Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes SDCC News: Superboy In, XS Out?

Well, it's actually more like speculation, but based on news reports from SDCC, two items of interest for the Legion in the DCnU:

- Grant Morrison stated Superman is still involved with the Legion. Small cameo/clue in Action #1.

- Didio announced that Barry and Iris aren't married, so that doesn't seem like it bodes well for XS.

A Johns

If this is true...I may be done with the Flash. That was one of the things that I always liked about Barry. The fact that he was married and had a happy, healthy relationship with Iris.

DC is moving me closer and closer to just dumping the whole thing aside from Legion and the Vertigo stuff I get. If they do kill Gates in the Lost book...that may be it for the LEgion as well. XS is now gone, unless they change her origin, another character is dying soon in the main book, and Gates and someone else may be dying in Lost. They're promoting new questionable characters over ones that fans have wanted in the Legion for years. I may just talk myself out of them soon as well.

While my guess is that XS is out of continuity (and Gates, if he survives, will be retconned to remove any mention of the reboot Legion origins), there's no reason in particular they couldn't have her as a vague "descendant of the Flash", since, you know, she's from the future anyway. Plus Bart Allen is apparently still around, so however he is in, she could be as well.

Yeah, there's nothing yet to say that XS is out. I actually would prefer it if she were, simply because I prefer the Legion not to have members who are legacy characters of the JLA.

Remember we're dealing with time travel concepts here. Just because Barry and Iris aren't married yet in the post September stories, doesn't mean they won't marry at some point in the future. There is still plenty of time for them to have children and grandchildren.

Also remember the post relaunch Flash will be presented at a point earlier in his career. It was well over a decade after his original debut that Barry married Iris.

...and I am done. I am not going to be going along with the new DC books at all. It may seem like a simple thing, but crapping all over some characters (The Teen Titans - Wally, Donna). Read this article... http://speedforce.org/2011/07/flash-news-comiccon/

I have been trying to be positive...but that's it.

I'll still get American Vampire and iZombie, but that's it.

I don't get it.

Why can't XS just stay in Legion continuity with a revised ancestry that's not so tightly connected to the present-day Flash?

Same reason Wally is out...it's too complicated to try to think about and explain.

Not sure who the hell Impulse/Kid Flash is supposed to be now though...but he's still around.

Pretty sure Impulse has been confirmed as "Bart Allen", make of that what you will.

I was always fond of Wally, but I can sort of get their logic for leaving him out, since much of his history was concurrent with, or right after, the lifetime of the original Flash.

But Jenni Ognatz isn't even born until almost a thousand years after Barry Allen is an active superhero. So who cares if we know her family tree in exhaustive detail or not? Why can't they just say, "She's a descendant of Barry Allen" and leave it at that?

Or else she comes from a scientific background and took a serum that granted her super-speed, just like Lyle Norg did.

Or else, or else... [add your own]

Cheez. If I can think this stuff up with minimal effort, why is it so hard for the pros? There are few enough characters of color in the Legion-verse as it is, DC! C'mon!

They kept Roy. They kept Dick. They're even acknowledging Dick's time as Batman. How is that easy to keep, but Wally is too complicated?

Lazy.

Some points that are relevant to this discussion...

Scott Lobdell, writer for the Teen Titans and Superboy, said explicitly during one session (Saturday's DC 52 session, I think) that Bart is still from the 31st century. If Bart Allen, descendant/grandson of Barry Allen is still from the Legion's time, I think it's reasonable that his cousin Jenni (XS) is still around. Certainly I haven't heard anything to suggest that she wasn't returning. After all, they are the children of the Tornado Twins, characters who were NOT originally created as the children of Barry and Iris, so I'm not certain Bart and Jenni's existence post-Flashpoint depend on Barry and Iris being their grandparents (although that may still be the case).

Also, Brett Booth reported in his blog some weeks ago that he had drawn Wally West and Donna Troy in issue #2 of the new Teen Titans (see the comment for July 8, 8:42 AM), so I think (I hope) those characters are still around post-Flashpoint.

Idle speculation: Perhaps we'll see Wally in the future with his family?

According to the article I referenced..."He (Dan) said its hard and very difficult to accept but eventually the Perez era will be gone. "

But Cyborg and Starfire are still here...I call BS.

I didn't say it was good logic, Dev.

I'm so glad that the Legion doesn't seem to be getting the shaft in this re-launch/re-boot, since I'm a Legion fan first and foremost, but for the life of me I can't understand why the Titans are?

The only thing I can think of is the greatest version of Titans were so much Wolfman and Perez that everything since they left pales in comparison, so DC wants to get away from that entirely, I wonder what this meens for the Games graphic novel?

If Donna, Wally and the rest are truly out for the nonce, it's only a matter of time until they return. Might be a short while, might be a long while, but they'll be back. I remember when Kara Zor-El, Clark-as-Superboy, Krypto, Batwoman and others were "out". Eventually, all came back. Some creator or another who loves the characters will come around and have enough influence to bring them back sooner or later (probably sooner).

I'd say if these characters are being wiped out, we've only as long a wait as Didio's the top dog. I'd say if the DCnU doesn't show more than just a temporary sales uptick, that won't be a long wait at all.

I'm doing what I always do: buy the books I'm interested in and nothing more. All in all, I'm probably going to but about the same number of DC books I've been buying on average.

I don't know about all of this, but I'm going to try to stay hopeful, even for Gates.

And the Jim Lee concept drawings are amazing.
I'd love to see and download ALL of his Legion work.
Lar and Jo are wonderful, even in just sketch form, without color.

I definitely think that Gates is just going to be 'believed dead' for a short time (kidnapped by Cadmus scientists or Luthor or whatever).

Fabian's commentary on the DC boards about 'not having to figure out his speech patterns *for a little bit*' suggests that he'll have limited speaking lines for a few months, but be back later and that Fabian will then have to come to grips with his speech patterns / mannerisms.

well, they won't be married NOW. and maybe we won't see them as a married couple anymore. but that doesn't rule out that they could get married eventually in stories we'll never read, like a sort of an "ending" for the flash.

Believed dead is okay. I would prefer that or some leave of absence/split with the group/individual mission than outright death of a character (especially multiple characters). Then the door's always open to bring them back without having to resort to some convoluted explanation. There must be lots of ways to add impact to a story without death.

I listened to a few of the DC podcasts from San Diego, and a repeated theme in the audience questions was "Where's Wally?"

I think that getting rid of the Wolfman/Perez era is not going to work so well. Too many fans see this as THE Teen Titans. Say it doesn't exist won't make them accept crappy stories.

I agree with this. Writers, if you don't like a particular character, don't write them into the story. Have them go off somewhere. Then a writer who wants to use the character can without having to "bring them back from the dead". And I know you want to write that death scene because they will show how talented a writer you are. And where are the editors? SHouldn't they be saying "no" to the willy-nilly killing of characters? Although I suppose part of the problem is the PTB think/know that death sells.

When comic book deaths were rare, they had meaning and impact. Now it is just "Oh so-and-so is dead. I wonder how long before she/he is brought back."

I'm with you in being glad about the Legion. I find it rather ironic that this time, everybody else is suffering while we're kind of spared - guess that Paul Levitz is to 'blame' for that, guess with any other writer, they would just have shafted the Legion as well. Certainly we HAVE suffered enough and somebody finally noticed...

About the Titans: I guess DC came to the conclusion that any attempt to reach old grandeur with the Wolfman/Perez team or parts of it has majorly failed in the last 15 years. The last revival of that team (2009? 2008?) by Winnick was so abysmal (the art detoriated from issue to issue, I skipped the book before it turned #10) that any further attempt would have to be doomed now - so they decided to "call it a day" and put that team on the shelves forever.

And I have to say that before they are doing another Titans #1 with artists like Lopez or Porter again, it is better to leave the team alone. This new Titans book is a fresh start - I will not support it, but maybe other fans will, we'll see how long it will survive. I will rather buy the one with Starfire in it cause I always loved that character - let's see how she will be portrayed in this Reboot. For her, after all she's been through (losing her planet, her family, her lover Nightwing whom she nearly married), a fresh start is certainly something she deserves...

...so while I was deeply shocked to lose Legion Lore in 1994 - even with Emerald Dragon and Polestar being part of that Lore - I am not at all sad to see the Titans continuity rebooted after all the bad writing that happened since New Titans ##100 (and even before that... "Total Chaos"... *shudder*)

Yeah, it's nonsense to believe that people will buy a book just because it's called "Anything Titans"... Titans books have been terrible for over a decade with the old stuff still IN continuity... the Titans name has long wore out its welcome...

Kori got her planet and family, her sister anyway, back in the latest dotREBELS.
She also replaced Nightwing with Captain Comet as her lover, if not her love.

But, yes, I signed up for the Outlaws, too.