Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! Supergirl and the Legion of Super-Heroes #32 (Spoilers)

This issue rawks.

Calero's art is outstanding!

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First: The cover, in the tradition of this title, has almost nothing to do with the story inside. Thankfully in this case, because the characters in the story are more interesting than those on the cover.

Page One: Consequences -- Cosmic Boy's elimination of the Dominator World is being scrutinized. Beautiful opening page, exactly the kind of shout that a first page from a new creative team should make.

The story takes place primarily on Winath. Lots of back story about Winath, itself, plus more about Mekt. Mekt continues to be developed as one of the great characters of substance in this version of the Legion.

Star Boy, Sun Boy, and Mekt are on Winath with special prosecutor Kem. No one else is around -- including the parental Ranzzes.

Kem is looking for Cosmic Boy who can be traced, perhaps to Winath by the magnetic disturbances that always accompany him. here we go again -- an actual consequence of wielding great magnetic power. Mekt, Star Boy and Sun Boy were deployed to Winath by Brainiac 5.

The four wind up underground (where most Winathian society exists because of violent storms on the surface. An agricultural machine tagged with the name "Validus" is found. Mekt goes ballistic -- or electric -- lashing out against Kem, Sun Boy and Star Boy. Sun Boy shrugs off the attack with a line that suggests that there were character-building consequences to his time in the captivity with the Dominators.

Mekt and Sun Boy tangle -- and Star Boy, yes Star Boy! -- brings them down, literally.

There's more wrenching Mekt back story about Mekt and his return from Korbal with Lightning powers and his depression and isolation. Consequences of being twinless. As of this issue, Mekt has become my favorite Legion character.

Kem is lured into a grain storage vault and last seen "drowning' in a flood of grain -- shades of "Witness." An odd aside, the hooded character of the following page gave me sort of a Harrison Ford vibe before in had even looked at the previous pages.

Validus is the name of a supposed mythical Lord of Lightning about whom there is/was a cult of followers on Winath. In the last scene the elder Ranzzes appear to be attacking Mekt in the name of the Lord of Lightning.

Undoubtably my favorite issue of this series so far. Those who lament the lack of a Silver Age-y happy Legion will not be satisfied, but I couldn't be more delighted.

The best part of all is the story title at the end of the last page:

The Quest for Cosmic Boy
Lord of Lightning
Part 1 of 2

Part 1 of 2, not Part 1 of 12. It suggests that next month, this story will be ended. Wouldn't that be a nice feature, stories with an end.

I don't know what all Bedard and Calero have lined up after their Legion tour, but they will be on my pull list.

Tenzil's Legion of fans will love this and he hasn't even used his power.... Yet I can't wait till next issue.

Excellent effort by all involved. This is exactly what the Legion should be. A hot young artist knocking our socks off while making a name for himself. Interesting glimpses of 31st century that really feel like the future. A little bit of back story that clarifies instead of confuses. Some character development. A story that moves forward, contains some surprises and suspense, and makes you want to come back next month for more. Kudos on the colors, as well.

Hmmm. Maybe the 3boot can be saved after all?

To all, happy legion 32 day. thank you for the nice word ont he art. i mean, you are all allowed to hate it, but we did bust our collective butts to bring you the best issue we knew how to do. as i finish 34 and am officially over the half way hump on my arc, i'm already feeling a bit sad that within a few months, my creative time with you guys will be over, though of course as the books come out, i will still say hello and see what you guys think.

the positive and receptive attitude of the legion fans has been truly humbling and i know i speak for us all, from tony, me, mike and jeanine and nate, the amazing colorist (and our letterer) too, we appreciate it!

I enjoyed the background stuff in this issue. and the underground places, has a certain creepy atmosphere about it.

by the way, regarding Tenzil. does he get larger when eating or does his body break stuff down quickly? I am just thinking he's going to have to eat a lot of wheat and then the door to get out. that's a large "meal"

Traditionally, there's a super-speed aspect to Tenzil's power, which both allows him to eat at super-speed and rapidly metabolize extremely large amounts of "food" without gaining weight.

It's been awhile since a writer has really emphasized this aspect of his power, so it'll be cool if we really get to see him eat a huge quantity of stuff.

would it really be cool? hmmm.... heh heh

My review is up on Legion Abstract, and boy, do I have some kind words for Mr. Calero in it.

This was my favourite of the week. Seeing Star Boy face off against the hot head and the live wire was great- good to see him getting some spotlight. Even seeing Sun Boy fired up was good. I like the suspense Tony built up- bring on the Lightning Lord.

And the art... Dennis done good. I've been appreciating his stuff elsewhere, and seeing it with this particularly story really worked.

Just curious- are we going to get a Calero drawn group shot ever?

Matthew, Id love to read it. Can you post a link? Oh there it is!

CJ, thanks so much. I'm pushing for a group shot!

Wow! Now that was more what I want from the Legion. Great artwork from Calero. The characters seem to come alive. I haven't been this excited about reading a Legion title since DNA left.

Wonderfully weird and nightmarish. Mekt Ranzz, so brutal yet so heart-wrenchingly vulnerable, is a joy to read. You think Mekt is strange? You haven't met his parents and neighbors. This is Winath as we've never seen it before -- a world of ultramodern technology atop a culture of primitive superstition -- affording new and intriguing insights into Mekt's tortured soul. What an engrossing and multifacted character he is in the right hands.

Where Mekt is a cauldron of emotions, Tenzil is as cool as a cucumber until he walks into the Super-Silo of Death (too bad he removed his cool lie detector glasses before meeting those cute little homicidal kids). Can't wait for next month -- this may be Tenzil's biggest escape since chomping his way out of Nardo's Stalag!

But what the hell is Brainy up to intercepting urgent calls to Supergirl and ignoring pleas for backup? Star Boy (don't call him dumb after this issue) figures out that Brainy has set them all up to fail. It looks like the green kid is putting the Legionnaires through some sort of test. Am I reading too much into "Mayor Simzz"?

Kudos to Bedard, Calero and crew for delivering the goods and meeting my highest expectations. If you don't grab this issue you're missing something special.

Phooey on the dull-as-dishwater Lightning Saga Legion. *This* is the kind of Legion I want.

I really enjoyed the issue, Bedard's writing was great, I really started to like characters I haven't previously liked before like Mekt and Star Boy, and Tenzil, I can't wait to see more of them.

Also can anyone post what Mekt said to Tenzil about the lie detector glasses?

Also what Star boy said to Sun Boy and Mekt? after he increased their weight.

I laughed after reading the CBR's review of this issue. Boring? I think not. During the whole WAK run CBR were giving the book great ratings for every issue. I was often mystified what anyone got out of this book as most characters were carbon copies of one another.

Now I'm not going to knock the entire run, but there was a lot of decompressed storytelling during that time. IMO, a lot of the issues were boring and lacked any real sense of threat. The CBR reviewer also stated that this issue was not what we had come to expect from the WAK legion. I hope not!

Egads! a Washington DC poster with a suggestively-(un)dressed avatar. Quick someone call my attorney!

I agree, Ultrajo. By the time I got to page two, I was hooked.

i'm sorry, but I disagree... Still as mediocre as the previous issue.

And sorry Mister Calero, but I didn't really like your artwork. I admit though that the garish colors didn't help. Just hoping for a quick death of this incarnation of the Legion now

Love the cover. The background images looked great. (for those who haven't...the toon Legion comic has great art by Steve Uy this month!)

I think MLLASH is going to love Tenzil's look in this issue. (haven't read the other posts yet)

Dennis, kudos! Love the use of black! Love your Mekt. Also I think the way you told the story(panels, etc) was very fluid. The backgrounds and tech stuff looked great as well. Loved the page with the hooded man and candles! Dennis the only small knock I have is some of Star Boy's and Sun Boy's facial experssions toward the beggining of the book. I noticed their expressions looked much better later. But both Mekt's and Brainy's expressions looked awesome!

I liked the colors personally. For those guys not digging Dennis' art think of another Legion artist that was outside the box...Steve Lightle.

Story? Much better. Validus on the farm? Well it makes sense. He was a Ranzz before. Interesting twist to the mythos. Those were creepy kids! This is one of the best Legion stories I read in a while. Four heroes on a planet with wierd stuff happening. I like it.

I was thinking the title of the story ought to be 'Children of the Space-Corn'.

I loved the art overall, but there were a few inconsistent panels. Mekt's and Dirk's expressions in one panel (I think where Mekt is talking about the gelcubes) were really out there and didn't seem to fit the dialogue.

I'll have to reread the story to see what everyone's raving about. I thought it was the quickest read ever the first time around.

Why are Supergirl and Chameleon on the cover when they're not even in the story? Why are Garth, Ayla, and Rokk in the roll call when they're not in the story either? I don't mind the covers not matching up to the story so much, but you'd think they could at least get the cast right.

The covers seem to be an attempt to focus on three different members each issue. Rokk was there on the splash page flashback. Ayla and Garth had their origin told in the back story. I can see how you might think this may not merit a roll call inclusion, but it appears to be a conscious decision and a not one of the glaring mistakes that marked some previous issues.

I won't get the issue until Friday but these posts have me stoked. Tenzil's sunglasses as super-lie-detectors.... of space? I like, A LOT.

I already know the art is going to rawk.

Is it silly to clamor, sight unseen, for an extended BnC run?!?

My take:

I like Bedard's work so far. I am not real familiar with him but for some reason I like most of the recent stuff I have been reading from him. I can't quite but my finger on what exactly appeals to me about his work...but something does. Maybe it's intelligent dialogue or something.


I am a real big fan of Mark Waid...I am not however a real big fan of Mark Waid Legion Writer/Editor?Rebooter. For better or worse, I am always going ot associate him with the last 20 years of Legion misery for myself...as he was a part of virtually every post crisis incarnation of the Legion from 1989 on.

I already like Bedard better as a Legion writer. And sorry Mark, but if I never see you write the Legion again...it will be too soon....some times it's best to remain a fan? OTOH, I am extremely happy to see you back on the Flash..and have enjoyed everything else you've written at DC since the mid 90's.


Calero's artwok was dark and atmospheric...I liked it, and that's pretty good praise considering he's immediately following up Kitson who is right there with my favorite Legion Artist ever. Good luck Dennis, touch act to follow, but FWIW the artwork was eye catching.


As for the story...that's not ME Lad to me, it's not even the TMK ME Lad...which is probably my favorite. I am tired of reintriductions of characters I liked better originally...it's been the problem with the Legion for 20 years now.


I am definitely a fan of the Pre Crisis Legion and now that DC is showing signs of bringing that one back...this title is kind of lacklustre... And yes I know the Legion in the Lightning Saga is not exactly the same Legion as the original...but it's the closest thing to it we've seen since before the Pocket Universe story.


Anyway...I'm happy with the over all Legion explosion over the past year or so...got Legion on TV, Legion playing a major role in JSA JLA crossovers...Legion characters in countdown.

I'm very happy with this...I hope they keep this multiverse and it makes sense there would be multiple versions of the Legion in it....

Superboy, I agree about Waid. I like everything else he has written...except the Legion. I think he's just too much of a fan and his Legion vision is not something I care for. From his ZH days to his latest reboot. ugh.

Anyways, I agree there is something about Bedard I just like. Can't put a finger on it but it might be his dialogue/pacing? He sets things up nicely.

Dennis has a tough act to follow but he did pretty good I thought. It's only going to get better.

I'm all for a multiverse and a BnC run myself.

Liked this issue. It was nice to get Mekt's backstory. I liked how Sun boy really stepped up, Kem was great (LOVE the lie-detector shades). I am also looking forward to next month's issue, something I haven't done with the Legion for awhile (well, unless it was in a 'hope springs eternal' manner in hoping that the series would eventually pick up the pace).

The art was good, fit the mood of the story well (creepy Winath). However, I hope that, unless the other stories also deal with creepy stuff, the art will lighten up a bit. I also agree that some of the facial expressions were off, and in some panels Star Boy and Sun Boy looked like adults. However, there were some beautiful shots and some great Mekt and Kem panels, so I'm pretty happy artwise.

But yeah, I like the idea of doing two-issue stories for each of the teams, it seems like WaK tried to juggle too many things and ended up dropping the ball in some parts. This focus on small number of characters is nice, however, I just wish the team was three Legionnaires and not one Legionnaire, one ex-Legionnaire and one bad guy.

Oh, and no Supergirl in this issue (except in a background panel shot) that made me very, very, very happy.

No Supergirl? Gee, I might even buy two copies now

Another big thumbs-up on the art for me. I enjoyed this issue quite a bit even though I keep hoping Mekt will go far, far away.

Can't wait to see Tenzil eat his way through all that grain, sending the economy of Winath into a tailspin.

I thought Dennis' art was a good match for the content of the issue. The noirish look with all the deep shadows fit the mood perfectly. I wonder if TB was purposely writing to his artist's strengths. Given Dennis' published work I'd say that was the case.

I liked the artwork a lot. It has a 5-year gap vibe to it. Something else else needed to happen to make this book interesting again and drastically changing the art and reducing the numbers of Legionnaires per issue seems like a good way to go. Although I hope there is a good reason that Mekt is so involved in this storyline... like maybe his hair will go white at some point.

This I liked. Like others have said, the art was a perfect match for the story. I loved the more adult feel to both. Maybe it is because we are finally getting a story that is moving along or maybe its the fact it focuses on my favorite family. But it doesn't matter. This is finally taking v5 in a direction I can enjoy.

Did anyone else think that Tenzil looked like Val Kilmer in a couple of panels? Just an observation.

Ah, in other words, did Nardo's raygun make Tenzil super-fat, or did it merely bust the holographic projector he used to disguise the unintended consequence of using his super-power?

Logically, if he metabolizes his food at super-speed, does that mean that he also poops at super-speed? Is that why Tenzil always disappears immediately after a fight?

Hey, I'm just askin'.

Nice first parter. Felt "legionie" though a bit jarring since I read it immediately after reading the Lightning Saga.

If you really want to know, my guess is that Bismollians don't poop.

As good a guess as any. But if they didn't and metabolize all waste to thiol and nitrogen gases, Imagine Tenzil's breath. Or the smell of the pores in their skin.

According to one pseudo-explanation we get of their powers in the comics, it sounds like they convert nearly everything into energy, and the excess energy radiates from their body. Which probably means hanging out with Tenzil causes cancer...

Thank you! It was driving me nuts trying to figure out who he was reminding me of.

Have I missed anyone discussing the fact that both Sun Boy and Mekt have flight rings?!?

I thought Sun Boy's is now Timber Wolf's and I can't imagine them being able to produce more given the present circumstances, nor giving one to Mekt irregardless.

Otherwise, this issue was great. Nice, interesting story and pleasant, professional looking art.

I've come to the point where I really have to struggle to put aside almost everything that Mr. Waid has built into this version of the legion. Thankfully, this issue made that struggle seem worthwhile. Tenzil did much to deflect the sense of vapidity I got from him last issue. He was really the highlight of the issue for me since hearing anything about Mekt just made me recall why he's there, which made me recall "that" story. I really savored the quick build-up to something being amiss and the hint that it will be resolved by next issue. It felt like a comic book with a story included--something that I have not experienced enough of with the legion lately.

Didn't they say something last issue about Dirk and Mekt having flight rings for the duration of the mission?

I must have missed that part. But, then who is flightless for this mission. Doesn't seem fair.

Mekt on the next to last page of last issue: "I'm more curious why he [Brainy] risked lending Sun Boy and me flight rings when we haven't accepted Supergirl's enlistment pitch yet..."

Lyle was still out of action, when Brin was drafted into a squad, wasn't he?

Of course, Lyle's ring blew up as well, so they may be short that one anyway.

This was an enjoyable issue. We finally get an interesting, well written story that showcases just a couple of characters and provides background info on a few more. Starboy is finally portrayed as a real person instead of just background dressing. It really feels as if this story is actually going somewhere!

Dennis' artwork, while very different from Barry's (whom I consider among the alltime great Legion artists), is terrific and really fit the mood of this story. Although there are a couple of poorly drawn faces early on, I thought it was a great effort. (Tenzil in particular was great throughout)

And I really loved the concept of Validus as a mythical figure. Can't wait until Winath finds out that they are myth-taken!

Loved the stylized Validus face used the symbolize the "Lord of Lightning".

i actually enjoyed this ish. the first in a VERY very long time. There was a forboding creepiness and we got some actual character development of Mekt and Star Boy. i could live with this version of LSH if we get some solid characterization and stories that have a beginning/middle/end.
Calero's artwork and the colors were a nice change. i appreciated that the artist drew 'real' faces not just comic book faces. although it looked too often that he used the same face model for ALL the main characters. i liked the 2 creepy kids that locked Tenzil in the silo. would have been better if they were identical twins. Bothered me that planet Winath gets yet another revision. This time it's an agricultural planet that is plagued by lightning storms. ugh. makes as much sense as the DnA version that had giant tree canopies blocking out the sunlight, and robot cows.
is tenzil an underager attorney?

Bedard sets up a lot of mysteries for us: -why is Brainiac 5 setting up the legion? -who is attacking all the different legion teams? -who is behind the cult of Validus graffiti and the mind control on Winath? (Fatal 5 would be cool as would Saturn Queen & Cosmic King, but i doubt it.) why is there a signature Cos' Electro-Magnetic trail on Winath? did Brainy plant it there? did the Knights of Templar visit there?
i hope there are satisfactory answers in the next few months, and these plotlines are tied up for a change.

Yes! -- and a little like Dennis Calero in a couple of panels

Just because Star Boy says he is, doesn't mean that he is.

I think they're all unrelated.

I bet there isn't. I think the electromagnetic trail has nothing to do with Cosmic Boy but is a product of whatever shenanigans the Validus Cult is up to with their lightning. Although I suppose it's possible that there's a Braalian mixed up with the cult.

Maybe it's the speed force.

Star Boy isn't the only one. Last issue, Mekt and Garth came to the same conclusion, independently.

Brainy may be in charge of casting and staging it all, but I believe the original impetus came from Dream Girl:

"I'm just here to forewarn you. The Legion has reached a turning point. Something else else big is unfolding and I thought you might want some advice from your favorite precog." (S/LSH #31, p. 6)

Thanks to Nura, Brainy knows something about the future we (and the other Legionnaires) don't know. Moreover, it's hard *not* to read those lines as a meta-textual reference to the present state of Legion universe.

I am looking forward to reading this, maybe this weekend.

I actually like the idea of Winath as a stormy agricultural planet. It's like "what if an entire planet were like Kansas?" There's a nice resonance with Superman's childhood. There's the sense of unending boredom that kids want to escape from. There's also the lightning connection that suggests the Ranzz kids were not just randomly able to turn in to human energizers.

Also (and this is the COOLEST thing!) I've recently learned that lightning is nature's fertilizer! All living things need nitrogen (to build proteins, among other things), but nitrogen, which is 70% of the earth's atmosphere, is chemically not very reactive. It likes to hang out with itself in its N2 molecules.

Lightning's terrific energy cracks apart the N2 molecules, allowing nitrogen to combine with other stuff in the air (I'm guessing oxygen) and precipitate out with the rain. In the ground, it combines with other stuff to make the nitrogen compounds that fertilize plants. That's why it's no illusion that your lawn is a LOT greener after a thunderstorm! Cool, huh?

So, a very stormy planet would also be an incredibly fertile planet--the breadbasket of the galaxy.

Yes, but that's different from 'setting them up'. Brainy might not tell the field teams everything, but he's not going to betray them. (Except possibly Mekt.)

First, a well deserved "Boo" for the pun.

Second, we're not going to find out that Validus is Mekt's Dad who is Validus' father (or Uncle) are we because I'm not sure I can handle that. Heh!

How cool would it be to find a Superboy/man on Winath. I'm suprised Clark doesn't have a summer home there.

No betrayal implied in my use of "setting them up" but I don't think Brainy's actions are strictly benevolent, either. He's preparing them (and possibly us) for ... something. Change, I suppose -- inevitable and necessary but not always gentle. Certain characters may need to grow stronger to meet the unknown challenge (Star Boy), but some may have to accept a much harsher fate in order to fulfill the roles they're meant to play (Mekt, Brin?).

Validus is his father, his uncle, his nephew AND his long-lost twin brother.

Next day impressions:

Ayla's new pose on the roll call page may say a lot about the new art style.

"Unlax?" Has that been used in the threeboot before? If not, I don't mean to detract from its use (future-slang is always a hoot--cool up), but wouldn't it be the opposite of "relax?"

That Tenzil happens to be along with the team that is most likely to spend panel after panel bickering with each other (in typical threeboot fashion) makes me appreciate the plotting all the more.

ooh,

good add.

Wait till Validus gets a hold of some profem then gets cheated on! You think there's power in that lightinng now!

And..who is Star Boy?
I never know..if he's Thom Kallor or James Cullem....
I need soon his name!

What's with all the cross-eyed and painful expressions? There's a whole lotta need more Lotus Fruit BAD look going on. Then there's the case of Mekt's mysteriously disappearing-then-reappearing (and rather dark for a redhead) stubble. Not to mention the fact that M. looks like William H. Macy on page 7-ish. (Mr. Macy is already engaged for another role. )

On the plus side, Tenz looks good, and I appreciate that the clothing was drawn realistically (wrinkles!).

Unlax was used last issue by Unnamed Dude on Lallor.

Star Boy is Thom of Xanthu.

PS: Maybe now Sun Boy will appreciate his merely hippie, not homicidal parents a little more. An AfterSchool-A-Tron Special...of Space!

Ma and Pa Ranzz make Lon Norg look like Ward Cleaver.

I did NOT much like this issue. Calero's art, which fit X-Factor so well, didn't do it for me here. The story didn't quite ring my bell, either.

I'm a lonnnnnng way from being displeased with the series, though.

I really liked this issue. it made up for a lot of the bumpy transition last time.

One huge continuity problem though, is that this spins the current Legion even farther from the version in Brave and the Bold, since Validus (and the rest of the Fatal Five) are supposed to be in custody. Star Boy should at least have recognised the name.

Further reason to just throw B&B out the window.

Yesterday was spent recovering from a stag night and reading the last year and a halfs worth of comics at Numfs, I'll save my opinions of most of them for another time but as I'd picked up 32 on Friday here's my views -

Nice enough art, very moody.

Story was a filler. Took under five minutes to read and while it was nice to have a bit about Mekt overall IMHO it could have been done in six pages.

Not too impressed.

FABOO art! Mr. Calero, your free dinner is waiting.

lil rhino, i will take you up on it!

This issue was a very nice improvement to the "stuff" we have been getting lately! With all of the Legion appearences in JLA/JSA and the upcoming Action Comics in October, the "future" for the Legion (especially for us veteran fans) is looking bright!!!

I enjoyed this issue a lot! Especially the art work. This is what I have been requesting for a long time - a focused story featuring a handful of Legionnaires. This has been the best issue of the 32 issue run so far. I am looking forward to the next Legion issue for the first time in two years.

Flight Ring Count:
Lyle lost his.
Cosmic Boy gave up his.
Mekt acquired one.
Dream Girl's went to Supergirl.
Assuming all other active Legionnaires have one (including Dream Boy, and ignoring Brainy's loss in B&B #5), we're one short unless Brainy came up with a new one. Otherwise, someone did let Mekt borrow theirs and Cosmic Boy remains without his.

Just got it today and while the art and the story isn't as bad as the last issue I still thought it was pretty disposable rubbish. The story just doesn't interest me and has wierd plotting in points (all the stuff about Supergirl being busy but not even giving us a clue what was going on) and the rest of it was oddly unengaging.

As for the art... I dunno, it was art that was trying hard to be JG Jones or something and didn't quite manage it. There's some nice stuff in there like the pages of Tenzil being tricked and trapped but then there's some awful ugly stuff too like the fight between Star Boy, Mekt and Sun Boy. It's visually confusing and muddy and not very nice. The worst thing though is on page 10. Mekt looks OK. He's looking grim and upset, which is fine. Thom and Tenzil are alright, even if Thom looks a little constipated. But what on earth is going on with Sun Boy? He's cross eyed and he looks like he's either about to be violently sick or as if someone has unexpectedly stuck a stick up his bum. Even if there's a line that's been cut and he's meant to be shouting it still doesn't explain the wierd crossed eyes. It's just the most obvious sign that the art isn't as good as it would like to be.

It's overall a very disappointing issue. The Legion of late has been horribly underwhelming. I actually really liked what Waid was doing with the title. I was skepitcal that the DnA Legion needed to be replaced at all but grew to like the WaK Legion. Since they've been gone from the title it just feels like filler that doesn't have much of a point and art that is OK but nothing special because it's just biding time before DC work out what they're planning on doing with the characters. It's a shame because I really want to enjoy the title but I'm not at the moment. I don't care about the version of the Legion running around in JLA and JSA, I'm starting not to care about the WaK Legion and would be happier if we could have DnA back. Let's hope the next few issues draw me back in again.

Perhaps Sun Boy is leting out a mighty yawn because he senses Mekt is about to go on about his past.

He's thinking "If I have to hear the Ranzz lightning origin ONE MORE TIME I'm going to hurl!" which is pretty much how I feel.


That facial expression was by far the worst of the art this issue. Otherwise, I liked most of it. Mekt's expression in the same panel also seemed inappropriate to the conversation, but not as glarlingly as Dirk's.

in defense of the artist, i believe Sun Boy is making an exagerrated gross face because he is grossed out by mekt's description of processing the grain into gel-cubes.

" posted July 27, 2007 06:41 AM
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quote:
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Originally posted by Lightning Lad:


Did anyone else think that Tenzil looked like Val Kilmer in a couple of panels? Just an observation.
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Yes! -- and a little like Dennis Calero in a couple of panels "

Sorry guys, not guilty! While I have been known to use myself as the model for some characters (cheapest model I know) that, in fact, is a wonderful actor I met named Joey Duke. You can find him on MySpace. And what he really looks like is Matt Damon and often gets jobs based on that.

"It's just the most obvious sign that the art isn't as good as it would like to be."

Now, I have no problem with anyone not liking my work. I'm not saying I don't CARE or that I wouldn't want as many people as possible to be pleased, but its a reality. If anything, I would rather be one of those artists with a small but very loyal following. I want my work to be idiosyncratic and frankly, not for everyone because if I tried to make it for everyone, it would just end up being mediocre gruel which is what we have too much of these days in all areas of life.

That being said, I hardly think it's fair to hold up one failed expression as evidence of a work's complete failure. As I do say "failed" because while most people do seem to get what's going on, many don't.

What is happening is that Sun Boy is reacting to Mekt's general attiude and snottiness. Enough people don't get it for me to consider that moment a failure, but my attitude is that I'd rather experiment and try different things and occasionally fall flat on my face than to never try and do something different. Guys, most comic artists don't make all THAT much money and when you do a book in 4 weeks, not everything is going to be perfect. There, I said it.

Every artist I adore from Adams to Steranko tried things and some of them, as much as we revere them now, did not work,and others were simply not accepted at the time. Time will tell.

But again, all that being said, if you liked the work at all, one expression that was a little off probably wouldn't have bothered you.

It seems clear to me that you're just not into it, period. And that's fine. But you have to see also that if I were to walk away, saying to myself "well, gee, if I had nailed that face a bit more he probably would have liked the whole book" does me a disservice and wouldn't help me become a better artist.

I'm not trying to define what your experience is. Obviusly what Mark and Barry did, for a lot of people, is seminal work and clearly different than what we're doing.

I can say there was a deliberate decision to take these 5 issues and use them to try something different and without patting myself or us as a team on the back (not saying that we're succeeding!) I think that's a laudible goal in and of itself, especially when you consider than when all is said and done, its only five issues.

What does bug me, and I'm not saying anyone HERE is doing it (in fact, it is clear that Legion fans are open minded and good people), is that there does seem to be a segment of fandom, heck a segment of people, that just don't react well to any change, even if its temporary. It's the McDonald'sization of America, everything the same, all the time, anywhere. And it really sucks.

Many of us seem to go through life thinking that anything good has to be "gotten" immediately. Well, very few people liked coffee or wine the first time they tried it. Very few people probably like Opera the first time. Some things you have to stretch and grow to appreciate.

Now whether what we're doing falls under that category, obviously I have an opinion on that. I don't believe anyone here thinks I actually TRY to do bad comics. I do my very best.

But there's also this:

Not every issue (or arc) of every book has to be the ULTIMATE (no pun intended) version of that book. Does every Batman issue ever have to be dark and forboding? Shall we never see a FUNNY Batman story? That's silly, of course.

There is such a thing as saying "well, this isn't really for me, but let me really give it a shot and enjoy it for what it is."


So, critique, ask questions, by all means take nothing for granted. But if you find the crux of your argument is that it's "different", try and remember that for some of us, "different" is not an insult but a goal.

oh wait, make no mistake, that's us too! We just relish our inability to accept change (without a fight). We don't see it as a bad thing, to not accept change. In fact, we hold a yearly competition on who can not accept change the most.

These three-booters think they're all that but see them get all defensive when the smart crowd gets hopeful for a return to the "original" legion. See, that reaction by the three-booters is an inability to accept change, even when it's change to what was before. We will educate them to accept their unwillingness to change, embrace it, and start a talk show about it.

Viva la antécédent!

relish with us, resistance to change!!!

Oh and, if someone hadn't "caught" that off expression and mentioned it, you'd have lost respect for us. You'd be saying to yourself, "heh, got THAT one by them, those losers."

But see, it just goes to show, we're paying attention!

Oh and since that scene has been brought up, hopefully you consider it worthwhile to discuss why that scene did or didn't work as well as intended.


Dennis, armed with your input that the expression was meant to represent Sun Boy's response to Mekt's general snottiness, I went back and read the page. My first thought was that it didn't work because Mekt isn't getting snotting until the following panel. Then I backed up a page and saw that Mekt was getting snotting the panel previous but that happened to be two pages of ads ago. Eh, sometimes that's enough to throw off the continuity of a story, particularly on first read. That's why we have these message boards, to disect and critique and point out things other readers might have missed. It adds to the total experience so even though some of the quickly written message board comments come off, eh, stupid, as a group, we get there.


Now about that cover. I think you drew Supergirl's bra size one size too small. Just something else comic book message boarders are expert at.

heh, someone took us seriously. Has that ever happened before?

Nothing would please me more than if you guys were to try to do as much different stuff with the Legion as possible. For too long, the Legion franchise has been plagued with the notion that the way to do it right is to go back to what everybody loved about them in 1966, and I don't care if I never pick up another comic book like that. Quality is the most important thing, of course, but good-different is a lot better than good-same, and I'll take bad-different over bad-same too.

Dennis, I haven't made it to the CBS yet, maybe THIS weekend, but I look forward to seeing your work! And you are a scholar and a gentleman for participating so wholeheartedly in our humble forum of change-averse continuity-nit-pickin' shut-ins.

<Yes, I'm kissing a$$ with the new creative team. Can't hurt, right?>

I'm old enough to remember when Jim Sherman started drawing the Legion in the 1970s, after Cockrum and Grell had established a new visual vocabulary for the Legion. My first reaction was "ewww," but it quickly grew on me. Good art, good interpretation are what matter.

"But see, it just goes to show, we're paying attention!

Oh and since that scene has been brought up, hopefully you consider it worthwhile to discuss why that scene did or didn't work as well as intended."

You know, I totally hadn't considered the ads. Looking back over it,with that in mind, I have to say in my own defense, it works BETTER than I think it's given credit for. In retrospect, sticking out the tongue more or even making un Boy give Mekt the ol' antler ears may have been more effective. Joe Quesada used to tell me that sometimes...just sometimes...you have to hit people over the head.

"hitting people over the head"

I'm a teacher and it's the same. A spur of the moment decision. Don't want to talk below the students but want them to get the picture. A 90% is a good grade but who wants an airplane that stays in the air 90% of the time? The way towards perfection is reflection and that's all that's going on. It must seem unfair, generally unskilled artists/writers commenting on the work of professionals. That's what I tell my students anyhow, when they complain. Lol.


Poorly played IMO.

Serial comics have always been plauged by the duel between the need to have the story end where it begins and the need to change in order to stay fresh and connect to current audiences. Now add to the mix that comic book fans are reading comics into their thirties, forties and now fifties, while relatively few new readers are coming on board and you have a recipe for wat is, in my opinion, comics main ailment right now: the tension between fan's maturing and immature tastes.

Well that is why we have Vertigo.

And I agree about hitting people over the head. I like to get hit on the head.

LOL! That's exactly how I feel too! Why does THAT origin need to be retold ad nauseum yet nearly all the others are lucky if they get told even once per 'boot!

Mr Calero - I dropped this book long before you came on board so I haven't had the chance to check out any of your work unfortunately - but I wanted to say 'Thanks very much' for coming and engaging with us Legion fans.

And thanks also for the enlightening posts. It's very easy sometimes for comic fans to forget that most artists are putting their all into making their books the best they can be. And we should be respectful of that effort even if it's not to our tastes.