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Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965104 12/31/18 09:29 AM
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In general, I find the best What Ifs tend to be the really early ones, when it was a double-sized bi-monthly series. The two I mentioned are both from very early in that run. What If Classic Volumes 1 and 2, collecting the first 12 issues between them, are the way to go. For some of the best of the later What Ifs, see if you can find a copy of the X-Men: Alterniverse Visions trade, even though obviously none of those are Avengers related.


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Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965113 12/31/18 01:39 PM
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I have "The Last Avengers Story" Peter David wrote with Ariel Olivetti. I find it EXTREMELY hilarious Tommy Maximoff was the spellcaster and Billy was the sociopath.

Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965114 12/31/18 03:02 PM
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Glad to hear you enjoyed that one. I had honestly forgotten about it. It's been so many years since the last time I read it, that I guess it just wasn't my thing. PAD is my favorite writer, but I do seem to recall finding Olivetti's art off-putting, so the latter may have been the main reason I didn't keep it. Hmmm...it was reprinted in the Avengers: First to Last trade, which my library does have in its catalog. Maybe I should give it another try. Thanks, Sarky.


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Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965119 12/31/18 05:13 PM
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You're not gonna like what Hulk does to Tigra, though.

Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965344 01/04/19 08:59 PM
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I doubt it will offend me. PAD has never offended me, no matter how sensitive the subject matter he takes on. Disappointed me sometimes, yes. Bored me sometimes, yes. But offended me, no.


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Lard Lad #965438 01/06/19 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Paladin
So from my ever-growing, increasingly-legendary Pile o'trades, I recently crossed off Avengers Omnibus Vol. 1, which reprints Avengers (1st series) 1-30. In kind of a bass-ackwards way, this continued my Avengers reading project from last summer which spanned issues 89-196. This time, though, I went back to the beginning and the Silver Age after having first read the bulk of what comprised the Avengers run in the Bronze Age. As with last year's project, I had read very little of the Silver Age run with maybe a stray, poorly-remembered reprint read here and there.

To be honest the early Lee/Kirby issues were a bit of a struggle to get through. I found them mostly colour-by-numbers compared to, say, the great Silver Age Spider-Man run. There was virtually no chemistry between the Avengers themselves, and the stories were mostly dull. This isn't to say it lacked any interest at all. I mean, I got to see the debuts of such classic villains as Kang and the Masters of Evil and the re-introduction of Cap, but it's hard to argue that the stories themselves were equally classic or particularly memorable otherwise.

I think where there was some interest was in the ongoing threat of Zemo, the Enchantress and the Executioner. There was the feel that these were the book's "house" villains for a while and that they were somewhat of a match for our heroes, not easily put down. It was certainly nice to see Zemo's storyline get a definite conclusion eventually and that the other two still lingered a while afterwards.

It seems strange to say this, but I think the book clearly picked up some steam with the arrival of Don Heck as penciller. Odd, because while Kirby is remembered as a towering legend of the industry, Heck is....well, not all that legendary in comparison. But I feel his art immediately popped on Avengers and improved through issue 30, despite his not having a consistent inker from issue to issue. The comparison between Heck's work here and his irregular fill-ins during the later Englehart Avengers era is like night and day. While the Englehart stuff was rushed, messy and drab, Heck's work while he is clearly in his prime and on a regular assignment is attractive and sometimes striking.

I don't want to come off as a Kirby-basher since I'm not on record as his biggest fan. I really don't lay a lot of blame on him for his work on Avengers. He certainly over-extended himself during this era and probably really only put his real love into the FF and Thor books on a fairly consistent basis. And his Avengers work isn't terrible, per se, but some of it was downright distracting, as in the case of the Hulk's changing toe count. I think of his 8 issues (he helps some also in 14-16), issue 7 was my favorite with the other Avengers brawling with a mind-controlled Thor.

But for whatever reason, everything starts picking up some steam with Heck's arrival. Though the team chemistry still isn't scintillating, the plots start picking up and maintaining my interest. 9, Heck's first, starts off with a bang with the original Wonder Man story and how it finally brings a bit of drama and gravitas to what had been a predictable opening formula. And almost immediately, we start to feel some building tension and even get a cliffhanger at the conclusion of the Nefaria story involving the Wasp. And of course we get some final resolution with Zemo in issue 15.

So the quality is on the rise at this point, but I think it kicks into full gear with issue 16 and the first classic line-up overhaul. Whether it was Stan's decision solely or whatever, the book got 1000% better, imo, when Thor, Iron Man, Giant man and the Wasp were written out and Hawkeye, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver were brought in. Immediately, there was tension and chemistry in a book that completely lacked that within its cast prior to the change. It just had to have been a risky move on young Marvel's part to take out the book's stars and replace them with relative unknown characters who had also been antagonists in other books.

I loved all the bickering, quips, leadership challenges and even the seeds of Wanda's crush on a living legend. Hell, even Cap was a bit of a hothead and not entirely immune to Hawkeye pushing his buttons. It's all the better knowing how the relationships would evolve over the ensuing decades from that rough start. I especially smiled thinking of when Hawkeye finally gets his chance to lead the west coast team. But suddenly, the relationships were fun to me and kept me turning the pages even as the plots also generally started to draw more interest as well.

I think if I have to pick my favorites of the "new" era between 16-30, it would be the first Swordsman story (19-20) and the epic return of Kang (23-24). The first Swordsman story made me wish Englehart's later characterization of him were maybe a little closer to how he was here. He seemed more formidable. And I really liked how his code of honor wouldn't allow him to slaughter the Avengers with a bomb. I also liked how the Avengers never realized he'd saved them. The Kang story felt like the first real Avengers epic with the long odds the team were facing and the more cosmic feel. Gotta love Kang having to work with his enemies and the tragedy of his beloved Ravonna.

I like how you really feel the new Avengers foursome have developed as a team and have had enough time to be left to do so before the Wasp and Giant Man/Goliath rejoin. It's basically a full year/12 issues, though both returnees play bit parts in the prior issues before returning to the official line-ups. The untested heroes have gone through their interpersonal and heroic trials by fire before having some experience injected back in. You realize that this is true not of the former villains but also of Captain America, whose experience here is quite a change from what he's been doing before his suspended animation.

As an aside, it's a bit of a hoot that the Omnibus includes the letters pages and how they reflect the downside of what a risk Marvel took with the line-up change. I mean, even through issue 30, readers were calling for the originals to be brought back. And then there was the surprising unpopularity of Cap himself. Readers wanting him kicked out seemingly more often than not! Other than his lack of powers being unpopular, readers weren't enamored of what we might now characterize in hindsight as his 'emo' phase. i mean, Cap was a pretty whiny mutha back then! I mean, it makes sense with all he'd lost, but it's certainly interesting to see Cap anything less than the uber-confident leader he would become known to be.

Anyhow, it only gets more interesting as Pym returns and takes over the emo spot with his size-stuckness. More interesting is the return of Swordsman, the original Power Man (later T-Bolt Atlas) and especially the re-intro of the now mind-controlled Black Widow and how she affects Hawkeye. The book ends with a great spotlight for Hawkeye (who still didn't have a real name yet, btw) as Cap memorably allows him to go after the villainous trio alone after Hawkeye felt he'd let the team down previously by not being able to take Natasha down. Hawkeye more than holds his own against bad odds, though he ultimately is saved by the now (apparently) freed-by-love Widow. It's a great spotlight issue for the archer that I feel like he'd earned as we'd watched him evolve. Seeing how his apparently renewed love affair develops the character is something to look forward to in Vol. 2.

If there's any drawback here, it's that the Omnibus doesn't end very tidily. There's a lot up in the air: What's next for Hawkeye and Natasha? What's up with Wanda and Pietro's power-loss subplot? And there's the more precise unresolved cliffhanger with Hank being imperiled by some cult in South America. But by that time the Avengers had evolved into a book where the story is constantly moving and bleeding into the next issues, and that's a big part of its finally achieving its potential, along with the great chemistry, more dynamic plots and the sharp Don Heck art.

Indeed, I was sorely tempted to continue on to Avengers Omnibus Volume 2 and all the delights that I know await me within. But I ultimately decided to savor this one a while and move on to another diversion....for now. But it's nice to know that what started as a chore to go through really evolved into quite the page-turner and one of the better Silver Age Marvels I've had the pleasure to experience, though Spidey remains the gold standard for me.


bump

I couldn't think of a better way to set the stage for my Avengers Silver Age Re-Read than to bump this review. Luv ya, Lardy. love


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965458 01/07/19 01:34 AM
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I seem to be one of the few who don’t care for Caps Kooky Quartet. It’s too obvious an FF knockoff. The squarejwed leader, the shrinking violet in love with him, her hotheaded brother, and the grumbling guy who complains all the time. Clearly Wanda and Clint wound up being valuable additions, but those early stories leave me unimpressed.

Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965667 01/12/19 04:24 AM
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PRELUDE TO THE GREAT AVENGERS SILVER AGE & BRONZE AGE RE-READ


Time marches on, people are works-in-progress, and people's tastes change.

I am no exception to all of the above.

As noted recently, I did this thread's opening batch of old-time Avengers reviews over a decade ago. So I feel it would be worthwhile to see how I feel today about a generous portion of those very same issues, some of which I've re-read many times in the interim, others which I've either ignored or avoided.

That said, I feel I have to forewarn all Legion Worlders that the pacing and format of this re-read is going to be itself a work-in-progress. Long-form re-reads such as this one have proven turbulent for me to navigate, let alone complete, in the past.

Then there is the sheer number of issues -- 149 plus 2 Annuals and 4 Giant-Size Avengers, to be exact. If I don't at least sporadically try to blast fast through several blocks of issues which don't mean much to me and I'd rather not linger on, then it's going to take way too long to see through to the end. To wit, there will be times when I'm doing as much as an issue a day (!) and I apologize in advance to people who will have a hard time keeping up. I just hope that the slower phases of the re-read, focusing on the issues that I really like and want to savor deeply, will balance things out in the end.

Finally, a disclaimer -- I do not believe that any work of entertainment, or any creator, is above constructive criticism. If you think I'm harsh on some artists and writers, that's fair enough. What's not appropriate is to express disagreements in a belligerent, disrespectful way. There are strict rules to being a participant in any and all of the Legion World forums, and they will be enforced here as much as in the other forums.

And a postscript -- I wanted to devise a different sort of rating system for each issue. Initially, I'd planned to have 10 of the Legionnaires graemlins represent a numerical grade, in order of my personal preference for Legionnaires (i.e., a rating of 10 out of 10 equals Umbra ), but then I decided I didn't want to risk hurting the feelings of people who like the Legionnaires that I dislike. So instead, I'm going to color-code the ratings:


10

9

8

7

6

5

4

3

2

1

ZERO

Hope to see lots of you chiming in, Legion Worlders! It's gonna be a wonderful ride!


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965693 01/13/19 05:25 AM
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AVENGERS V.1 ISSUE 1

Getting us off to a promising start, this issue is better in some ways than I remembered.

But first...in recent years, a possibly apocryphal comics industry legend has been circulating that Stan Lee & Jack Kirby actually had no plans to create their own counterpart to the JLA -- they already had the Fantastic Four and the X-Men, and besides, they were both already stretched paper-thin with their respective workloads as the Marvel Universe snowballed from its humble beginnings only 2 years past. No, if we are to believe this story, the whole reason Avengers exists was because industry veteran Bill Everett, who had become increasingly drunk and unreliable as he got older, had blown his deadline for turning in the artwork for the first issue of Daredevil. Stan needed to get *something, anything* in the pipeline pronto, or it would throw off the publisher's whole operation...or something to that effect. So he and Jack cobbled together all their solo acts except Spider-Man and Dr. Strange (in order of power levels: Thor, Hulk, Iron Man, Wasp, Ant-Man) into one team, and all was well in the Marvel Universe.

There is some validity to that rumour, I believe -- after all, of the 7 founding members of the JLA, three had acquired marquee value through longevity (Superman, Wonder Woman, Batman), two were re-imaginings of Golden Age characters whose popularity was surpassing their predecessors (Green Lantern, Flash), one was a recent addition to the DC line (Martian Manhunter.) And as for Aquaman...um...I got nothin'. The Avengers, by contrast, were new-ish characters who were only moderately successful compared to F4 and Spidey -- in fact, the Hulk's solo book had just been cancelled, and the Ant-Man & Wasp feature was on the chopping block.

You'll notice I'm only just now getting to the actual plot. That's because Marvel was never much for plot during the Silver Age. Their comics were intense, character-driven, intense, dark and violent for their time, and intense. Did I mention intense? If anything, the first Avengers story is really a Thor story with other people shoehorned in, some more smoothly than others. The Norse Trickster God, Thor's half-brother Loki, concocts a rather convoluted scheme for getting even with the God of Thunder, whom he holds responsible for his solitary exile to the dreary Isle of Silence. Initially intending to use only the Hulk as his stooge, Loki accidentally engineers the formation of the Avengers. And a rum bunch they are at this stage in the team's evolution -- Iron Man is blandly, conventionally heroic, the Hulk is a sulky, morose bore, and as for Janet Van Dyne & Henry Pym...whew, it's obvious from the start that he's an undemonstrative dick with emotional issues and condescending attitude toward her. But, at the same time, she's so annoying the way she pours on the "flirtatious little ditz" persona so thick, that I don't like her any better than him! Thor comes off best by far, with his gravitas and his charmingly stilted speech patters (not quite yet the gloriously archaic gobbledygook that Stan will later fashion, but gettin' there.)

For what was obviously a rush job on Stan & Jack's part, there is a lower level of Silver Age Goofiness than I expected. The most cringe-worthy moments, in my opinion, all center around Ant-Man, more specifically around the Ants whom he commands through the vibrations of his helmet's antennae or some-such. These ants pull off feats of such improbable, scientifically dubious scope, that I have to wonder if they're mutant ants specially bred by Pym. Only Marvel's mutant team, the X-Men, was very unpopular at the time with comics fandom overall, so I just chalk it to deadline-crunching desperation, and easily forgive the creators.

I find it easy to forgive Stan & Jack because, whatever the true circumstances of the Avengers' genesis, they had captured lightning in a bottle -- without even knowing it yet!


MY GRADE: 6 out of 10


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #965964 01/19/19 10:41 AM
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Avengers v1 Issue 2

I found this issue to be a disarmer and a charmer. And also, surprisingly redolent of Marvel's Distinguished Competition -- specifically, those quirky little one-off sci-fi stories with a gimmicky but fun twist at the end.

The villain here is the Space Phantom, an advanced guard for a planned inter-dimensional invasion. His power allows him to switch places with any one human being he chooses, instantly taking on that person's appearance while the poor unfortunate being impersonated ends up in the barren wasteland dimension named Limbo (that is, until the Space Phantom chooses a new person to imitate, and the previous person is whisked back to Earth.)

It goes without saying that the villain's powers lead to a great deal of misunderstandings and manipulative mayhem, nearly destroying the Avengers from within (although they're already a fractious enough group to begin with.) Until, that is, the Space Phantom overreaches himself by trying to impersonate Thor, who is not a human but a God. Oops. One-way ticket back to Limbo for the bad guy.

But whereas in the Silver Age DCU, everything would instantly go back to the status quo, in the MU there are repercussions. The Hulk feels that the Space Phantom incident validates his paranoia about how the rest of the team distrusts him...so he quits! And *that*, in turn, gracefully sets up the plot for the next issue, "The Hulk and Sub-Mariner Versus the Avengers."

Grade: 7 out of 10


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #966028 01/20/19 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Ann Hebistand
In general, I find the best What Ifs tend to be the really early ones, when it was a double-sized bi-monthly series.


It feels like some more recent 'What Ifs' are more like 'Take That!'s, and have a defensive tone like, 'If you didn't like how event X went, here's a self-justifying alternative that's crappier, and even more people die and / or are maimed! It totally could have been worse!'

My favorite is the comedy issue with the all-white panel captioned 'Wendigo fighting White Tiger in a snowstorm' that John Byrne found amusing enough to make a whole issue of Alpha Flight about.

Although there were lots of neat stories, like the '50s Avengers one mentioned above that introduced the team that would later become the Agents of Atlas, or the one were Iron Man attempts to armor up the rest of the Avengers to face the Hulk and Sub-Mariner.


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Re: The All Avengers Thread
Set #966029 01/20/19 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Set
Originally Posted by Ann Hebistand
In general, I find the best What Ifs tend to be the really early ones, when it was a double-sized bi-monthly series.


It feels like some more recent 'What Ifs' are more like 'Take That!'s, and have a defensive tone like, 'If you didn't like how event X went, here's a self-justifying alternative that's crappier, and even more people die and / or are maimed! It totally could have been worse!'


LOL lol Set, your wit always helps the bitter truths go down easier. Thanks.

Originally Posted by Set
Although there were lots of neat stories, like the '50s Avengers one mentioned above that introduced the team that would later become the Agents of Atlas, or the one were Iron Man attempts to armor up the rest of the Avengers to face the Hulk and Sub-Mariner.



Yep. And I'm about to review the Avengers issue that inspire the second of those two What Ifs. smile


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #966030 01/20/19 01:27 PM
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Avengers v1 Issue 3

Whoa. What a letdown. And here I thought that the template for my favorite What If story had to be at least half-decent. Especially considering that the first two issues of Avengers were far more enjoyable than I'd remembered.

Sadly, such is not the case. Stan & Jack slump in a major way with the third issue. If the previous one summed up all that was good about the Silver Age, this one sums up the worst, most tarnished tropes of that era.

Where to begin with all the things that are wrong with this story? Well, beyond the all-around cheesiness, the unlikability of most of the characters, the seriously out-of-character actions and words of the one character I do like (Namor the Sub-Mariner would never ask the Hulk for help! mad ), and the utterly goofball bits that would've gotten laughed out of a Filmation Studios story conference, there actually *is* one sin which I find more toxic than any other one committed by this story.

Namely, the Subby/Hulk team up doesn't actually happen until there are only about 6 pages of story-space left!

The only reason this one doesn't get a categorical ZERO is because Gil Kane and Jim Shooter turned this lemon into such exquisite lemonade in their aforementioned What If issue (FTR, it's What If v1 # 3.)

Grade: 1 out of 10


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #966046 01/20/19 05:44 PM
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Thanks for doing this Ann. I am enjoying reading the early Avengers along with you.

I'm not great at viewing comics critically (just tend to enjoy reading them) and I still enjoyed this one. I also like the What If based on it. I do get a bit tired of Wasp's portrayal and much prefer Roger Stern's approach in the 80's.

Boy that image projector would be a handy device although I don't remember ever seeing it again.

The biggest disbelief moment (other than those superfast ants again - wonder if these comics helped inspire the old Maxis game SimAnt where the goal was to develop your ant colony until you drove the human out of house and home) was when Hulk squeezed a cactus like a dishcloth forcing all its needles to pop off in a carefully aimed ridiculously powerful barrage. Oh well not much sillier than Superman lifting a building by one corner and it holding together I guess.

Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #966077 01/21/19 08:58 AM
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Thank you, Stile! Pleased to have your company for this re-read. Welcome aboard!

Roger Stern's Wasp is the only one I can still read without cringing, although some dumb editorial decisions related to Secret Wars and West Coast Avengers did give her some questionable moments even during the Stern Era!

I'm with you on the cactus sequence. That's something that'd make me laugh if it was in, say, an old Popeye cartoon, but in a Marvel superhero comic...no. (Weirdly enough, during the brief time a teenaged Jack Kirby worked in animation during the 1930s, he did work on at least a couple Popeye cartoons. Flashback maybe?)


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #966214 01/23/19 04:17 PM
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Avengers v1 Issue 4

I don't think there's much to say about this issue, beyond its academic significance as the first Silver Age appearance of Captain America, and the first time he appears in an Avengers issue, *and* the first time he appears alongside Thor and Iron Man (though The Big Three legend wouldn't really be set in stone until at least the mid-late 1970s.)

What I will say is that, if the first 3 issues of Avengers tended to err on the side of underplotted, this one falls right over to the other side of the fence, with much too much incidental plot detail for the story to flow at a decent pace. Maybe that's why the Avengers themselves spend too much time sidelined thanks to the Asparagus Alien and his petrifying ray?

I'll add that I find Captain America the least essential of The Big Three to the team. Maybe it's because I began reading Avengers in "Real Time" during the Steve Epting era, when Cap was uncomfortably shoehorned back into the team after a year's absence. Cap, as a character, was really floundering at that time (early-mid 1990s.) Ed Brubaker, one of only two writers (the other is Roger Stern) whose work on Cap's solo book does anything positive for me anymore, put it quite succinctly several years ago, criticizing the creators of the time for, basically, making him way too wimpy and wonky for someone who'd seen combat during World War 2.

At this 1963 stage, Cap isn't much better than he'd be 30 years on. Neither Stan nor Jack seems particularly thrilled to be working on him again, and with the Vietnam War fiasco and the uprising of the counter-culture just around the corner, the timing for his return wasn't exactly on the money.

In and of itself, though, I think the issue's just "MEH." So Captain America's back? Big whoop.

Grade: 3 out of 10


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #966399 01/28/19 01:30 AM
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There sure was a lot going on in this episode: Namor swimming the seven seas looking for his people, stumbling across some Inuit worshipping a frozen figure in ice and throwing it away; the Avengers finding the now thawed figure and rescuing him, discovering he is Captain America who promptly wakes up and battles them in confusion which convinces them he is the real deal, followed by Cap retelling the tale of Bucky's death and (somehow knowing) his freezing and being worshipped by Inuit; the Avengers returning to New York where they are seemingly replaced by stone statues; Cap going through a bit of culture shock and despair; Rick Jones finding Cap while searching for the Avengers to find out what has happened to the Hulk; Cap getting his mojo back and tracking down the "villain" with the help of Rick and his teen squad; confronting and beating the villain who turns out to be a stranded alien reluctantly co-operating with Namor (and the truth behind the myth of Medusa); with the alien's help restoring the "stoned" Avengers; working together to salvage the alien's crashed ship; Namor finding some of his imperial guard and attacking the Avengers with their help; a rather complicated battle with an uncertain finish; and Cap being invited to join the Avengers. Whew!

Nevertheless I actually enjoyed it more than the previous stories. While the plot was full of ridiculous coincidences it was fun and interesting, to me at least. I also enjoy ed the characterisation in the story. Pretty much every character had at least some dialogue or thoughts which were different enough to emphasise their personality, and the final thoughts of Rick wondering how the Hulk would react when he learned he had been replaced showed the thought going into ongoing threads. One thing the Avengers have had right from the start is each issue tying into the previous ones, something rather unusual for the silver age.

The opening page says that the fans demanded the return of Captain America. I wonder if that was true.
I actually read Cap as portrayed in abetter light then you did Ann. Yes he struggled at times but once he pulled himself together he was very much the man in charge of himself and others. Funny how we can read the same issue and see so differently.

Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #967985 03/01/19 07:12 PM
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To Stile86 and others following the Avengers Re-Read which seemed to stop right after it started:

I've decided I'm just going to jump ahead to what I consider the first really good, solid issue: Avengers v.1 #19, the debut of the Swordsman.

Apologies to fans of the earlier issues, but I just couldn't find anything constructive to say about them. Or, at least, nothing that was constructive enough to make the effort of full reviews worth my time and energy. As I warned right before I posted the first review, I have an unfortunate history of running into difficulties while trying to get through long-form re-reads. Again, apologies.


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
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No worries Ann.
Better to read and write about what you want to write about than never write anything again because you can't think of what to say.

Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #968033 03/03/19 04:40 AM
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Thank you, Stile.

I'm hoping to post reviews every other day this week, to get some momentum going again.


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #970052 04/21/19 01:44 AM
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Tempus Fugitive
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"It can't be!"
"Not You!"
"Y-you're dead! DEAD!"

Gosh! Cap really falls apart with that last line. smile

The shop yesterday had a reprint of Avengers 343, the issue where a certain Avenger returns from the grave! (with Magdalene behind him) Or does he as it leads towards the Gatherers story that we reread a while back.

I'd forgotten the cover, but Epting's art stood out across the racks. For a few moments, I was hoping it was a new story based on the old teams they were doing. But it seems to be a teaser/ lead into a Epic Collection TPB. There's a few TPBs being launched across Avengers history by the looks of it. There's a "True Believers #1" strapline on the cover. If I was getting the TPBs, I'd hope that this issue was included in there. It would be odd to have a floppy issue beside the TPBS.

So, the arrival of Crystal; Black Knight gets a lightsaber; a new Thor is learning the ropes and there's a few character subplots to raise the level further such as Crystal/ Quicksilver, Vision's emotional state and Cap looking at the unity of the Avengers. It was nice to pick it up as a reminder of that reread.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #970085 04/21/19 02:12 PM
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Thanks for the heads-up, Thoth. Good to know one of my favorite Avengers runs is finally getting more respect and wider accessibility.


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #970853 05/11/19 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Sarcasm Kid
I have "The Last Avengers Story" Peter David wrote with Ariel Olivetti. I find it EXTREMELY hilarious Tommy Maximoff was the spellcaster and Billy was the sociopath.


Originally Posted by Ann Hebistand
Glad to hear you enjoyed that one. I had honestly forgotten about it. It's been so many years since the last time I read it, that I guess it just wasn't my thing. PAD is my favorite writer, but I do seem to recall finding Olivetti's art off-putting, so the latter may have been the main reason I didn't keep it. Hmmm...it was reprinted in the Avengers: First to Last trade, which my library does have in its catalog. Maybe I should give it another try. Thanks, Sarky.


Sorry to tell you, Sarky: I gave it another try. Still couldn't get into it. Better than PAD's Genis-Vell stories or his Wonder Man mini-series or his brief She-Hulk run, but still not good enough for my personal tastes.

You do make a good point about Tommy and Billy, though. Perhaps that last Young Avengers run (Gillen/McKelvie) wouldn't have been quite so awful if Allen Heinberg had followed PAD's lead?


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #982644 03/07/20 02:14 PM
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So I'll admit that the one superhero book I just haven't been able to let go of is Avengers.

Not because it's good -- Gods know, the recent "Rebirth of Starbrand" story was among the worst Avengers travesties ever published.

Has anyone read the follow-up issue, a solo showcase for Tony Stark? (Apparently, he's going evil again. *Groan.*) I've had it waiting in my pull for almost a month now, and I'm on the verge of just saying, "To hell with it," and giving up once and for all -- or at least until Jason Aaron leaves.

Not that Aaron's run has been a unilateral waste, no -- Black Panther as the team's sponsor was a long overdue development, there was a great three-way clash between the Avengers, Namor's forces, and the Soviet Super Soldiers, followed by an excellent all-talk "international conference" issue.

And yet, somehow, being reminded of how good Aaron *can be* sometimes just makes it even more frustrating to have to put up with all the filth just to get a few bits of gold.

Sigh. sigh


Still "Fickles" to my friends.
Re: The All Avengers Thread
Fanfic Lady #982650 03/07/20 05:33 PM
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Wanderer
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I just read it but I am probably not a great judge as I tend to somewhat enjoy most of what I read. Not very critical. (Actually that's a bit funny thinking back on some of what I have written in the past. Oh well we all have our delusions.)

I will say that the story is of Tony Stark's temptation rather than his turning evil and
he doesn't. In fact he shows a bit of the strength of character that can make some of the best Iron man stories.


Is it a good story? Yes in some ways no in others. Would you enjoy it? Really not sure. It's one of those that some people will say is a masterpiece of looking into Tony Stark's innermost musings and others would say is a piece of junk. More like Jason's work on Thor than his recent Avengers stuff. Maybe he does better with single characters than groups? This should really be in the Iron Man book because the end has the potential to have a major impact on his life and story. Lots of different ways it could go from here.

Did I like it? It was OK and somewhat interesting but not something I am going to go rave about. We will see if there is a decent payout. That could make it worthwhile.

Oh and yes I agree this is not my favourite run of the Avengers. Wild and crazy stories with a few clever ideas but not really grabbing me.

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