forces at work here people!

I agree with points on all post above. I was a little let down with the wrap up. I always found it fascinating that the Legion had to face times where the rings, communications etc did not work. It always reminds me how lost we all get when our computers crash..lol
Ready to see whats gonna happen with the redo.