Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! So, thoughts on the Praetor Lemnos arc in totality?

I think that while Chapter 13 ended with a bit of a whimper (Lemnos and his people were pretty much defeated by happenstance rather than the Legion's own victory over them all) I tend to think the arc was pretty well done overall.

I do think there's some unanswered questions though to the story.

* If the Terror Formers weren't as murderous as they seemed, who DID blow up all of Orando?

* How has the Legion's status changed since they defeated Lemnos' forces?

* Why does Brainiac think Lemnos has the power to raise the dead?

I admit that I rather liked 13 honestly because it was one of the few occasions where we see that the previous defeats of a character mattered.

Lemnos survived by being "off the grid" with his armies, rapid access to transport when no one else had it, no one knowing he had very small numbers, and hell no one knowing he existed at all. He also relied on lies to his super powered followers that clearly he COULD mind control by removing their memories (I think that in a few minutes more the Terror Formers would have been his allies again) plus a bunch of mercenaries.

When his power was blocked by Saturn Girl, his dimension discovered, his identity realized (probably resulting in all of his fortune being frozen), he was pretty much beaten before the first punch was thrown.

Great fun, but I think it wrapped up a bit too quickly. Not saying it needed any more padding or extra plot threads, though.

Really did end on a good mouth full of "...THE END?" and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Good point about memories. Do Terror Firma remember Orando?

My assumption was that Elysion did most of the major destruction on Orando. To bad he didn't do it in the last 'Boot.

I'm sure Brainy knows something about Lemnos that we do not.. maybe Lemnos has access to some advanced tech..or maybe Lemnos has powers that we aren't aware of..?

Sunboy suprised me with his decision... is this the beginning of the Subs or the Workforce?

Lemnos son of the Time Trapper???

Good point btw. Does Terror Firma remember what they did? Were they in control?

Yeah, I think Elysion was the one primarly responsible for the destruction of Orando. He's a bit into the ol' violence, plus has those earth powers, so is a good fit to do things there.

J
Kindasorta back!

Which happenstance are you referring to? I think the Legion did earn their victory.

As for my thoughts on the arc as a whole... it was fine. I'm looking forward to seeing what this series is like now that they're finished introducing everything.

I was underwhelmed... but glad its over.

the wussing out of the TFers was pretty lame; I can't see that they were really innocent of previous slaughters (even if they can't remember them).

I did like Dirk staying with them, tho.

On the one hand, the story went on too long -- NO mainstream comic story should last 13 issues.

On the other hand, we got 13 issues of fantastic characterization and some really neat back-up stories, which, as I have said before, are essential for subject as complex as LSH.

I actually thought Lemnos was, and is, an intriguing villain for Legion. Villains capable of defeating the entire Legion by force cannot be particularly interesting, because they are just too damn powerful. You have to give them some weakness that strains plausibility for our heroes to stand a chance.

Villains that rely on deception, stealth and persuasion are good foil for the Legion's power (similar to how Luthor, well-written, is a good foil for Superman). The first few Universo stories were among my favorites for this reason. Lemnos is, to me, a nice twist on the Universo-type character. Plus, he's arrogant, nasty, sarcastic and megalomaniacal. What more do you want in a good villain?

I'll mention one more thing that I thought was fun through the whole arc, and that I hope Waid and Kitson continue to play with, and that is the idea of super-powers limited more by the imagination of the user than the power itself. Brainy continually ragging on characters like Light Lass and Star Boy, for example. Cos and Sun Boy taking their powers beyond their limits to try and save Orando. I think Elysion, driven by his mania, DID destroy Orando mostly on his own. My guess is, based on his performance in Metropolis, his power is great, but takes awhile to get going. But, imagine what he could do with volcanoes and earthquakes if he really applies himself. I think that is part of what happened on Orando.

I think there can be good stories of 13-ish issues, but this wasn't one of them.

I don't think we've seen the final chapter until Wednesday, when (I presume) Lemnos's and Dream Girl's ultimate fates will be decided. I'll check back then.

My Pre-Waid/Kitson Legion experience goes back to the 70's and 80's, so by comparison to that era, this was a great story arc. I had a little 15-year lapse from comics -- going to college, getting married, having kids, provided a lot of diversions that left little time for comics.

Anyway, my random thoughts:

(1) This story pales in comparison to some of the stuff I've picked up the past year while loitering about while waiting for my CBS to unpack the Legion. Seems there have been some pretty damned good JSA stories in the past 15 years or so, plus COIE, Kindom Come, Madrox, Squadron Supreme -- all good reads. Legion #1 was the first comic I had read since Reagan was president.

(2) This story reads better in one sitting than spread out over the 13 months. That doesn't do much for drawing and retaining new readers -- and apparently the title is steadily losing readers, too.

(3) It is too long and drawn out. Blame it on IC if you have too, but the whole Lemnos story is about 6 months worth of content. If it had to be spread out over 13 months for IC tie-ins ( I don't see why it would. ), then the backup stories could have been a little stronger, and the main story told more succintly.

(4) Kitson's art is near-perfect. (only problems -- too many brown-haired white boys and it requires a good ongoing relationship with a detail-sensitive inker) I would probably go to the CBS every week to pick up Scooby-Doo if Kitson were drawing it.

(5) I lost interest in the story around issue 9 or 10 or so, and it reads as if Waid did, too. (Ouch.)

(6) Unless the stroies become embarrassingly inane (like the Phantom Girl story, IMO) or Kitson quits, I plan to continue reading.

I think the biggest problem for Waid was that he honestly didn't introduce more bad guys for Lemnos to throw at them.

At least give the Terror Formers NAMES for crying out loud.

FYI, the original TFs were Kynda (fire), Zepha (wind), Gron (big guy) and Phren (green guy with tail). Poor yarked-up Water Guy never did get a name.

Wasn't Lemnos based on an older Legion villian or somesuch? Thought I heard something about that a while back?

Thank you Tromium.

There's some assumption that Lemnos is a revised Universo but I don't think this is necessarily the case. Universo was a mesmerist and Lemnos is actually a mind eraser. A subtle but distinct difference.

The Praetor Lemnos arc left a lot of open questions, which may be good in one instance to hook readers for future issues, but also was not very satisfying thru the first thirteen. Much like the character himself, the story was generally blah - undefined, slowpaced, and erratic. At the end of the arc, the leader of the invasion of the United Planets gets decked by one punch? His "Terror Firma" elite guard didn't turn out to be much of anything. The fact that in the end they didn't appear to be too different from our Legion was not a very good reflection on the said Legionnaires themselves. A lot of little tidbits introduced throughout, but with seemingly no relevance or importance to the main plot (ex- the Legion powers switching in the 5th dimension, Atom Girl secret, then appearing at the last minute, kids blowing themselves up for Lemnos, a planet destroyed - yet Cos claims no casualties, all's well? "Terror Firma" walks away with Sun Boy?) plus many more little details. PS - if planets need to be named, name them in less confusing labels - even the DC editors had trouble keeping them straight!

All in all, the reboot energy and momentum has been lost in a disappointingly drawnout muddle of ideas. I would like to see short stories to build up the characterization. Two 15 page stories per issue for half a year could really focus the title.

I agree entirely with you Kid Quislet... This has been a very disappointing 13 issues and a weak reboot to boot so far. :-(
While the concept behind the new Legion isn't bad, so far the execution and writing has been slow and weak. The rebooted characters are not bad, and it's probably one of the few strong points of the storyline.
At the moment, the only reason i'm continuing to buy is Kitson's art. So I hope Waid picks up the pace and gets some good ideas...

Unfortunately, I'm not too happy with them bringing Supergirl to the Legion. This sounds so much like an artificial way to try and boot sales. With any luck, however, Kitson will design a GOOD costume for her.

It's doubtful they'd bring her in to boost sales then give her a new costume to make her less recognizable (or to give the false impression that it's a different Supergirl).

I would love to see what Barry might come up with though...

Regarding this storyline, one of my unanswered questions is Triplicate Girl's origin - I figured it was tied into Lemnos, but if not I still hope they explain it soon.

My thoughts? Just this: never give Mark Waid a year's worth to complete a single storyline. From JLA Year One to Birthright to this LSH arc, I've been disappointed every time. His work reads much better in shorter, smaller doses.

Not only that, but in today's market such a slow-burning story is a sales kiss of death. I applauded the early focus on self-contained stories, but by issue 6 we should have been near the point we're at now, dramatically.

That off my chest, I still enjoyed year one of the 3boot Legion a great deal. As one who thought DnA creatively ran out of steam a bit more than halfway through "The Legion," I'm liking Waid's reimagination, warts and all. I'm even looking forward to another Super-Panel Hog. Hopefully Waid handles this one much better than the last couple.