quote:Originally posted by Querl Dox: the first DC panel, Countdown, is live right now and already some talks about the legion!
quote:Next question was about the various Legion continuities apparently running around currently - both in the Supergirl and the Legion of Super-Heroes title and the one in the "Lightning Saga" storyline. Marts said that some answers should be coming soon, and DiDio reminded the panel (and audience) that next year is the 50th anniversary of the Legion
I wonder if I should take at least some credit for the 50th anniversary announcement since I first brought it up to DiDio at Heroes' Con.
posted
Even though there's a lot of "just nice talk" at this panel, there was some information as well. Okay.
Very interesting thread. What it made me thinking about was: Which version of the Legion will come out "winner" of the next year "Main Legion event"?
I hardly doubt it will be the current WaK version. Even though Waid remembered after some 20 issues that telling an actual STORY might be a good idea, the current continuity somehow leaves me cold. Some people still say they love it cause it's the version that brought them to the Legion - I can very well respect that - for me, it's like "Yeah, it's kind of interesting but, well, where is the Legion Lore?". And every time they come up with some classic legion elements like recently Validus, you instantaniously start comparing it to the old stuff and there's just no chance: The new stuff looses.
What I read with pleasure is that the Lightning Saga Legion will be about fighting xenophobia and seperatism. Those are important topics which are always stuff for good stories - hey, even the Reboot Legion was telling a good xenophobia story with "White Triangle" (the single good storyline after ZH / before DnA) - so this could be a much more decent start than "underagers against adults" which still leaves a big question mark about my head (what was Waid smoking those days???).
But which version will survive? I doubt there will be more than one ongoing book. There might be an experiment with a Classified title telling new stories from old continuities - but I doubt it. There will be just one title after the smoke clears.
And the only reason that "Lightning saga" has happened is that those oldtimers will return. Everything else does make no sense. They will return in a major storyline/crossover/mini-series whatever - and there will be a new #1 again. And the Threeboot will not be erased - I'm pretty sure of that as well - but be written into a parallel universe so that you can, from time to time, return to these characters as well.
Considering the fact that time is healing all wounds, the demand for the Threeboot characters will vanish over the years until most people remember them only as a failed Mark Waid experiment...
BTW, I don't know if this will save the Legion either. I concur with those people writing they are fed up with paying 3$ for a book they only need five minutes to read. Especially when you have to be angry about the art as well like with #31. I kind of liked the art in #32, much better, but still I don't know if this is worth 3$... so comics as a whole will be becoming a rarity because they just don't work for most youngsters (too expensive). It's a sad story.
From: Bamberg, Germany | Registered: Feb 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Chemical King: What I read with pleasure is that the Lightning Saga Legion will be about fighting xenophobia and seperatism.
and this will work because the Lightning Saga legion is such a diverse representation?
This didn't work the first time they tried it. Won't work the second if they persist in this racist allegory. The vibe I get from this board anyhow, is that there are certain aspects of human behavior we'd like to pretend have been resolved in the 31st century.
I think they'd have much better fortune with this theme if they take the "first contact" approach, cultural misunderstandings and all that as opposed to the "bigots-R-us" approach. It's just easier to place oneself in the hero role of a "first contact" and in the victim role of a racist theme. Both can evoke emotion but only the former seems uplifting and gives the reader something to puzzle out.
Picking the "racist" is problematic because it generally shows the bigotry of the writer. Either it's the rich or uneducated white guy because they are acceptable as bigots for some reason or the writer tries to show their cleverness by placing the gay black guy in the racist role and it's obvious to all. This approach to xenophobia seems a no win situation to me.
From: East Toledo | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Chemical King: When was the first time they tried it?
After zero-hour, I think it was Waid's run beginning with the recruitment of members and the White Triangle story line, which wasn't bad (much) but then the idea kind of died on the vine. Even the anti-durlan thing got a bit old for me. They resolved that one, somewhat.
From: East Toledo | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
Just piping in to say that the 'White Triangle' storyline of the reboot was one of the best storylines in the Legion's history!
I'd die to see writing of that quality on this book again.
(And yes I do see the irony of the writer of that book being the same one who drove the quality of this one into the ground.)
From: Australia | Registered: Dec 2003
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I agree with you that White Triangle was a very good story back then. I have to confess that in my eyes, it's the ONLY post-Zero Hour storyline that even deserved the word "storyline" till DnA came on board. I thought it was quite tragic seeing Tinya die again after what Jo and her were through in 5YL.
Unfortunately, her death was undone later on so the relevance of the whole storyline was diminished. But I digress.
I can't remember any other Post-ZH storyline that had the same impact on me that White Triangle had - so I really think racism can work as a plot element, no matter if the writer is white, black or green: It is something that has always existed, still does exist and probably will always be existing - no matter how much we wish the future to be a better place. People will stay human beings in the first place - afraid of everything and everyone different.
From: Bamberg, Germany | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
Which might have more to do with the quality of the post zh storylines than with the quality of White Triangle but that's a cheap shot I suppose.
Having racism as a storyline and having racism as a theme are a bit different approache IMO. I can't see it as getting anything but repetitious.
Even White Triangle covered no new ground, in fact it took the oldest road as I recall. The story didn't in any case that I can recall, attempt to cause a reader to reflect on how they develop their personal perceptions. The one small incorporation of a different reason was Gand's, she found different things "ickey." Please, that's lame. Puppies would be a dead species if that were the deeper cause of racism.
I can't see anyone having read that story, coming to a better understanding or desire to investigate how they develop their personal opinions and perspectives regards new experiences. The reader was simply told, "Racism bad, diversity good, hulk smash."
"First Contact" stories however are very good at giving the reader opportunity to reflect and can also incorporate aspects of "difference" and prejudice without being repetitious.
It might make a good thread, having a group reread of the White Triangle arc to get personal perspectives.
From: East Toledo | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
I don't know about you Blockade Boy but I don't read Legion comics to reflect on how I develop my personal perceptions or to learn how to come to a better understanding or desire to investigate how I develop my personal opinions and perspectives as regards new experiences.
If that happens, great, but all I really want out of a Legion comic is a fun, exciting story as told through characters I enjoy reading about. And on that level the 'White Triangle' storyline very much delivered for me.
Chemical King - I would argue that the 'President Chu-sting' storyline which took up the bulk of the second year of the Reboot was equally as successful as the first year's 'White Triangle' tale, and acted as a great couterpoint to it, ending as it did on an uplifting, triumphant note in comparison to the more sombre, mournful conclusion of the first arc.
Blockade Boy - I think that's a great idea about getting a sort of Legion Book Club going. We could all go back and re-read a certain issue or storyline and then discuss it in a thread devoted to that tale. It will be really interesting to see if any opinions have changed now that time's passed and a bit of emotional detachment may've occurred.
From: Australia | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
Blockade Boy - I think that's a great idea about getting a sort of Legion Book Club going. We could all go back and re-read a certain issue or storyline and then discuss it in a thread devoted to that tale. It will be really interesting to see if any opinions have changed now that time's passed and a bit of emotional detachment may've occurred.
Well, Blacula, that's what these recent threads are about:
They hit virtually every era of the Legion's past. But if you don't see your favorite stories here, feel free to start your own review threads.
-------------------- The Semi-Great Gildersleeve - writing, super-heroes, and this 'n' that
From: The Stasis Zone | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
^^^ Heh - I thought something like that must've already been done around here HWW!
In my head I was thinking of something a little different though, where we all (or whoever wants to get involved) literally arrange to read a certain story and then post about it while it's still fresh in our minds in more of a kind've informal discussion format. A bit like a Book Club I guess.
I've always read those excellent threads you linked to as more really informative, inciteful, thought-provoking 'case-studies' than 'discussions'.
But then that's probably because I've never actually read a lot of the stories those threads cover (Magic Wars, Legion Conspiracy, Post-Conspiracy Era, Legend of Valor or Adv. 328) so I was approaching them more as a 'learner' rather than one who could freely discuss the topics therein.
I guess the moral of this post is - I need to catch up on my Legion reading!
From: Australia | Registered: Dec 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Blacula: I've always read those excellent threads you linked to as more really informative, inciteful, thought-provoking 'case-studies' than 'discussions'.
Thanks for the compliment, but I don't see much difference between what you are proposing and what's been done on these threads. People who want to re-read the stories before commenting on them certainly have that option (and, in fact, it's an excellent idea. I've been doing the same thing before commenting on Lash's "Let's Talk Tom & Mary" thread).
But I certainly understand what you mean about not having read most of these stories. That's why you should start your own review/Book Club threads: the more the merrier.
(And, just to state the obvious: no one needs to follow my lead in how to go about reviewing/analyzing/dissecting the stories. Do it in a manner that suits you.)
[ August 05, 2007, 12:47 AM: Message edited by: He Who Wanders ]
-------------------- The Semi-Great Gildersleeve - writing, super-heroes, and this 'n' that
From: The Stasis Zone | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Blacula: In my head I was thinking of something a little different though, where we all (or whoever wants to get involved) literally arrange to read a certain story and then post about it while it's still fresh in our minds in more of a kind've informal discussion format. A bit like a Book Club I guess.
That sounds fun. Those other threads are great, but generally it's one person reading a back issue then posting their thoughts for comment. I found generally, before I could get out my old issue, read and comment, the thread starter has moved on to the next issue. In order to participate I was left to comment based upon memory instead of shared experience.
Prearranging as you say, in a book club, would allow us to comment as if the issue came out this month and we were reading it at the same time, with the benefit that some members familiar with what is to come can maybe point out how a scene is maybe made more significant later on.
Probably one of the great examples of this, is the introduction of Validus with his "power" refered to "mental lightning." Here is something a reader built upon in a letter column and then ultimately became legend through events in the GDSaga and the circle completed in a couple annuals.
Book Club, cool idea. Now, who's going to start the forum and be Book Master? LoL
From: East Toledo | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Blockade Boy: [QUOTE]That sounds fun. Those other threads are great, but generally it's one person reading a back issue then posting their thoughts for comment. I found generally, before I could get out my old issue, read and comment, the thread starter has moved on to the next issue. In order to participate I was left to comment based upon memory instead of shared experience.
This comment baffles me, Blockade Boy, as I always waited until traffic in one thread had died down a little before posting the next one.
Also, the presence of multiple review threads did not mean that posters had to abandon one thread and go onto the next, or that they had to hurry in posting comments. As recent board activity has shown, there's no time limit in posting comments on any thread.
I truly intended for each thread to be a forum for discussion on the particular stories for ANYONE who wants to participate at ANY time. If you felt left out, I apologize.
-------------------- The Semi-Great Gildersleeve - writing, super-heroes, and this 'n' that
From: The Stasis Zone | Registered: Jul 2003
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