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 Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Jul 2003
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Originally posted by MLLASH:
I enjoyed # 2 enough to come back for # 3 but the book hasn't made it to my pull-list... yet. It will Lash it will!!!!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Colleen Doran wrote (at her website) that Issue #2 was originally the first book and by the time she was working on #3, DC decided to add an introductory issue to give some background history. I think a lot of people found this first issue of just dialogue a bit flat or confusing.
Supposedly things really get cooking with #3, but they always say that! I still don't have the second book, hope to get it this week.
Holy Cats of Egypt!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Originally posted by Fat Cramer:
I think a lot of people found this first issue of just dialogue a bit flat or confusing.
I know I did. Flat, anyway. I think DC erred on that first issue. There are readers out there who only give a book one issue to grab them, and ROTZ #1 wasn't a grabber.
Legion World's Badwill Ambassador
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Having finally read #2 (what a laggard I am!), it might have been more confusing without the set-up in the first issue; maybe not - the marriage as political alliance is a pretty standard story, not hard to figure out - but #1 has probably set up the whole series, or the first year of stories.
The thing that got me, however, was that I was much more interested in and drawn to the chubby, affable brother and the two amazonian sisters than to the "main" characters. I suspect Na'ia (?) will be developed more and the scion left at the altar is perhaps meant to be an unsympathetic creature.
I'm not even sure of their names, after reading the issues and flipping through them just now. That doesn't strike me as very good for story-telling, unless these are expendable characters (was the scion killed or just unconscious at the end?) . Maybe it's all the apostrophes, which is becoming a tiresome trend in comic book names.
The artwork is a delight; the clothing alone serves to distinguish the different houses, in addition to their behaviour and speech.
Holy Cats of Egypt!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Jul 2003
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Re: issue #3... Gory! 
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Oct 2003
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Okay...read issue #3. Keith Giffen and Colleen Doran are two of my favorite creative types in comics... ...so why do I dislike this book? I'm sorry but three sealed it for me. The final straw was the inclusion of an element I've been dreading since it was foreshadowed in issue 1 [what the other world is - BLEH!]. I almost feel guilty for not wanting to read the book given the creators involved... 
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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I think I'm going to stop reading with this current issue also -- there are some really intriguing elements, but on the whole I'm just not riveted or anxiously awaiting the next issue, and considering how many other titles I have, I'll have to cut one or two. To make up for it, though, I'm going to try to pick up some TPBs of Doran's A Distant Soil... 
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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I had been mentally wrestling about whether to buy # 3 or not, as # 1 and # 2 were spotty at best.
I wanted to like it more, 'cause a zodiac-based world intruiged me and it's GIFFEN, damn it, but....
I just don't.
It doesn't even have characters I'd already connected with to keep me on board, like Giffen's uber-confusing SUICIDE SQUAD did.
So I gave it 2 issues, fair enough.
Giffen needs to give the fans what they REALLY want....
more I CAN'T BELIEVE IT'S NOT THE JUSTICE LEAGUE and AMBUSH BUG...!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Getting that sinking feeling here.
You've said it - I really wanted to like this series but it's just not there. Haven't seen issue #3 yet. I believe there is a commitment to put out 12 issues, but if the first ones don't grab you...
Holy Cats of Egypt!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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I've a feeling DC wasn't much behind ...ZODIAC either, as it launched with a higher $2.75 price instead of the now-standard $2.50.
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 59
Substitute
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Substitute
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I have only read the first book of this. People have already said a lot of what I'd say about this: first book boring, confusing intro dialogue.
While I find the concept interesting, the execution left somehting to be desired... Then again, I have fairly strong preconceptions about the signs of the Zodiac, so that might be part of *my* issue.
Frankly, I had no idea Giffen as involved until I read this thread. :rolleyes: I just saw Colleen Doran on the cover and needed to see! I love her art (I'm a huge fan of A Distant Soil), but I find she often suffers from being paired with an inker who diminishes her work. That wasn't too bad here, but the colours! Yuck! It was like an exercise in "how many shades of mud can I use" -- and that was before we say the people of Aries.
I might pick up more sometime, if I have money to blow and a yen for soemthing to read. Or I might not. *shrugs* That's my sixteen cents.
Action Transvestite! Running, jumping, climbing trees... and putting on make-up while you're up there!
-Eddie Izzard
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Legionnaire!
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Sadly Issue #3 will also be my final issue!!!!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Funny, but I sort of turned around with Issue #3 - I like that the two lovers are getting some personality, that the action - some of it - has moved to the Vatican (always lots of shady dealings in Vatican stories!) and that there are lots of sneaky, back-stabbing political sub-plots going on.
Holy Cats of Egypt!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Oct 2003
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Originally posted by Fat Cramer:
Funny, but I sort of turned around with Issue #3 - I like that the two lovers are getting some personality, that the action - some of it - has moved to the Vatican (always lots of shady dealings in Vatican stories!) and that there are lots of sneaky, back-stabbing political sub-plots going on. But that's really the crux of my problem...not that the Vatican can't be the source of good stories, but I just plain don't want to see the "real world" at all. Why can't a fantasy story just exist in its own universe? Why do so many comic fantasy stories end up sending their characters to the real world? I've grown to hate this particular plot twist, and after all the buildup [including the deadly dull first issue] of the Zodiac world and society, what I want to see is THAT world in action, not OURS and a "strangers in a strange land" motiff. But maybe that's just me... 
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Legionnaire!
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Originally posted by Fat Cramer:
Funny, but I sort of turned around with Issue #3 - I like that the two lovers are getting some personality, that the action - some of it - has moved to the Vatican (always lots of shady dealings in Vatican stories!) and that there are lots of sneaky, back-stabbing political sub-plots going on. Okay Cramer just for you I will give it 2 more issues!!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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I gave up with issue #4. The plotlines are just too convoluted. (And I like convoluted plotlines!)
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Jul 2003
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First, I'd like to apologize to FC for editing her original post but I didn't want to start a separate topic. Now for the news. DC has confirmed that issue # 8 will be the final issue of the series. It didn't even last long enough to make it through the Zodiac even once. Here's the scoop from Jen at The Pulse : DC Comics has confirmed for THE PULSE that issue eight of Keith Giffen, Colleen Doran, and Bob Wiacek's Reign of the Zodiac will be the last. Colleen Doran shared her thoughts with us about the end of this fantasy series.
Artist of Reign of the Zodiac, Colleen Doran told us:
"As you can well imagine, we were surprised and disappointed when the boom came down on Zodiac. We were sure we had a twelve issue run, and there are plenty of books that don't sell as well. But I think DC just didn't see it taking off, so they decided to close it down at the end of the current storyline, which is a real shame. We all worked like dogs on this book.
I spent a lot of time designing all of these Royal Houses and the only good news about all of it is most of the work I did never appeared in the book and hasn't been bought, so it belongs to me. I am going to save them for other projects.
Everyone on the book was incredibly sad about it and our editor Joan Hilty was just so nice about everything. I think she was terribly relieved I didn't get upset at her, but these decisions are not personal at all. I never get mad about these things. I just did my best and that was all there was to it.
The day before, I knew there was a conference about Zodiac coming up and I had this funny feeling about it, so I immediately put feelers out that I would be available soon for work. Right away I had a new script proposal and within a couple of hours, I had a bright and shiny new assignment at Vertigo, with a creative team with whom I have previously enjoyed working with great success. I can't really talk about it now, but I already have script and the contract just went to the lawyers. It all went down faster than the proverbial speeding bullet. I was out of work in the morning and employed that afternoon.
In a market where so many creators are looking for work every day, I am really privileged and blessed and extremely grateful that I have such terrific relationships with the people with whom I work, that we all want to come back and do projects with one another time after time. I can't ask for a greater compliment or privilege. There are no hard feelings at all. No one slacked, no one didn't carry their weight. We did the best we could and that was that.
Keith Giffen has been my friend since I was a teen, and even though Zodiac didn't work out as we had hoped, he means a lot to me and I am grateful for the opportunity to have worked with him on this project. I had a terrific chance to try new things and grow as a creator. I look forward to working with him again, too."
We hope to have news soon of Doran's Vertigo project.
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Well, can't say I'm surprised. "REIGN..." just had a "cancelled" feeling about it, similar to CHASE, YOUNG HEROES IN LOVE, MAJOR BUMMER, VEXT and THE HECKLER... only THOSE books I *loved*!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Jul 2003
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Vext! I loved Vext! I wonder if Keith could be persuaded to have him make an appearance in his upcoming Legion work?
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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VEXT (as well as the other books I mentioned-- check out the back-issue bins!) was sheer brilliance.
I dunno if Giffen would do it or not since there's so many LEGION -related in-jokes he could use already.
Y'know what would rock?
Vext, Ambush Bug and The Heckler appearing in Giffen's next FORMERLY KNOWN AS JLA series! Perhaps they could all join the team! ***Huge Grin!***
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Don't forget Cheeks! That would be too classic. Even if it was just a panel or two.
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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I'm wondering if CHEEKS will turn up with A-Bug in the LOBO UNBOUND series!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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I wonder how Zodiac could have been made better. Just take one plot/one house and develop that for several issues before branching out? Still, I'll probably go for all 8 issues just to see how it turns out.
Giffen does great comedy characters. I just read the Vext series last week for the first time, after seeing it mentioned here at LW. Don't understand why that or Ambush Bug didn't persist - maybe with an independent, with lower sales expectations/needs, they might have continued to be published? Still, nice to see AB back in the Lobo book - and Vext would be welcome for a return visit somewhere too.
Holy Cats of Egypt!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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If you liked Vext and A-Bug, Cramey, be sure to add THE HECKLER 1-6 (Giff/T&M Bierbaum) to your list of back-issue purchases!
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Re: Zodiac's Reign has Ended -- UPDATE!
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Joined: Jul 2003
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Wanderer
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Wanderer
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Too bad to hear Reign won't even go the twelve issues, but at the same time I'm relieved because I've been debating whether or not to continue buying the thing. I bought, but still haven't read #4 and I actually put down #3 half-way through. Not to sound like one of those poeple who put down the TMK Legion for being too dense and hard to follow, but that's how I felt about Reign (I was new to the Legion when TMK came out but I was able to follow that).
I also find it hard to care about any of the characters -- they all seem like pieces of a complex political drama, but while the whole might be interesting once the pieces are put together, I'm missing the personal dramas that should make the epic meaningful and resonant as a reader. It also makes it less interesting to follow the plot while the pieces of the big picture are being assembled.
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