Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities Racism in the comics

I read on Yahoo News yesterday that a Borders store in the UK pulled Tintin In the Congo from their children's section due to racist content.

Anyone have the censored version of that book?

How are the comics handling race relations in this day and age? Surely a far cry from the Golden Age!

The first time I read it, the first meeting of The Spirit and Ebony White made me cringe. Eiasner later let Ebony become a character in his own racial views evolved, but he never tried to pretend his earlier works didn't eist.

I've read some TinTin; its okay but didn't grab me. TinTin visiting Native Americans was ripe with stereotypes, but it also showed the white hypocracy/land theft when oil was discovered on that particular reservation.

Sweeping the past under the carpet has its dangers; one loses some of the context for reactions against such portrayals. How does one understand the ire about Amos n Andy or Minstrel Shows if one is unable to see examples?

The real shame of the Borders decision, IMHO, was putting it in the "children's section" in the first place. In that regard, perhaps its better not for children to see that as their first exposure to the people of the Congo - but there's no reason for an adult audience to not be exposed to it.

The biggest controversy I've heard about in the last few years involved the Mexican comics character Memín. In Mexico, he is mostly non-controversial, but his appearance--similar to caricatures of African-Americans common in the early 20th Century--occasionally raises eyebrows in the United States.

The Wikipedia article explains the Memín controversy in more detail.

Apparently there was some controversy over Speedy Gonzales a few years back for it's depiction of Mexican stereotypes, and the Cartoon Network basically shelved the cartoons until lobbying from Latin American groups brought it back on the air.

I think it's easy to become overly conscious of stereotypes to the extent that one ignores the fact that exposure to characters of other races or cultures, even if inaccurately depicted, is often a positive thing in itself. The fact is that most entertainment, particularly children's entertainment, relies upon stereotypes or caricutures of one sort or another. Part of growing up is learning that real people typically don't fit into the nice, neat stereotypes that one has developed.

I'm not really familiar with Tintin, so I can't comment on the specifics of how it depicts the people of the Congo. I suppose if it actually says things like "Look how foolish these black people are! Good thing us civilized white people have decided to conquer them and rule over them!", then I think there's something problematic about it. If it's a matter of caricuturing African tribes the way, say, a Bugs Bunny cartoon might, then I'm not sure it's something we should be nearly as worried about.

I am not familar with the Congo story, but have read Tintin in America. Which as Kent says depicts the Native Americans as stereotypical, but also shows White hypocracy. (the scene is when Tintin discovers oil on the reservation, the oil companies swoop down and start bidding higher and higher to buy the rights to the oil from Tintin. When Tintin tells them that the Indians own the oil, the oil company executives throw some bead at the cheif and tell him and the tribe to be leave.)

I found that Herge (creator of Tintin) treats indigenous or minority cultures in much the same way as Carl Barks did in Donald Duck. They are stereotypical, simple, and innocent and need the help of the European heros (usually against European villians). Despite this, the culture is depicted as good and of value.

The TINTIN series, about a globe-hopping young reporter having complex, exciting, dangerous (yet always somehow funny) adventures, started around 1929. After being serialized in a magazine, the stories were collected in albums (graphic novels / TPBs, take yer pick). Several of the earlier ones were actually redrawn from scratch much later, to bring the art style more in line with how it later evolved. (Mind-boggling, isn't it?) The first 2 books, TINTIN IN THE SOVIET UNION and TINTIN IN THE CONGO, were never redrawn, and as far as I know, never available in English (the strip originated in Belgium!) until about 15 years ago, when it was finally published in a pair of B&W hardbound volumes. The 3rd book, TINTIN IN AMERICA, was published here in English, but I believe it was only the redrawn version, which may have been "toned down" as well!

Frankly, I think as far as "racism" goes, TINTIN played no favorites. I've always believed the series takes place in England, and if so, its portrayal of English-- especially eccentric characters-- is one of the series' most charming (and hilarious) aspects. (The tone of the series suddenly made a lot more "sense" to me when I found out it WASN'T an English comic. I thought for awhile it was French-- England & France are famous longtime enemies-- but Belgium's close by. Reminds me of a scene in DEATH ON THE NILE... "You filthy froggy evesdropper!" "Belgian evesdropper, madam.")


When people become too sensitve for humor, the world has become too nasty of a place...

I guess the main issue for me is whether the culture in question is treated respectfully.

Even something like Ebony White, even though reading the Spirit as an adult my reaction is to find aspects of his portrayal cringeworthy, I actually think that if I were reading it as a kid, unencumbered by background knowledge of racial stereotypes, my reaction to the character may very well have been to think that he was the best part of the strip, because he was really funny. And I tend to think developing that kind of fondness for a black character could have been a really positive thing.

"How does one understand the ire about Amos n Andy or Minstrel Shows if one is unable to see examples?"

What most people who get up in arms about AMOS & ANDY don't realize-- probably because they've never seen it-- is that the show was REALLY funny!!! I'm talking on a level with THE HONEYMOONERS, SGT. BILKO. or NIGHT COURT.

The real "problem" was when they did a movie based on the radio show-- and had an all-white cast in blackface. LATER, when they did the TV series, they found black actors who sounded EXACTLY like the voices on the radio show had been. I admit, I've only seen one episode (same with BILKO), but it was a great show. I really didn't see much difference between it and, say-- SANFORD AND SON. I understand certain "pressure groups" have realized over the decades they made a mistake when they had the thing yanked off the air. It was a setback for having ANY black characters on TV for quite a while.

The same could be said for CAR 54, WHERE ARE YOU? At the time it was first-run, certain factions among police departments found the show "demeaning" in its portrayal of policemen. What they missed was that the show was REALLY FUNNY. (Did secret agents complain about GET SMART! ?)

EDE,

Here is an interesting essay about Little Black Sambo Essay

That *is* interesting, because it highlights the one thing that I do find really jarring about The Spirit stories, which is that Ebony and other black characters tend to be drawn in a more exaggerated or caricatured fashion than most of the white characters.

The weird thing is that while on some level I'm conscious of the fact that the reason they're drawn that way is connected to racial prejudice, it's actually so alien to me to think of those "black" characteristics as somehow implying inferiority, that I tend to react to it more as an odd artistic choice than anything else.

A few years ago, I wrote a grad-school paper for a class focusing on American history in the middle of the 20th Century. I based my essay on EC Comics, and the 'Gaines goes to HUAC' debacle, including an analysis of EC's stories and how the destruction of EC was an exmaple of McCarthiest attitudes being used as an assault on *liberalism* during this era. The paper is long, so I won't bore you all

But the point is I read some great EC stories, and anyone who knows EC knows they took on issues full-bore during this era that mainly were not spoken about in comics, particulurly race. And they were brillant. I can't recall the exact issue number or series, but the best one is the classic story where an Earthman visits a planet, but after seeing that the two species (one blue, one red) cannot co-exist, he decides they are not ready for contact with human beings. The final panel shows him remove his helmet, and he's a black man. The very first black man in space to be exact. It was shocking at the time, and it was amazing.

I'm intrigued by the dialogue b/t Eryk and Quis. Its often the art, and the use of it to highlight caricatures of races, that becomes the most blatant and unnacceptable thing, because its just so evident. Its amazing (and good I guess) that its something that I find so alien and so odd, since most commonly we haven't see art so readily blatant like that in popular comic books in so long. We've come a long way, and racism in today's teens, twenty-year olds, etc., although still certainly an issue, and a problem at that, is a much more open topic where progress is being made. By the time I got to college, 'political correctness' and topics of race were old hat--old enough, that there was a sense that its was time to move forward and see changes settle into society without hindering anything (re: the melting pot notion is dead and buried). Affirmative Action is generally loathed on college campuses, while there is an active sense among all college students to promote African culture, Asian culture, etc., etc. and appreciate it without giving such a thing a second thought or thinking the act of doing so is even worthy of the smallest debate. I think a lot of people don't realize that issues of race have moved on in a way, whether people want them to or not, and generations of younger people are having discussions on race in a distinctly different way than are most commonly portrayed in popular media. And that's not a good thing--its a *great* thing.

The thing is I recently saw a special about Africa and many of the natives admitted things were much better under colonial rule. But that is another post.

Has anybody been to the Congo? Doctor One has been many places.

I just worry sometimes political correctness erases reality.

btw, back to racism in comics. Didn't Shooter want to make Ferro Lad black? That would've been great. Instead we got Tyroc. eh.

I actually asked Darwyn Cooke what he thought Eisner was thinking when he drew some of those characters. Cooke said Eisner probably just wasn't thinking about those issues and would say that he was foolish in his youth. As EDE says he might have even thought portraying a black character was progressive back then. Not too many people thought about caricatures, even somewhat progressive types which I'm sure Eisner would count himself in.

Cobie's right about the race dialogue too. Affirmative action and such came out of a society where whites mixed only in white social circles and so on. There's much more opportunity these days for interaction amongst different cultures. Though its a shame some people choose not to participate. Of course I did go to a Blonde Tory Bastion of a university, myself. (Gawd I miss all those Daisy Buchanan girls )

That's a complicated issue, because many of the problems in Africa now are the results of colonization and then de-colonization. What you have today in Africa is a bunch of countries whose borders are basically wherever a bunch of white guys in Europe decided to draw the boundries of their empires, and that's what creates a lot of the problems there.

I'll give an affirmative to your first part and a humbly disagree with the second. Those artficial borders probably kept the place from completely blowing up into a thousand skirmishes for land by providing a larger identity that local clan to majority enthicities. Didn't work all the time (cough-Ruanda-cough) but for the most part.

To answer Jorge's question. Neither Congo but just next door in Gabon, probably the most stable Congo country. Amazing what voting in a good dictator 30 years in a row can do to stabilize a region.

It would've been GREAT to get a black Legionnaire all those years ago - but I'm glad it wasn't Ferro Lad.

1. Because he died like 2 issues after he was introduced. And that screams of "black guy in horror/sci-fi movie" syndrome ie. "always the first one to die". As well as uncomfortably implying that people of colour aren't cut out to fight with the Legion.

and

2. Because his whole face and body were completely covered by a mask and costume - a mask he wore because he was ashamed of how he looked underneath. That's a rather unsavoury message to be sending. And the complete covering up of his skin (and therefore race) is a tactic that seems to occur a lot in comics that allows the company to include a black character in a book but hides that fact as much as possible.

actually, Shooter wasn't going to kill him if he would be able to keep him Black.

also, DC's stated-line was the fear of visibly black heroes causing sales drops/botcotts in the South. A helmeted hero was one way around that (not a good one, especially as per the message you describe) - Tasmia being blue rather than black was another.

There was a letter in one of the issues after Invisible Kid II was introduced claiming that, since Jacques was clearly French-speaking, this made him more European and acceptable to white readers (not to mention his very deferential attitude) as opposed to angry, shouting Tyroc.

Jim Shooter also stated that he originally intended for Karate Kid to be an Asian but it never happened.
Did Shooter create Karate Kid after watching an episode of the Green Hornet? During the 1970s kung-fu film craze,wasn't KK drawn in the likeness of Bruce Lee?

Look at Chop-Chop from the Blackhawks-he was a caricature of the short,yellow skinned Chinese with a pig tail.When DC took over the series in 1956,they greatly altered Chop-Chop's appearance by making him more human(still short)with a regular haircut and saying "wobbly woes" a lot.

While I'm at it,anybody offended by the accents of Andre,Olaf and Hendrickson? Py Yimminy!